The Qur'an clearly links 'jihad' with fighting.

[Nickyjo]

What does that mean? Am I making anything up, or am I simply pointing out what the Qur'an says?

If I were to read My Kampf, I'm sure I would find ample reason to "trash" it as well, and for exactly the same reasons.

You are still not saying what we should do, other than acknowledge that some of the world’s billion Muslims have acted act horribly. I do. Now what?

 

[stevecanuck]

You are still not saying what we should do, other than acknowledge that some of the world’s billion Muslims have acted act horribly. I do. Now what?

That is NOT what I'm saying, and you know it.

I'm saying that their religion requires them to act as they do. Do you acknowledge that dilfference?

 

[poppopfox]

Name one fact I have wrong.

I've seen no facts, just rhetorical proselytizing.

 

[Nickyjo]

You are still not saying what we should do, other than acknowledge that some of the world’s billion Muslims act horribly.

That is NOT what I'm saying, and you know it.

I'm saying that their religion requires them to act as they do. Do you acknowledge that dilfference?

So every observant Muslim has to attack others? How did Trump get out of Saudi Arabia alive? My wife spent couple weeks in Bali, in the largest Muslim country in the world. How did she escape?

But you still haven’t advocated any policy. What should concerned Americans do? What should concerned American Muslims do? TACO Trump backed down per his current nickname and didn’t ban all Muslims.

 

[Tigerace117]

That is NOT what I'm saying, and you know it.

I'm saying that their religion requires them to act as they do. Do you acknowledge that dilfference?

Clearly not, as shown by the millions of Muslims globally fighting against groups like ISIS.

 

[stevecanuck]

I've seen no facts, just rhetorical proselytizing.

I have posted quote after quote after quote from the Qur'an in support of everything I say. Again, what have I said that I haven't supported? Just one example will do.

 

[poppopfox]

I have posted quote after quote after quote from the Qur'an in support of everything I say. Again, what have I said that I haven't supported? Just one example will do.

There are no facts in the Qu'ran. There are no facts in the Bible. All Abrahamic religions are the same. Just because you can quote rhetoric from a book doesn't make it a fact. Take your hatren of Islam to a local mosque and see what kind of reception you get.

 

[stevecanuck]

There are no facts in the Qu'ran. There are no facts in the Bible. All Abrahamic religions are the same. Just because you can quote rhetoric from a book doesn't make it a fact. Take your hatren of Islam to a local mosque and see what kind of reception you get.

You misunderstood that on purpose. How disingenuous.

The "fact" is that the quotes I give are in the Qur'an, and you know it.

Those who don't have a rebuttal are reduced to tacits like you use.

 

[stevecanuck]

I've seen no facts, just rhetorical proselytizing.

The Qur'an is rhetorical proselytizing. And it inspires the likes of ISIS. That's the point you pretend to not see.

 

[stevecanuck]

So every observant Muslim has to attack others? How did Trump get out of Saudi Arabia alive? My wife spent couple weeks in Bali, in the largest Muslim country in the world. How did she escape?

But you still haven’t advocated any policy. What should concerned Americans do? What should concerned American Muslims do? TACO Trump backed down per his current nickname and didn’t ban all Muslims.

In countries that have Christian minorities such as Egypt and Pakistan, Muslim mobs occasionally kill Christians when they 'step out of line' and 'insult Islam'. Otherwise, they are left to live in the margins of the majority Islamic society. They live a life of constant discrimination.

 

[stevecanuck]

@Nickyjo and @poppopfox

Can we settle on verifiable facts?

• The Qur'an is believed by Muslims to be a verbatim sermon from Allah delivered via Gabriel to Mohamed.
• It contains verses that eplicitly tell Muslims to fight unbelievers.
• There are enough Muslims in the world who feel obligated to obey their god to man, equip, support, and finance the jihadi groups that operate in various parts of the world.

If any of that is untrue, please tell me what I'm getting wrong.

 

[Nickyjo]

In countries that have Christian minorities such as Egypt and Pakistan, Muslim mobs occasionally kill Christians when they 'step out of line' and 'insult Islam'. Otherwise, they are left to live in the margins of the majority Islamic society. They live a life of constant discrimination.

Ok, that’s bad, similar to the religious conflicts there used to be in Northern Ireland.

But assuming that one agrees with your analysis and apparent concerns about Islam, what policies do you suggest, short of requiring Muslims to wear a star and crescent armband?

 

[stevecanuck]

Ok, that’s bad, similar to the religious conflicts there used to be in Northern Ireland.

But assuming that one agrees with your analysis and apparent concerns about Islam, what policies do you suggest, short of requiring Muslims to wear a star and crescent armband?

I don't advocate any policy, because that would be discriminatory to the Muslims who try to steer clear of their coreligionists BS.

My aim is to explain why Islamic terrorism exists, and that it continues to be a threat 1400 years after Mohamed's lifetime.

 

[Nickyjo]

I don't advocate any policy, because that would be discriminatory to the Muslims who try to steer clear of their coreligionists BS.

My aim is to explain why Islamic terrorism exists, and that it continues to be a threat 1400 years after Mohamed's lifetime.

Fair enough.

 

[Rumpel]

why do you write Qur'an when you could write simply Koran?

 

[stevecanuck]

why do you write Qur'an when you could write simply Koran?

I asked ChatGPT to explain the difference between 'kaff' and 'qaff', and here's what it said. I've read it and agree with it:

In Arabic, the letters you're asking about — "kaff" and "qaff" — most likely refer to two different Arabic letters that are sometimes confused by English speakers due to similar transliteration. Here’s a clear distinction:

• Arabic: ك
• Name: Kāf (كاف)
• Sound: "k" as in kite

• Arabic: ق
• Name: Qāf (قاف)
• Sound: "q", a deeper “k” sound made from the throat

As to the ' between the r and the a, Chat told me this:

The hamza represents a glottal stop, a sound like the catch in the throat between the syllables of uh-oh in English. In Arabic, it is a full consonant, not just a diacritical mark.

Since Qur'an is written with a qaff and a hamza, it best represents the Arabic the way I write it (plus I've seen it written that way by scholars).

 

[Rumpel]

I asked ChatGPT to explain the difference between 'kaff' and 'qaff', and here's what it said. I've read it and agree with it:

In Arabic, the letters you're asking about — "kaff" and "qaff" — most likely refer to two different Arabic letters that are sometimes confused by English speakers due to similar transliteration. Here’s a clear distinction:

• Arabic: ك
• Name: Kāf (كاف)
• Sound: "k" as in kite

• Arabic: ق
• Name: Qāf (قاف)
• Sound: "q", a deeper “k” sound made from the throat

As to the ' between the r and the a, Chat told me this:

The hamza represents a glottal stop, a sound like the catch in the throat between the syllables of uh-oh in English. In Arabic, it is a full consonant, not just a diacritical mark.

Since Qur'an is written with a qaff and a hamza, it best represents the Arabic the way I write it (plus I've seen it written that way by scholars).

all true ...


but in English we dont have that Q sound ...

 

[stevecanuck]

all true ...


but in English we dont have that Q sound ...

True. It's just a preference for me. Actually, Arabic doesn't have upper/lower case, so I should probably write qur'an.

 

[Rumpel]

True. It's just a preference for me. Actually, Arabic doesn't have upper/lower case, so I should probably write qur'an.

anyway, thanks for your info.
Now I know how to pronounce that word in Arabic!
In English we usually pronounce it in the English way, I think.