Navy Pride
DP Veteran
- Joined
- Jul 11, 2005
- Messages
- 39,883
- Reaction score
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- Location
- Pacific NW
- Gender
- Male
- Political Leaning
- Very Conservative
I think it will all depend on how far it goes, if it stops at ninth circuit, S.F. wins, Supreme court should have to overturn the law but we never know these days if they hear the case at all. I think D.C. has a similar law, but am not quite sure, it isn't right to pass general gun bans though.shuamort said:Good grief! I hope this is declared unconstitutional post haste. That's insane.
Funny that NYC has really strict gun control laws and violent crime is decreasing dramatically every year, yet Miami has really LIBERAL gun laws that allow people to carry guns almost anywhere and their crime rate is increasing every year and it is one of the most violent cities in America.LaMidRighter said:I think it will all depend on how far it goes, if it stops at ninth circuit, S.F. wins, Supreme court should have to overturn the law but we never know these days if they hear the case at all. I think D.C. has a similar law, but am not quite sure, it isn't right to pass general gun bans though.
LaMidRighter said:I think it will all depend on how far it goes, if it stops at ninth circuit, S.F. wins, Supreme court should have to overturn the law but we never know these days if they hear the case at all. I think D.C. has a similar law, but am not quite sure, it isn't right to pass general gun bans though.
I understand where you are coming from here, California is basically becoming a write off state, but, the principle is the same in either case, Bill of Rights issues should be taken very seriously and certainly protected vigilantly, states have no right to violate legal gun ownership in the same way that they cannot censor harmless speech, unfortunately though you are right about the court and the eminent domain case, that was a joke, meaning we should fight it even more dilligently.debate_junkie said:But playing devil's advocate a moment, if the people of SF are STUPID enough to vote for such a ludicrous measure... shouldn't they be allowed to live in their own stupidity? And I don't know the SC would overturn it. They've decided to allow any state or municipal government in the country take property under the guise of "the public good" what's to stop them from finding a reason to uphold the law? And before you say it... anymore these days Constitution's don't always apply..Sorry, which issue are you referring to?just ask the PA State Supreme Court and legislature. They've probably forgotten what that document is.
Come on Champs, it's more than gun control, look at New Orleans, they brought up suit against the gun companies and also have strict gun control policies, such as any city does, yet crime was already a problem before the after hurricane chaos. Most of the time you have to adress the criminal and not the means of commission, Miami doesn't exactly have ready access to firearms either. All banning guns will do is insure that the criminals have sole access to them, criminals don't follow the law, so therefore adding more laws means just one more statute to ignore, and getting street guns isn't exactly that hard to do, they are prevelant in fact anywhere you want them and even easier to obtain in shipping areas like the coast.26 X World Champs said:Funny that NYC has really strict gun control laws and violent crime is decreasing dramatically every year, yet Miami has really LIBERAL gun laws that allow people to carry guns almost anywhere and their crime rate is increasing every year and it is one of the most violent cities in America.
Coincidence?
LaMidRighter said:I understand where you are coming from here, California is basically becoming a write off state, but, the principle is the same in either case, Bill of Rights issues should be taken very seriously and certainly protected vigilantly, states have no right to violate legal gun ownership in the same way that they cannot censor harmless speech, unfortunately though you are right about the court and the eminent domain case, that was a joke, meaning we should fight it even more dilligently. Sorry, which issue are you referring to?
Some internal passage of legislation. They have resorted to "caucas" where they iron out the details of proposed legislation, and then pass them in the dead of night, with no public debate. A slots bill, a legislative payraise, including an "unvouchered" expense that they could take, when it's against the PA constitution for legislatures to take their pay hike during a current term.
The reason I used that reference, is because many people want to believe the Supreme Court, Federally and at the state level, uphold the consititutions of the states, and of the land... and yet, the PA Supreme Court has let the legislature of this state ignore the Constitution, and they simply look the other way.
debate_junkie said:Thank you for the clarification. That surely isn't right, I believe the legislature has the duty to provide the public with a public outlet for information and discourse, an uninformed public has no power to select the proper path or representation and that is by it's nature unethical and improper if it is constitutional.LaMidRighter said:Some internal passage of legislation. They have resorted to "caucas" where they iron out the details of proposed legislation, and then pass them in the dead of night, with no public debate. A slots bill, a legislative payraise, including an "unvouchered" expense that they could take, when it's against the PA constitution for legislatures to take their pay hike during a current term.
I believe this is a failure to properly educate the masses as to the role of the court, I feel that we as a society have developed a blind trust in the high court because we are taught the principles and protocol of the court, yet not the scope of their authority and the consequences of their interpretations or overreach of authority.The reason I used that reference, is because many people want to believe the Supreme Court, Federally and at the state level, uphold the consititutions of the states, and of the land... and yet, the PA Supreme Court has let the legislature of this state ignore the Constitution, and they simply look the other way.
LaMidRighter said:debate_junkie said:Thank you for the clarification. That surely isn't right, I believe the legislature has the duty to provide the public with a public outlet for information and discourse, an uninformed public has no power to select the proper path or representation and that is by it's nature unethical and improper if it is constitutional.
