TOUGH QUESTIONS

[tosca1]

Again, WHY is that the punishment for ALL eternity?

It matches the reward, which is also for ALL eternity.



Don't you get it?

God is trying to make the choice as easy as possible.

Which would you rather have? eternal life of bliss, or eternal life of torment?


One must truly hate God, if he still chooses eternal torment over the other.

 

[tosca1]

Why Would Temporal Beings Deserve Eternal Punishment In Hell?​

 

[tosca1]

Eternal Security: My Choice or God's Choice?​

 

[Maccabee]

I wouldn't go there.
We all sin. We know what we do.
We also know what is required from us.

We'll answer to HIM....................and, ONLY HIM..........in the end.

Ok?

Have you done any bible study on those subjects?

I grew up doing Bible studies every single day. I did Bible studies well into my 20s before I eventually moved out of my parent's house.

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What scientific inconsistencies?

Noah's Ark, the Creation myth, the idea that striping a branch will cause sheep to have spotted coats, etc.

You do know that the BIBLE is NOT a science text book.............RIGHT?

Yes, I do, however if it makes a scientific claim, then it should be accurate, right?

Listen my dear brother,

What you should be awed about, are not the so-called scientific inconsistencies,

but rather, the BIBLICAL statements in the Bible, that we NOW know, can be taken LITERALLY.............

.........because..............

.................SCIENCE DISCOVERED THEM AND REAFFIRMED WHAT'S BEEN STATED IN THE BIBLE!




As an example:

How many times did the Bible refer to the universe as............expanding?
For so long, we simply took that as a poetical rendering............but not anymore!
It's a literal description!

More like a lucky guess. You throw enough shit at the wall, you're bound to have something stick.

<hugging you>


I'm glad you opened up.


I don't think you're losing your faith.

You're right, I already lost it.

It's okay to question.
For by questioning, is how we also discern.



But...........if you're seeking the truth, you shouldn't stop there.
You have to seek for it.

STUDY the BIBLE.

I use a KJV Bible study bible.
It explains about customs and traditions of the time, terminologies, the verses, etc..,

I DID study the Bible, particularly the KJV, and realized that it wasn't true.

 

[Maccabee]

There are no scientific inconsistencies.

Yes there are.

Scientific and Historical inaccuracies in the Bible.

Coming from my post on contradictions in the bible, doing a post on the scientific and historical inaccuracies in the bible seemed the logical next step. Not unlike the claim that the bible contain…

biblefails.wordpress.com

Who would've have thought the snake used to have limbs and wasn't on its belly?

Several ancient cultures, actually. It's not that big of a leap of logic to think that snakes once had legs.

But that's what the bible said about the snake (Adam and Eve narrative)..........it got cursed to get on its belly!
Science just recently confirmed that within what? the last 20 or so years?

Why did God punished ALL snakes for one poor snake that got possessed? That doesn't sound very just, to me.

Snakes had back legs for 70 million years before losing them, new fossil shows ​

Snake evolution has intrigued scientists for years because they knew that these complex vertebrates once had limbs and adapted over time to live without them in dramatic fashion.


But a limited fossil record didn’t reflect how that transition happened since snakes first appeared during the upper Middle Jurassic Period between 163 to 174 million years ago.

https://www.cnn.com/2019/11/20/world/snake-evolution-hindlimbs-scn

Science doesn't know how it happened.
The Bible tells us how it happened.

The Bible's account is completely incompatible with what we know in science. For one, snakes lost their legs LONG before humans came into the picture. The Biblical account has them losing their legs AFTER humans were created.

Also - the Bible uses so many different figures of speech.
So, don't give me the mustard seed as an example of scientific inconsistency. Okay?

Why not? What, in that statement, makes it clear that he was speaking figuratively? What kind of weak defense you're using when you have to retreat to "he didn't mean anything by it" as a defense for an omnipotent, omniscient creator?

Conclusion on Literary Diversity

In studying the broad range of genres-Law, historical narrative, poetry, wisdom, prophecy, Gospels, epistles, and apocalyptic-it becomes clear that Scripture weaves together a unified message.
Across these literary forms, the consistent revelation of God’s character, moral law, redemptive plan, and the centrality of Christ points to the cohesive nature of the Bible.

Scholarship on ancient manuscripts, along with archaeological findings confirming names and events, supports confidence in Scripture’s historical reliability.
Each genre, approached according to its literary style, testifies to a message that has remained intact through centuries of transmission.
As you explore these diverse forms, the cohesive narrative and doctrinal unity highlight the trustworthy and dynamic nature of the biblical text.

What are the genres and literary forms in the Bible?

Name a biblical event that was confirmed my history or archeology.

 

[Maccabee]

REPENTED.







There are verses about forgiveness..........

and this prayer that Jesus had taught us............

"forgive us our trespasses as we forgive those who trespass against us."



We both don't know what will transpire between Dahmer and God, and between his victim and God.
That's between them (individually) and GOD, when the time comes.

How God will judge Dahmer and his victim, is none of our business!

