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There's no such thing as "Palestine"

Volker said:
Palestine existed as a state and you'll better get used to the idea, it will exist as an indepedent country in the future. Palestinians are the people of Palestine.
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Volker,

Please read the following text carefully:

It was during this time that the Romans gave the name Syria Palaestina to the geographic area, in an attempt to erase Jewish ties to the land. The Mishnah and Jerusalem Talmud, two of Judaism's most important religious texts, were composed in the region during this period. The Muslims conquered the land from the Byzantine Empire in 638 CE. The area was ruled by various Muslim states (interrupted by the rule of the Crusaders) before becoming part of the Ottoman Empire in 1517.

This is a PROVEN HISTORICAL FACT. Nothing the islamic brainwashers tell you can change it.

Accept it and move on.
 
Vader said:
Volker,

Please read the following text carefully:

It was during this time that the Romans gave the name Syria Palaestina to the geographic area, in an attempt to erase Jewish ties to the land. The Mishnah and Jerusalem Talmud, two of Judaism's most important religious texts, were composed in the region during this period. The Muslims conquered the land from the Byzantine Empire in 638 CE. The area was ruled by various Muslim states (interrupted by the rule of the Crusaders) before becoming part of the Ottoman Empire in 1517.

This is a PROVEN HISTORICAL FACT.
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This is a part of the history of Palestine.

Vader said:
Accept it and move on.
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I accept the land has been called Palestine before, I don't think, I said something else.
 
Gardener said:
Is that anything like a turd? You may have been meaning tard, though, as in retard, so it would be helpful to know to which you are referring.
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So.... you've got nothing to say then?
 
arussian said:
As far as I know, the first historical notion of Israel is Merenptah's stele which is dated 1224 B.C. In the line 27-th from above it is said that Israel was totally eliminated.
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Egyptology (sigh)... one of my favorite amateur pursuits.

Almost every ancient Egyptian Pharaoh, even the female Pharoah's like Hatshepsut, erected stele's to laud their supposed military achievements. Egyptologists, in concert with historians of antiquity, have determined that most of the claims on such stele's are nothing more than propoganda that artificially boosted a spectacular image of the Pharaoh upon his/her people.

Merneptah claimed to have burned the fruit/grain harvest in Israel (which may be true), and he also claimed to have destroyed the seed (males) of Israel (which is not true). History tells us that Israel was not destroyed and retained its soverignty over the Levant until the Roman occupation.
 
Trajan Octavian Titus said:
It wasn't a state it was a British mandate, Jordan is Palestine.
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Indeed.

:shock:
 
As much as people hate to admit it creating Israel didnt turn out to be such a great idea did it now?
 
I do not understand the point of this thread, what are you trying to say Jacob?
 
Hatuey said:
As much as people hate to admit it creating Israel didnt turn out to be such a great idea did it now?
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No one created Israel the land west of the Jordan has always been the home of the Jewish people, and they have always had a higher population there than the Muslims.
 
Morrow said:
I do not understand the point of this thread, what are you trying to say Jacob?
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Palestine isn't a state, it was never a state, it is a construct of the militant Arab movement of the 20th century to legitimize terrorist actions and wars of aggression against the people of Israel, because the Islamic-Fascists can't stand the idea of Jews having a state in their backyard.
 
Trajan Octavian Titus said:
No one created Israel the land west of the Jordan has always been the home of the Jewish people, and they have always had a higher population there than the Muslims.
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Thats not certain. Throughout the 2nd millenium there have been many jewish migrations towards the state so it's impossible to know the exact demographics considering that at various points in history Israel was a cultural hotspot.

The 1988 declaration was approved at a meeting in Algiers, by a vote of 253-46, with 10 abstentions. The declaration invoked the Treaty of Lausanne (1923) and UN General Assembly Resolution 181 in support of its claim to a "State of Palestine on our Palestinian territory with its capital Jerusalem". The proclaimed "State of Palestine" was recognized immediately by the Arab League, and about half the world's governments recognize it today. It maintains embassies in these countries (which are generally PLO delegations). The State of Palestine is not recognized by the United Nations, although the European Union, as well as most member states, maintain diplomatic ties with the Palestinian Authority, established under the Oslo Accords (Leila Shahid, envoy of the PNA to France since 1984, was named in November 2005 representant of the PNA for Europe).

The declaration is generally interpreted to have recognized Israel within its pre-1967 boundaries, or was at least a major step on the path to recognition. Just as in Israel's declaration of establishment, it partly bases its claims on UN GA 181. By reference to "resolutions of Arab Summits" and "UN resolutions since 1947" (like SC 242) it implicitly and perhaps ambiguously restricted its immediate claims to the Palestinian territories and Jerusalem. It was accompanied by a political statement that explicitly mentioned SC 242 and other UN resolutions and called only for withdrawal from "Arab Jerusalem" and the other "Arab territories occupied." [1] Yasser Arafat's statements in Geneva a month later were accepted by the United States as sufficient to remove the ambiguities it saw in the declaration and to fulfill the longheld conditions for open dialogue with the United States.
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Wouldnt this mean there is a country called Palestine. We just dont recognize it ?

Proclaimed independence in 1948, Israel is the world's only Jewish state, although its population includes citizens of many ethnic and religious backgrounds. (See also Israelis.) According to the international data reported by Freedom House, the degree of political rights and civil liberties in Israel makes it the only liberal democracy in the Middle East, consisting of a multi-party system and separation of powers.[4]
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Apparently It wasnt a country before 1948.
 
Hatuey said:
As much as people hate to admit it creating Israel didnt turn out to be such a great idea did it now?
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How about some evidence to support this bizarre claim.
 
