Trump says US cannot give every person it wants to deport a trial

[CrakHoBarbie]

"[Kilmar Abrego Garcia] is not coming back to our country." - Attorney General Pam Bondi

The entire judicial system from the Supreme Court down disagrees with her.

 

[ColdHardTruth]

No, it is not. There are no constitutional protections for aliens who are not under the jurisdiction of the U.S. People keep saying that, but it's just not true.

Yes, it is. It always has been. You are again shitting on the oath you took when you joined the Navy.

The issue is deportation. People want the man returned "home" to the U.S..

The problem is his "home" is not the U.S. - his home is El Salvador - where he is being incarcerated.

He was removed illegally. You seem to forget that. He was not supposed to be deported. His rights were egregiously violated.

Dumpytits was told to bring him back, BY THE SCOTUS, and has not complied.

 

[reflechissez]

FALSE.

That's a myth spread by people who are ignorant of the law, and whom the constitution applies to. The constitution protects only those who are born in the U.S., naturalized citizens, and those who have permanent residence status (a visa of some sort).

Good god, how do you people stay so ill-informed?

 

[SavannahMann]

So what "due process" were they not afforded? In this case, due process means they made a legal determination they are here illegally.

That's all due process needs to be. It need not be a court trial.

Okay. Show me the Judges signed order. Due Process is not what some cop says. It is what a Judge says.

 

[ColdHardTruth]

The entire judicial system from the Supreme Court down disagrees with her.

Bondi is a corrupt pile of shit from Flor-I-Duh. Once Dump's ass is out of office, she will be sitting in a cell for the rest of hers.

The time will come when Dump turns on her just like he does with all his minions. Either way, her career is over.

 

[j brown's body]

Trump says US cannot give every person it wants to deport a trial​

(Reuters) - U.S. President Donald Trump on Monday said on Truth Social that his administration cannot give everyone it wants to deport a trial "because to do so would take, without exaggeration, 200 years"

In the post, Trump wrote about removing criminals and those illegally in the United States.
===========
First, there is a difference between deportation -- the removal of a person to their home country, and; renditioning someone to a foreign jail.

Second, I believe administrative deportation judges handle deportations, and have been doing so. If we need more of them, hire them. If an administration wants to send people (aliens or American citizens) to a foreign jail, the accused ARE entitled to a trail in court, as per the constitution and the recent Supreme Court ruling.

Hmmm...

Trump administration fires immigration judges amid court case backlog

There is a backlog of more than 3.7 million cases in the immigration courts.

spectrumlocalnews.com

 

[W_Heisenberg]

OK. So, for example, Sven has been in the US for 3 years. He came on a tourist visa but just decided to stay and nobody came to look for him. One day, as he was hanging out on the couch with his buddies playing Call of Duty the police bust in the door and detain everyone as suspects in a drug and human smuggling operation. The cop find 4kg of fentanyl, 16 firearms (4 of which have the serial numbers scratched off), 3 twelve year old girls chained in the basement and a severed hand stashed in the closet. Sven claims to not have any idea who any of the people in the house were and says he's claiming asylum from wherever he's from because he's scared that he'll be prosecuted if he's sent back. The people he was hanging out with were all known members of an international terrorism organization designated as "Alien Enemies" of the US and Sven was found wearing clothing associated with that organization. Furthermore, a third party source, when queried on the matter, relates that he knows Sven to be a member of a different clique in that terrorist organization. Sven is first sent to an immigration court where his asylum claim is denied. He appeals that decision and the claim is denied again.

Based on that scenario, is the US required to charge Sven with a crime, provide him with counsel, allow him to appeal any decision the court makes and extend his residency for the 30-50 years that the appeal process might take or can they just deport him back to his home country and let them deal with him?

The government does not have to charge Sven with a crime before deporting Sven. The government can decide to deport him immediately. However, even if the government deems it necessary to deport Sven, Sven is still entitled to notice, access to counsel (but government does not have to pay), and opportunity to be heard (a hearing before an immigration judge).

If Sven is determined to be a terrorist, the government can deport him as above, but the same procedures must be used. Sven is still entitled to notice, access to counsel, and opportunity to be heard.

If Sven is determined to not be a citizen of the U.S. during wartime, and is a national of the government we are at war with, and the President invokes the AEA, then Sven can more easily and quickly be deported. And what makes it easier for the government to do this is that it gains for itself the power to make the determination that Sven is dangerous. However, minimal due process safeguards are still required. Sven would not be entitled to an immigration trial, but Sven would still be entitled to notice, and opportunity to be heard. Sven can still appeal the decision to the Court through a habeas petition.

In the cases before the court, the Trump administration has given none of these people notice, access to counsel, and an opportunity to be heard. They are just picking them up of the street, putting them on a plane, and condemning them to prison in a brutal, foreign prison for the rest of your life. That is wrong. That is illegal. That violates our Constitution.