Yes, it is my business because his people are running around earth telling me how good and just he is while genocidal maniacs who repented on their death bed are in heaven and Nobel prize winning, kind, and charitable atheists are burning in hell for simply not believing in god.

Anyway.....

Why would you jeopardize your own salvation over an issue which does not concern you?

As Jesus had said........................what is it to you?

WHat makes you think Christianity is the correct religion?

Simple answer?
He is the Creator. He can do whatever He wants with His creation.

Then he's not a good God.

Would you agree that an artist has the prerogative to do whatever he wants with his work?
same principle.

Are we inanimate objects to be abused and used however he wishes? If I fathered a child, can I throw him out of the hospital window because he's mine and I can do whatever I want with him?

BUT, instead of throwing everything in the garbage - God had decided to give mankind another chance.
This time - through the saving grace of the Messiah.
Your choice.

I choose to not believe in a genocidal, egoistical, and sadistic God who never even bothered to make himself easily provable, or even provable at all.

If you don't like His rules - and you say you're out of Christianity (I hope not) - why do you care?

Because you're trying to make everyone a Christian, that's why.

 

[Maccabee]

It matches the reward, which is also for ALL eternity.

Why does need to match, especially for sins as inconsequential as unbelief or the belief of another diety?

Don't you get it?

God is trying to make the choice as easy as possible.

By not showing himself and clearing up who has the right God?

Which would you rather have? eternal life of bliss, or eternal life of torment?

Why is he sending us to eternal torment?

One must truly hate God, if he still chooses eternal torment over the other.

What kind of psychological manipulation are you trying to play at? GOD is the one who made those two choices. Therefore it is GOD who sends us to hell. If I built a torture basement and told my son to love me or else he'll spend the rest of his life in the torture basement, who's making the choice, me or him?

 

[tosca1]

Yes, I do, however if it makes a scientific claim, then it should be accurate, right?

It's not making any scientific claim!


THAT'S THE POINT!


I don't think you understand the logic!




The Bible is filled with figures of speech and poetry.

But.............. there are statements that we NOW KNOW, are literal!


WHY?


Because........science discovered or reaffirmed them!


Lol - I even gave you examples!

 

[Maccabee]

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It's not making any scientific claim!


THAT'S THE POINT!


I don't think you understand the logic!




The Bible is filled with figures of speech and poetry.

But.............. there are statements that we NOW KNOW, are literal!


WHY?


Because........science discovered or reaffirmed them!


Lol - I even gave you examples!

Do you believe God created the universe in 6 literal days roughly 6,000 years ago? Do you believe the Bible claims that?

 

[Maccabee]

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God created an angel -

who later had decided - by his own free will - to rebel against GOD.
This rebellious angel was driven out of Heaven - and he became known as SATAN.

God KNEW all of this and still let it happen. Worse than that, he allows Satan to cause the VAST majority of the human race to fall astray and be sent to hell.

 

[dairyair]

No, you haven't. You gave a hem-hawing deflection to avoid answering directly. You believe in a heaven and hell, correct? Nobody can enter heaven without accepting Jesus as their Lord and Savior (and/or not be in a homosexual relationship presumably), correct? Therefore it's entirely feasible, in fact probable, that there are people being tortured in hell for essentially being Christians in every single way except for actually believing in Christ (or any deity) or for being gay, correct? Therefore, I would be just, as a father, to lock my son in a torture basement forever for simply not loving me, correct? The only reason you're not answering this directly, potentially sending people who fall under the two categories I presented to hell, is because you can't. And the reason, if I may be so bold, you can't answer is because deep down you know how morally reprehensible it is for an all good God to send good people to hell for the simple act of unbelief or acknowledging, accepting, and embracing an immutable part of their personality such as being gay, correct?

Not true. Jews and Muslims will be in some heaven.
I don't think Jews believe in a hell as some eternal torment.

But all 3 religions believe in a heaven and all 3 believe they will be there if they live a certain way. And none of them have the same way to get there.
But all 3 have the same god.

 

[devildavid]

Gee......that's a tough question.




let me think hard on it:

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This thread is meant fro doctrinal questions. Thus answers would be mostly biblical.





@Logician Man

This thread was created NOT for .............................debating silly personal opinions.

Then you are in the wrong forum for such things. This is not a forum to discuss religious doctrine from the point of view that you want. Anything you post here is subject to skeptical questioning and debate.

 

[donhughesmusic]

Isaiah 45-7

According to this verse, God created evil. I guess he truly is to blame for the evils of the world. How can man choose evil if it was never even created to begin with?

 

[devildavid]

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God created an angel -

who later had decided - by his own free will - to rebel against GOD.
This rebellious angel was driven out of Heaven - and he became known as SATAN.

Yeah, sure, as if god couldn’t predict the future. God creates things and then it all gets beyond its control and it does nothing about it. Hell of an all powerful god. Why would free will be the cause of an angel turning against god unless god put that desire there to begin with? God created the very nature of that angel on purpose. Free will doesn’t mean things can create their own nature. God controls every aspect of creation.