In this context I'm good with that as well.I'm of the opinion that the stuff about being a God in the Gospel was a gloss, so, C.S. Lewis notwithstanding, I'm good with calling him a great teacher.
Historically, Jesus was probably one of many itinerant preachers in the Levant at that time. They provided a way to God for people who could not afford to approach the Temple, which was controlled by the religious authorities. They all worked miracles and they all taught using proverbs. They borrowed each other's material a lot. Jesus, in particular, was heavily influenced by Greek philosophy, particularly the cynics.
Having said that, a religion is what believers make of it. Jesus is what Christians make of him. It is a foolish waste of time to dispute it.
Except John Lennon was an asshole for all intents and purposes in his personal life. Thomas Jefferson was a slave owner. Nelson Mandela supported terrorism. They're still extremely important human beings who influenced a bunch of people positively. History is littered with them. Lewis presents a false dichotomy that we don't apply to other historical individuals.
So he made a claim I don't agree with? So what, everyone else I respect has too.
None of them were God.
If you dont believe in god, why should that matter? If Bob Marley claims to be enlightened and influenced by his beliefs but also be one of the most important cultural figures of the developing world in the 20th century, should we not automatically throw the baby out with the bathwater from an irreligious perspective? His self-delusion, insanity or even lie leads one down the path of dismissing a **** load of cultural greats.
Bob Marley never claimed to be God.
SO what would qualify this legend called jesus as being a great man? What exactly did he himself actually do? What makes him so much different than anyone who teaches people stuff?
I don't know, over 2.2 billion people who practice Christianity worldwide seem to think He was somewhat different. :shrug:
Argumentum ad populum.
I would agree with you here, except that the OP poses a question which is strictly subjective in nature and, therefore, requires no objective, empirical evidence in order to defend a position.
Why do you think the number is arbitrary?Well then your suggestion is that I should probably assume that jesus was a great man because an arbitrary number of people think that way?
Ok, fair enough, I'll try and give you a simple and honest answer. Because by all accounts (which most Christians believe to be true) he was a sinless and blameless man who lived what he taught - a virtuous existence - and became a willing sacrifice for untold numbers of people he'd never met personally. He preached a Gospel which would give hope to billions in a broken world. His doctrines led to a religious movement that would change the entire world. His obvious intent was that it would change the world for the better, and I believe that it has......despite the fact that many throughout history have wrongly done terrible things in the name of Christianity. Those who've held true to the doctrines of Jesus and have tried their best to emulate the way He lived...........would, out of necessity, do more good than harm.Im just curious as to what Christian's think that jesus did that would make him a great human being? Its a simple and actually justified question.
Argumentum ad populum.
To non-Christians - Is Jesus of Nazareth one of the greatest humans to have lived?
We're not even sure he has ever lived, are we?
Statistics of this nature are arbitrary number since it is impossible to ask each and every person what they think. So the number ends up to be the opinion of the person making the assertion. It would be like asking how many people like ice cream you will never get a accurate number its impossible. There is no such thing as 2.2 billion honest people.Why do you think the number is arbitrary?
Ok, fair enough, I'll try and give you a simple and honest answer. Because by all accounts (which most Christians believe to be true) he was a sinless and blameless man who lived what he taught - a virtuous existence - and became a willing sacrifice for untold numbers of people he'd never met personally. He preached a Gospel which would give hope to billions in a broken world. His doctrines led to a religious movement that would change the entire world. His obvious intent was that it would change the world for the better, and I believe that it has......despite the fact that many throughout history have wrongly done terrible things in the name of Christianity. Those who've held true to the doctrines of Jesus and have tried their best to emulate the way He lived...........would, out of necessity, do more good than harm.
Also fact. And it's not a fallacy if it's a fact. Fact.
Am I going to hell?
This is based on international church rolls and missionary reports.....not personal interviews.Statistics of this nature are arbitrary number since it is impossible to ask each and every person what they think. So the number ends up to be the opinion of the person making the assertion. It would be like asking how many people like ice cream you will never get a accurate number its impossible. There is no such thing as 2.2 billion honest people.
Of course I dont agree with you, but that should be no surprise lol. But thank you for answering the question.
So basically jesus was this perfect guy that lived a good life and talked about being good instead of being evil. ANd because people try to emulate jesus's way of life this makes him a great man? But Doesnt the bible say that jesus was a man made of flesh while on Earth? If jesus did not sin then he really was not a human then was he?
I also dispute that Christian values are all that good. Let him without sin throw the first rock? Then why do Christians judge homosexuals so readily? Or in many cases judge Atheist's to be evil? Or pretend to know who is going to hell and who is not?
Im ok with Christians spreading their message, that is their prerogative. But they never seem to stop there and seem compelled to judge their neighbors and friends on a daily basis. WHy not just love people and let your god do the rest? Perhaps jesus's footsteps are not realistic to follow after all? Maybe that is why so many struggle with their faith?
A fact perhaps but hardly the truth.
Statistics of this nature are arbitrary number since it is impossible to ask each and every person what they think. So the number ends up to be the opinion of the person making the assertion. It would be like asking how many people like ice cream you will never get a accurate number its impossible. There is no such thing as 2.2 billion honest people.
Of course I dont agree with you, but that should be no surprise lol. But thank you for answering the question.
So basically jesus was this perfect guy that lived a good life and talked about being good instead of being evil. ANd because people try to emulate jesus's way of life this makes him a great man? But Doesnt the bible say that jesus was a man made of flesh while on Earth? If jesus did not sin then he really was not a human then was he?
I also dispute that Christian values are all that good. Let him without sin throw the first rock? Then why do Christians judge homosexuals so readily? Or in many cases judge Atheist's to be evil? Or pretend to know who is going to hell and who is not?
Im ok with Christians spreading their message, that is their prerogative. But they never seem to stop there and seem compelled to judge their neighbors and friends on a daily basis. WHy not just love people and let your god do the rest? Perhaps jesus's footsteps are not realistic to follow after all? Maybe that is why so many struggle with their faith?
How many struggle with their faith?
Who are these Christians who "never seem to stop there" and "seem compelled" to judge on a "daily basis"? Who are they?
I mean, I go to work and shop at stores and meet new people but never seem to run into these people. So who are they, where are they, and how many of them are there? What's the percentage?
Bingo. Judging Others seems to be a human trait, less a Christian one. I've never had a Christian hurl the invective at me that is hurled by non-believers when (for example) we discuss marriage.
I've had Christers telling me I'm going to hell for walking into a punk rock club
I've had Christers telling me I'm going to hell for walking into a punk rock club
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