The Swedish experiment of doing remarkably little about Covid-19

[Sven Karma]

Ironically I should imagine the same people all over the Swedish Muslim Gang Rape etc threads will be cheering on their keep the good times rolling policy:

'They are leading us to catastrophe': Sweden's coronavirus stoicism begins to jar | World news | The Guardian

 

[Snazzy]

It will be very interesting to see how this approach works out for the Swedes. Personally, I see trouble ahead.

Looking at the current figures in Italy and Spain (after weeks of lockdown), simple logic tells me that those figures would be much higher had life carried on as normal.

 

[Hawkeye10]

It will be very interesting to see how this approach works out for the Swedes. Personally, I see trouble ahead.

Looking at the current figures in Italy and Spain (after weeks of lockdown), simple logic tells me that those figures would be much higher had life carried on as normal.

I like the idea of different approaches being tried.....I am very sure that we are going to increasingly be facing pandemics as civilization collapses due to massive mismanagement...we need to figure out best practices....cast a wide net I say......getting things wrong means that lots of people die.

So far it looks like America is far behind the best.

A collapsing Super Power we are.

SAD

 

[Infinite Chaos]

Sadly I think Sweden has it wrong, other nations (like Papua New Guinea) have closed the country down immediately after just one case that was an Australian Miner on stop-over from a trip to Spain.

 

[Lord of Planar]

Sadly I think Sweden has it wrong, other nations (like Papua New Guinea) have closed the country down immediately after just one case that was an Australian Miner on stop-over from a trip to Spain.

I think they are doing the right thing by not ruining the economy over this. People who are high risk are adult enough to quarantine themselves against others, right?

 

[CaughtInThe]

A good thread to bookmark.

 

[Infinite Chaos]

I think they are doing the right thing by not ruining the economy over this. People who are high risk are adult enough to quarantine themselves against others, right?

I see a lot of people claim "over-reaction...." fine claim if only one country is doing it but not quite a serious claim when nearly every country of every political persuasion is doing the same.

 

[Chagos]

I see a lot of people claim "over-reaction...." fine claim if only one country is doing it but not quite a serious claim when nearly every country of every political persuasion is doing the same.

Next thing we'll be hearing is how more people die from traffic accidents.

First world countries have hardly ever been in economic conditions as good as today and thus hardly ever as well-armed to overcome the economic backlash all this will have.

But no, let the chips fall where they may, I wanna have my lifestyle guaranteed and forever at that.:roll:

 

[Rogue Valley]

I see a lot of people claim "over-reaction...." fine claim if only one country is doing it but not quite a serious claim when nearly every country of every political persuasion is doing the same.

The collated data-points from different nations strongly suggest that Sweden (and Belarus) will rue their decisions to not implement distancing and other mitigation strategies.

 

[Infinite Chaos]

The collated data-points from different nations strongly suggest that Sweden (and Belarus) will rue their decisions to not implement distancing and other mitigation strategies.

Seems Sweden is slowly shifting over to accepted wisdom, they also have a higher number of deaths to a lower number of confirmed cases compared to Germany.

 

[Chagos]

Seems Sweden is slowly shifting over to accepted wisdom, they also have a higher number of deaths to a lower number of confirmed cases compared to Germany.

one also need see (in this context) that Germany is testing more than any other country outside of China and S.Korea.

Sweden's testing being pretty low (so far restricted to the elderly and kids) expect the actual number of infection to be much higher with casualties bound to rise (they have about an eighth of Germany's population).

 

[Bergslagstroll]

Sweden have a long history of independent government agencies and trusting the government. So this is Sweden have a strategy of own responsibility and that both politicians and the general population follow the advice of non political health agencies. That people should voluntarily follow the advice to stay isolated if their are in risk groups like the elderly or have any symptoms. Also people should work at home if possible and avoid unnecessary social contact. There social pressure is a part of it. For example that the big ski resort was still allowed to be open during Easter, but now will close next Monday because of public pressure. While the government is also willing to step in the necessary. Like for example that night clubs planned to have open during pay day weekend, last week and some people planned to party as nothing had happened. So the government decided to ban all events with more than 50 people while the government agencies warned about the increased danger. So the night clubs closed down and it become a extremely calm weekend. While the question is still if the Swedish strategy will be good or bad in the long run.

 

[Sandokan]

Sweden have a long history of independent government agencies and trusting the government. So this is Sweden have a strategy of own responsibility and that both politicians and the general population follow the advice of non political health agencies. That people should voluntarily follow the advice to stay isolated if their are in risk groups like the elderly or have any symptoms. Also people should work at home if possible and avoid unnecessary social contact. There social pressure is a part of it. For example that the big ski resort was still allowed to be open during Easter, but now will close next Monday because of public pressure. While the government is also willing to step in the necessary. Like for example that night clubs planned to have open during pay day weekend, last week and some people planned to party as nothing had happened. So the government decided to ban all events with more than 50 people while the government agencies warned about the increased danger. So the night clubs closed down and it become a extremely calm weekend. While the question is still if the Swedish strategy will be good or bad in the long run.