Furthermore, the AEA does not give the President the power to make shit up. The mere fact that Trump says we are in a state of war against a terrorist group does not make that true. It must be objectively true. Trump can't just pretend that a state of war exists. That doesn't make any logical sense. A state of war has to actually exist. Trump cannot pretend a state of war exists when one does not. The Court does not have to agree with Trump's delusions.

And the idea that we are in a state of war with a criminal organization (a non-state organization), and we then label them terrorist group in order to justify using AEA does not make logical sense. It is all a bunch of bullshit intended to give Trump powers he does not have. What the Trump administration is doing is unlawful in the extreme. He is literally trying to make himself a dictator, above the rule of law. Hell, he's trying to make himself above objective reality by asserting things that have no factual basis whatsoever.

 

[Lutherf]

False. The AEA has no such requirement.

It's really pretty simple. The suspect is apprehended and accused of being here illegally. They go to the judge saying, "I'm being detained illegally". The prosecution says, "The detention is legal. The suspect is here illegally". The judge then asks for proof of lawful permanent residence or citizenship". The suspect says, "Uh...." the judge says, "That isn't proof that you're here legally, goodbye!"

 

[Callen]

The entire judicial system from the Supreme Court down disagrees with her.

Not sure it will matter. Garcia was moved from the notorious prison Trump was paying to keep deportees in to a different Venezuelan prison in the last few days. I beleive that was done to put him unquestionably in the custody of the El Salvadorian government which was questionable before that. Now getting him back will be much like getting an American held illegally in Russia back. All up to Rubio......he ain't coming back. However, that does not change what happened in the eyes of most Americans and it doesn't change what no doubt the SC will rule must happen going forward.

 

[ColdHardTruth]

It's really pretty simple. The suspect is apprehended and accused of being here illegally. They go to the judge saying, "I'm being detained illegally". The prosecution says, "The detention is legal. The suspect is here illegally". The judge then asks for proof of lawful permanent residence or citizenship". The suspect says, "Uh...." the judge says, "That isn't proof that you're here legally, goodbye!"

Except, that is not how it works.

The law WILL be followed. Even if it is inconvenient for the republicanazis.

 

[Lutherf]

The government does not have to charge Sven with a crime before deporting Sven. The government can decide to deport him immediately. However, even if the government deems it necessary to deport Sven, Sven is still entitled to notice, access to counsel (but government does not have to pay), and opportunity to be heard (a hearing before an immigration judge).

If Sven is determined to be a terrorist, the government can deport him as above, but the same procedures must be used. Sven is still entitled to notice, access to counsel, and opportunity to be heard.

If Sven is determined to not be a citizen of the U.S. during wartime, and is a national of the government we are at war with, and the President invokes the AEA, then Sven can more easily and quickly be deported. And what makes it easier for the government to do this is that it gains for itself the power to make the determination that Sven is dangerous. However, minimal due process safeguards are still required. Sven would not be entitled to an immigration trial, but Sven would still be entitled to notice, and opportunity to be heard. Sven can still appeal the decision to the Court through a habeas petition.

In the cases before the court, the Trump administration has given none of these people notice, access to counsel, and an opportunity to be heard. They are just picking them up of the street, putting them on a plane, and condemning them to prison in a brutal, foreign prison for the rest of your life. That is wrong. That is illegal. That violates our Constitution.

Furthermore, the AEA does not give the President the power to make shit up. The mere fact that Trump says we are in a state of war against a terrorist group does not make that true. It must be objectively true. Trump can't just pretend that a state of war exists. That doesn't make any logical sense. A state of war has to actually exist. Trump cannot pretend a state of war exists when it does not. The Court does not have to agree with Trump's delusions.

Obviously, the government can't deport Sven because if that was the case then we wouldn't even be having this conversation! The courts are saying that the federal government has no right to deport anyone under any circumstances because it's Trump that is encouraging the deportations.

 

[Allan]

It's really pretty simple. The suspect is apprehended and accused of being here illegally. They go to the judge saying, "I'm being detained illegally". The prosecution says, "The detention is legal. The suspect is here illegally". The judge then asks for proof of lawful permanent residence or citizenship". The suspect says, "Uh...." the judge says, "That isn't proof that you're here legally, goodbye!"

You have really lost the plot.

Let's try again...

The AEA requires a court hearing ONLY of there is a Habeas claim. If that claim is waived then no hearing is required.

The AEA has no such requirement. Go and read it because you're posting gibberish.

 

[Lutherf]

Except, that is not how it works.

The law WILL be followed. Even if it is inconvenient for the republicanazis.

Right. Because people here illegally, including criminals and terrorists, are US citizens as long as they are on US soil. Give them a voter ID card, register them as a Democrat and that's the ONLY thing the law provides for!