I believe this is a failure to properly educate the masses as to the role of the court, I feel that we as a society have developed a blind trust in the high court because we are taught the principles and protocol of the court, yet not the scope of their authority and the consequences of their interpretations or overreach of authority.
Well, the sleeping electorate in PA finally woke up. 1 of 2 Justices was denied retention for the SC. He is done in January. The legislature is on notice. Next year... GAME OVER!
Funny, the links I find say just the opposite......26 X World Champs said:Funny that NYC has really strict gun control laws and violent crime is decreasing dramatically every year, yet Miami has really LIBERAL gun laws that allow people to carry guns almost anywhere and their crime rate is increasing every year and it is one of the most violent cities in America.
Coincidence?
Oh really? Well since you chose to not post any facts at all, I've chosen to post the facts about crime in NYC vs. the national average. Keep in mind that for those of you living outside of NYC you most likely believe that NYC is crime ridden, a scary place, dangerous, etc. The truth is that NYC has become one of the safest cities in America. When you send your children away to college in another city you have to warn them about crime because living in Manhattan they are not exposed to it very often, if it all.UtahBill said:Funny, the links I find say just the opposite......
Cities favoring strict gun control have higher crime rates, while those areas where the average citizen is likely to own a gun, the crime rate is low in comparison.
Besides, increasing, or decreasing rate is not the issue. It is the comparison of crime events between cities that matters.
Did you forget my advice again Navy? Try posting the exact opposite of what your brain is telling you is the truth and you'll get it right! You see your post is again, totally wrong....:wsNavy Pride said:It only makes sense that in states when there are restrictions on hand guns that the crime rate would be higher........The restrictions mean nothing to the criminals........They are not going to abide by them or turn in their hand guns..............
These laws only make it easier for criminals to commit crimes on law abiding citizens.......
It does not surprise me that this was passed in SF.
Well, it seems that NYC is becoming safer. I wonder how it would look in a running 5 year average?26 X World Champs said:FACTS re NYC:
NYC is ranked the 16th SAFEST city in the USA. Surprised? Viriginia Beach is the safest city. Oh yeah....San Francisco is #15...coincidence?
The bottom 4 are Las Vegas, Baltimore, Detroit & Atlanta. Gun control laws in those states are what compared to NY & California? Did I mention that SAn Jose is the the 2nd safest, San Diego #6.
Think Minneapolis is safe? Nope, #30. Chicago? #34. Philadelphia? #37. How about the home city of intelligent design, Kansas City? #38!
For murders, you know violent crimes with GUNS, NYC is #14, San Jose #1, San Francisco #16. Miami is #38, New Orleans #48, Dallas #36. Oh yeah, Boston, in the great state of Massachussetts with really strict gun control laws is #12. How about Phoenix in Arizona, another state that loves guns, is #33.
Source: http://www.citymayors.com/society/uscities_safest.html
New York has become safer every single year for about 15 years now. At one time in our not too distant past there were over 3000 murders committed in one year. In 2003 it was down to 597 and in 2004 under 500. This is dramatic, not an anamoly.UtahBill said:Well, it seems that NYC is becoming safer. I wonder how it would look in a running 5 year average?
Part of the info is skewed a bit when you look at this kind of thing.
Yeah, case closed alright....:shock:Navy Pride said:I personally have 2 hand guns and 2 rifles in my home.......I use the rifles for hunting......I have taught my family how to use the handguns and would never give up my 2nd amendment right and turn them in.............I use the pistols for taget practice and to protect my family.........
God forbid if we ever have a natural disaster here and the scum of the earth come out of their holes and start looting and committing crimes they will have to answer to me if the invade my property.......If my wife is alone and someone trys to break into my home she knows how to use my handguns and will blow the scum heads off.............
Case closed............
Dude, you might want to rethink that remark or do you think that Gays are less criminally inclined than heteros?Binary_Digit said:By that logic, San Francisco is "safer" because more gays live there.
Right! The Gun Lobby doesn't even want you to have to register your gun or go through a background check before buying one!Deegan said:Well you can still own a rifle right, what's the problem then, you can still protect your property, and family?
26 X World Champs said:Right! The Gun Lobby doesn't even want you to have to register your gun or go through a background check before buying one!
I do not know anyone that owns a gun, nor do I know anyone whose ever committed a crime with a gun or had the need to prevent a crime with a gun. The convoluted logic of 'defending' my home with a gun is psycho IMHO, but that's just me.
I really think it's a penis envy thing....
I think it's fair to say that there's a direct correlation to violent gun deaths and guns. In the USA we have more guns than anywhere else, and way more murders per capita than anywhere else.Deegan said:I would disagree with it being "psycho", there are bad, crazy, and sick people out there, and they have been known to break in peoples homes, and ubduct their children, rape their women, or just rob you then kill all the witnesses! If a gun makes you feel more safe, you should be able to keep one, I just don't think you need a hand gun. Sure, some folks just have guns to boost their ego's, some use them to intimidate, and that's why I don't like hand guns, because you never know when someone has one.
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