Vader said:
They existed as a state on property that has belonged to the jews for more than 2000 YEARS.

This fact makes the Palestinians hypocrites and liars.
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Actually the area has been owned by a variety of peoples for the past 2000 years including, most importantly, The Romans, The Byzantine Empire, and The Ottomans. Although there has always been a Jewish population in this area, until 1948 there had been no Jewish nation on the land since the Babylonians conquered the Kingdom of Judah in around 600 BCE.

Link to some of this information: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_the_Jews_in_the_Land_of_Israel
 
Vader said:
Volker,

Please read the following text carefully:

It was during this time that the Romans gave the name Syria Palaestina to the geographic area, in an attempt to erase Jewish ties to the land. The Mishnah and Jerusalem Talmud, two of Judaism's most important religious texts, were composed in the region during this period. The Muslims conquered the land from the Byzantine Empire in 638 CE. The area was ruled by various Muslim states (interrupted by the rule of the Crusaders) before becoming part of the Ottoman Empire in 1517.

This is a PROVEN HISTORICAL FACT. Nothing the islamic brainwashers tell you can change it.

Accept it and move on.
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Good job. Short, accurate.
 
CaptainCourtesy said:
How about some evidence to support this bizarre claim.
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I wonder why there are muslim radicals looking to blow us up.
 
Trajan Octavian Titus said:
No one created Israel the land west of the Jordan has always been the home of the Jewish people, and they have always had a higher population there than the Muslims.
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This isn't accurate. In 1900, for example, the Jewish population was only 12% of the total population in the area now known as the nation of Israel; certainly not a majority. In fact, after many of the exterminations/expulsions by assorted empires/nations, the Jewish population in the area had dropped to 2% by 1870. After a number of waves of immigration ir rose to 55% by 1947 and to 80%, today.

Information for this post was found at the following links:
http://www.mideastweb.org/palpop.htm
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1947_UN_Partition_Plan
 
Trajan Octavian Titus said:
It wasn't a state it was a British mandate, Jordan is Palestine.
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No, it was a state governed by the Britons for the league of nations to be prepared for independence.

Jordan is Jordan, Palestine included today's Jordan at this time.
 
arussian said:
My question is purely historical: How have you calculated this date?

As far as I know, the first historical notion of Israel is Merenptah's stele which is dated 1224 B.C. In the line 27-th from above it is said that Israel was totally eliminated.

http://www.touregypt.net/featurestories/merenphatvictorystele.htm
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I don't think think there is prove for an independent Israelite state to have existed before 900 B.C., the way I understand it, it was populated by different peoples around 1200 B.C. and 1300 B.C. and consisted of city states which were more or less under Egyptian dominion.

There is an archaeological theory that there has been a catastrophe around this time in Canaan, it could have been an earthquake or a disease or a combination of both. Cities like Jericho were probably not conquered, but settled again.
 
Volker said:
I don't think think there is prove for an independent Israelite state to have existed before 900 B.C., the way I understand it, it was populated by different peoples around 1200 B.C. and 1300 B.C. and consisted of city states which were more or less under Egyptian dominion.

There is an archaeological theory that there has been a catastrophe around this time in Canaan, it could have been an earthquake or a disease or a combination of both. Cities like Jericho were probably not conquered, but settled again.
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Actually, it was a little later. The United Israelite monarchy lasted from 1050 BCE until 920 BCE when it divided. The Kingdom of Israel was conquered by the Assyrians in 721 BCE, and the Kingdom of Judah was conquered by the Babylonians in 587 BCE. These were the last times there was an independant Israeli nation until 1948.

Taken from: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_ancient_Israel_and_Judah

EDIT*

Oops! Misread your post...thought it said after 900 BCE.:3oops: :doh In any event, your information is correct, and substantanted on my link. :smile:
 
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Hatuey said:
I wonder why there are muslim radicals looking to blow us up.
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Umm...because they're Muslim radicals.
 
CaptainCourtesy said:
Umm...because they're Muslim radicals.
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You can hand Occam's razor to many people, Captain, but how many will ever shave with it?


Seems to me the illogic goes as follows. People hate and want to kill, therefore there must be a reason for their hatred. Since there is a reason for the hatred, the objects of the hatred must be the reason. Since the objects of the hatred are the reason, the hatred must be justified.

Circular at best, but if applied to other issues, one cannot help but arrive at the conclusion that women are resonsible for rape, and that Jews (once again) were responsible for the Holocaust.
 
Volker said:
If you want to see the things this way, then the property probably belonged to the Palestinians and their anchestors for 4000 years.
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THERE WERE NO PALESTINIANS 4000 YEARS AGO ... stop lying through your teeth sir.

Volker said:
No, it makes them the people of Palestine.
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It makes them lying hypocritical murderers who use the name "Palestinian" to identify themselves.

Stop being a terrorist supporter sir.
 
Volker said:
One of us two actually sounds brainwashed, but it's not me.
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I am not a brainwashed slave of muslimarchy. That would be you.

Nice try though.

REMEMBER --- everything you were taught by your islam instructors was a lie! A lie designed to further their control over you and your people.

Accept this fact and convert to a religon that does not use mass-brainwashing as a means of control.

You ARE the weakest link! Goodbye!
 
Trajan Octavian Titus said:
Palestine isn't a state, it was never a state, it is a construct of the militant Arab movement of the 20th century to legitimize terrorist actions and wars of aggression against the people of Israel, because the Islamic-Fascists can't stand the idea of Jews having a state in their backyard.
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Okay, it was never a state, so what? What is it that Jacob seems to think is being established by that statement? There wasn't a United States before 1776... so what bearing does that have and on what arguments ?
 
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