 

[Allan]

The courts are saying that the federal government has no right to deport anyone under any circumstances because it's Trump that is encouraging the deportations.

Why are you guys posting nothing but bullshit? Is your position so weak you can't find any legal basis for support?

 

[Allan]

Right. Because people here illegally, including criminals and terrorists, are US citizens as long as they are on US soil. Give them a voter ID card, register them as a Democrat and that's the ONLY thing the law provides for!

Complete bullshit.

 

[W_Heisenberg]

The courts are saying that the federal government has no right to deport anyone under any circumstances because it's Trump that is encouraging the deportations.

NO!

READ THE SUPREME COURT RULING:

"More specifically, in this context, AEA detainees must receive notice after the date of this order that they are subject to removal under the Act. The notice must be afforded within a reasonable time and in such a manner as will allow them to actually seek habeas relief in the proper venue before such removal occurs."

https://www.supremecourt.gov/opinions/24pdf/24a931_2c83.pdf

Please read the words:

"More specifically, in this context, AEA detainees must receive notice after the date of this order that they are subject to removal under the Act. The notice must be afforded within a reasonable time and in such a manner as will allow them to actually seek habeas relief in the proper venue before such removal occurs."

 

[Gatsby]

Trump says US cannot give every person it wants to deport a trial​

(Reuters) - U.S. President Donald Trump on Monday said on Truth Social that his administration cannot give everyone it wants to deport a trial "because to do so would take, without exaggeration, 200 years"

Yes. For once, Trump is actually correct about something. It *would* take 200 years to deport every person he wants to deport if we follow due process. Many of us have been saying for years that Trump's mass deportation plans are unrealistic and logistically impossible, but MAGA hats insisted it was doable. Now they are encountering the reality of their policies.

If Trump can't deport everyone he wants to deport with due process in <200 years, then the solution is not "Abandon the rule of law and deport them without due process." The solution is some combination of "Deport fewer people" and "Expand immigration courts."

 

[Allan]

NO!

READ THE SUPREME COURT RULING:

"More specifically, in this context, AEA detainees must receive notice after the date of this order that they are subject to removal under the Act. The notice must be afforded within a reasonable time and in such a manner as will allow them to actually seek habeas relief in the proper venue before such removal occurs."

https://www.supremecourt.gov/opinions/24pdf/24a931_2c83.pdf

READ THE ****ING WORDS:

"More specifically, in this context, AEA detainees must receive notice after the date of this order that they are subject to removal under the Act. The notice must be afforded within a reasonable time and in such a manner as will allow them to actually seek habeas relief in the proper venue before such removal occurs."

Are we witnessing dumb for dumb's sake?

 

[Lord of Planar]

This is demonstrably incorrect.
Read it and weep:

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&cd=&ved=2ahUKEwjtuYn_mOyMAxWbKkQIHeXyEjYQFnoECC0QAQ&url=https%3A%2F%2Fconstitution.congress.gov%2Fbrowse%2Fessay%2FartI-S8-C18-8-7-2%2FALDE_00001262%2F&usg=AOvVaw1Uh-Yrj6lbhRnBUFEFdl8A&opi=89978449

All your case represents is that this Japanese citizen came her "legally." we are talking about those who came her "illegally."

 

[Callen]

Why are you guys posting nothing but bullshit? Is your position so weak you can't fina any legal basis for support?

....'cause they think they are oh so clever.

 

[Lord of Planar]

Court hearing.

Where is it stated that "due process" must be a court hearing?

 

[Lord of Planar]

Whatever the process is, it has to be thorough enough that we don't deport anyone we shouldn't, and it also must include a method to correct any mistakes that still happen.

Which sounds like a trial and an appeal process, but does not have to be precisely that?

Was he here legally or illegally?

I do not see anyone disagreeing on that point. Are you stating he was a legal resident?

 

[W_Heisenberg]

Are we witnessing dumb for dumb's sake?

I think about half the Trump supporters simply do not care what the Constitution says, what the law mandates, or what the Supreme Court orders.

They know it's wrong...and they don't care.

 

[Lord of Planar]

The entire judicial system from the Supreme Court down disagrees with her.

Good luck to the Supreme Court to tell another country what to do.

 

[Lord of Planar]

Yes, it is. It always has been. You are again shitting on the oath you took when you joined the Navy.

I don't see that.

He was removed illegally. You seem to forget that. He was not supposed to be deported. His rights were egregiously violated.

No he wasn't. He was here illegally, and returned to his home country.

Dumpytits was told to bring him back, BY THE SCOTUS, and has not complied.

No he wasn't. He was told to "facilitate" his return.

Words have meaning. Please refer to a good dictionary. Words do not mean what you want them to.