Off to the Cafe: Sweden Is Outlier in Virus Restrictions
Access Denied

The coronavirus is not keeping people in Sweden at home even while citizens in many parts of the world are sheltering in place.

By Associated Press, Wire Service Content March 29, 2020, at 9:47 a.m.

FILE - People sit in a bar in Stockholm, Sweden, Wednesday, March 25, 2020. The streets of Stockholm are quiet but not deserted. People still sit at outdoor cafes in the center of Sweden's capital. Vendors still sell flowers. Teenagers still chat in groups in parks. Some still greet each other with hugs and handshakes. After a long, dark Scandinavian winter, the coronavirus pandemic is not keeping Swedes at home even while citizens in many parts of the world are sheltering in place and won't find shops or restaurants open on the few occasions they are permitted to venture out. (AP Photo/David Keyton, File) THE ASSOCIATED PRESS

BY DAVID KEYTON, Associated Press

STOCKHOLM (AP) — The streets of Stockholm are quiet but not deserted. People still sit at outdoor cafes in the center of Sweden's capital. Vendors still sell flowers. Teenagers still chat in groups in parks. Some still greet each other with hugs and handshakes.

After a long, dark Scandinavian winter, the coronavirus pandemic is not keeping Swedes at home even while citizens in many parts of the world are sheltering in place and won't find shops or restaurants open on the few occasions they are permitted to venture out.

Swedish authorities have advised the public to practice social distancing and to work from home, if possible, and urged those over age 70 to self-isolate as a precaution. Yet compared to the lockdowns imposed elsewhere in the world, the government's response to the virus allows a liberal amount of personal freedom.

Standing at bars has been banned in Sweden, but restaurant customers can still be served at tables instead of having to take food to go. High schools and universities are closed, but preschools and primary schools are still running classes in person.
Click link above for full article.

Sweden’s chief epidemiologist Anders Tegnell argued that “even if the country's comparatively permissive policies are an anomaly, they are more sustainable and effective in protecting the public's health than “drastic” moves like closing schools for four or five months…

The goal is to slow down the amount of new people getting infected so that health care gets a reasonable chance to take care of them. And that's what we all do in every country in Europe. We just choose different methods to do it.”

We will see in a couple of weeks how well Sweden approach work. Quarantine of the elderly and preexisting condition while at the same time low risk people practice the recommended guideline to reduce the spread of the coronavirus looks a reasonable method to handle the health crisis.

 

[ThirdTerm]

Sweden has recorded more than 4,000 coronavirus cases, which is comparable to those of Japan where daily life has been continuing largely as normal. There is no need to panic if there are only few thousand cases. In both countries, large gatherings were banned, while restaurants, bars and shops are still serving customers. Probably there is a low level of migration to Sweden from other EU member states like Spain and Italy.

 

[maxparrish]

I think they are doing the right thing by not ruining the economy over this. People who are high risk are adult enough to quarantine themselves against others, right?

Respecting a person's right to freely chose who he/she associates is, in modern times, only a privilege granted by the central authority - something to be denied to any person or group the state overseers designate.

Hence, we have ended up with a fiasco "remedy" - the closing down of society and termination of thousands of businesses and jobs in order to do exactly what, protect the only truly vulnerable...the cohort of oldsters over 60? Are they now considered senile, unable to make up their own minds and arrange there own affairs to protect themselves?

Oldsters are no more a danger to themselves now than they were before this infection; all had a choice over their own self-care, health and lifestyle, and associations. Instead we are not only locking them up (so to speak) but society at large who are not in significant danger of out of control dying.

The real insanity is that EVEN FOR AN AUTHORITARIAN the collective strategy is stupid. Rather than lose a trillion or two in the production of goods and services, one could have spent a fraction of that amount (10s of billions) setting up sheltering centers for millions of truly vulnerable folks (if they chose), fed em, isolated them, and kept them 100 percent quarantined. The rest of society good hum along, its prosperity helping to pay for this strategy.

Rather, the pinheads decide to try to quarantine ALL OF SOCIETY from old people, rather than vice versa. And at a huge economic cost.

Go figure.

 

[PoS]

Sadly I think Sweden has it wrong, other nations (like Papua New Guinea) have closed the country down immediately after just one case that was an Australian Miner on stop-over from a trip to Spain.

We'll see, wont we? Personally I think Sweden is correct- herd immunity is the way to go.

 

[Hawkeye10]

We'll see, wont we? Personally I think Sweden is correct- herd immunity is the way to go.

That only works if you have put in the work to create a good medical system, and then you supply it.

You also need to have a population that is smart and will cooperate.

And you need really good crisis leadership








How many nations have all that?

Certainly not America.

 

[PoS]

That only works if you have put in the work to create a good medical system, and then you supply it.

You also need to have a population that is smart and will cooperate.

And you need really good crisis leadership








How many nations have all that?

Certainly not America.

The whole virus thing is overblown. The projected deaths of a million plus Americans are so far being proved wrong. While its certainly dangerous to old people and the sick, young and healthy folk are not at major risk. Isolate the vulnerable and let the economy run. If you shut down the world economy every time there's a pandemic, we might as well go back to the Stone Age.

 

[Hawkeye10]

The whole virus thing is overblown. The projected deaths of a million plus Americans are so far being proved wrong. While its certainly dangerous to old people and the sick, young and healthy folk are not at major risk. Isolate the vulnerable and let the economy run. If you shut down the world economy every time there's a pandemic, we might as well go back to the Stone Age.

"We cant have people dying on the streets".....Donald Trump

People dying on the streets is the bad old days.....governments dont survive doing work that is of that extremely bad quality. You also cant abuse your medical people.

 

[Infinite Chaos]

That only works if you have put in the work to create a good medical system, and then you supply it.

You also need to have a population that is smart and will cooperate.

And you need really good crisis leadership ~

"We cant have people dying on the streets".....Donald Trump

People dying on the streets is the bad old days.....governments dont survive doing work that is of that extremely bad quality. You also cant abuse your medical people.

Wow... I find myself for the first time ever actually agreeing something you've posted. Not once even but twice.

We'll see, wont we? Personally I think Sweden is correct- herd immunity is the way to go.

Sweden has seen the sense of its mistake.

 

[Hawkeye10]

Wow... I find myself for the first time ever actually agreeing something you've posted. Not once even but twice.



Sweden has seen the sense of its mistake.

It has not been a disaster yet...according to Woldometers they are 9th by deaths per capita.

Coronavirus Update (Live): 950,638 Cases and 48,289 Deaths from COVID-19 Virus Outbreak - Worldometer



And thanks... hopefully there is more where that come from.

 

[Lord of Planar]

Respecting a person's right to freely chose who he/she associates is, in modern times, only a privilege granted by the central authority - something to be denied to any person or group the state overseers designate.

Hence, we have ended up with a fiasco "remedy" - the closing down of society and termination of thousands of businesses and jobs in order to do exactly what, protect the only truly vulnerable...the cohort of oldsters over 60? Are they now considered senile, unable to make up their own minds and arrange there own affairs to protect themselves?

Oldsters are no more a danger to themselves now than they were before this infection; all had a choice over their own self-care, health and lifestyle, and associations. Instead we are not only locking them up (so to speak) but society at large who are not in significant danger of out of control dying.

The real insanity is that EVEN FOR AN AUTHORITARIAN the collective strategy is stupid. Rather than lose a trillion or two in the production of goods and services, one could have spent a fraction of that amount (10s of billions) setting up sheltering centers for millions of truly vulnerable folks (if they chose), fed em, isolated them, and kept them 100 percent quarantined. The rest of society good hum along, its prosperity helping to pay for this strategy.

Rather, the pinheads decide to try to quarantine ALL OF SOCIETY from old people, rather than vice versa. And at a huge economic cost.

Go figure.

I think the left did this because it's an election year.

 

[Infinite Chaos]

~

Rather, the pinheads decide to try to quarantine ALL OF SOCIETY from old people, rather than vice versa. And at a huge economic cost.

Go figure.

I think the left did this because it's an election year.

The rest of the whole world went into isolation because of an election year in the USA?

 

[Sandokan]

Sweden has recorded more than 4,000 coronavirus cases, which is comparable to those of Japan where daily life has been continuing largely as normal. There is no need to panic if there are only few thousand cases. In both countries, large gatherings were banned, while restaurants, bars and shops are still serving customers. Probably there is a low level of migration to Sweden from other EU member states like Spain and Italy.

We will see is Sweden approach of common sense is more effective than the draconian measures taken by other European countries. Sweden way is to take care of both economy and virus simultaneously, without the need of a total lockdown.

So far Sweden total cases on April 2 (5,568) and death (308) are in the middle range of number of death per 1 million population in the EU. When this is over, it can be used to see which of the approach worked better.
Link: Coronavirus Update (Live): 1,016,604 Cases and 53,241 Deaths from COVID-19 Virus Outbreak - Worldometer

 

[PoS]

Sweden has seen the sense of its mistake.

Incorrect. Theyre still practicing herd immunity, so are the Dutch, to a degree.

STILL Sweden bucks the trend: Public continue to mill about in groups as life goes on despite warnings their government's coronavirus approach is recipe for disaster