THE PANIC OVER TRANS SPORTS INCLUSION

[CLAX1911]

There is plenty of information about chromosomes, sexuality, gender and sexual preferences.
The real lack of knowledge comes from irrational beliefs that are presented as "fact".

Humans can't change their sex.

 

[Lisa]

Gender is still a socal construct.

No its not a social construct. The expression of our gender is socially determined but our gender identity itself is not socially constructed. John Money answered that with the nature(innate) vs nurture(learned) experiment of David/Brenda Reimer. Money was convinced, like you, that it was learned and set out to prove it his by giving a toddler a sex change and then pumping him with female hormones along with having his brother and family treat him as a girl, both socially and sexually(ick). If his ideas were correct David/Brenda would have lived happily as Brenda and never ever thought or wanted to be a boy but that didn't happen. David learned about the age of 13 that he was born a boy and detransitioned back to male from John Moneys sick/twisted experiment. He died by suicide 20 years later because of the physical and emotional trauma that Money inflicted.

that's a contrived conclusion. It assumes gender identity trumps sex. He proved unwittingly that it doesn't.

Gender identity does trump sex in importance.

Yes I do. It's identity with a gender. Nothing more.

Your posts read like a student who didn't studly before an essay exam but somehow you keep blindly writing anything that comes to mind hoping that something that you say might get you half credit.

You are a cisgender male which means that both your gender idneity and your sex are male. Your gender identity is likely something that you have never questioned/considered because its the same as your sex.

 

[CANON]

Humans can't change their sex.

Evidence?

 

[CLAX1911]

No its not a social construct.

I disagree. Deal with it

Gender identity does trump sex in importance.

if that was true there would be no sexual orientation.

You are a cisgender male which means that both your gender idneity and your sex are male. Your gender identity is likely something that you have never questioned/considered because its the same as your sex.

I've heard all of this rationalization before it wasn't true the first time you said it it will not be true any subsequent time you say it. I have no gender identity I have no need for one.

 

[CLAX1911]

Evidence?

The entire history of humanity and not a single individual ever changed their sex.

 

[CANON]

The entire history of humanity and not a single individual ever changed their sex.

So where's your proof?

 

[CLAX1911]

So where's your proof?

Do leprechauns exist?

 

[CANON]

Do leprechauns exist?

We can discuss that after you provide proof, or any evidence of your claim. I am simply asking for the same effort that you have asked others to put forth. Do you not have proof or any evidence of your claims?

 

[CLAX1911]

We can discuss that after you provide proof, or any evidence of your claim.

It's a negative claim. Sequential hermaphrodites don't exist in the human species.

Sequential hermaphroditism - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

Like saying leprechauns don't exist. You are burdened with proving they do.

I am simply asking for the same effort that you have asked others to put forth.

It's a negative claim.

Do you not have proof or any evidence of your claims?

You have to show proof that it happens.

You are trying to apply a burden of proof to me that I simply don't carry.

 

[Lisa]

I disagree. Deal with it

That is a utterly brilliant rebuttal to facts.

if that was true there would be no sexual orientation.

I didn't deny that sexual orientation exists. They are very different. Sex and gender identity exist but gender identity is more important than bio' sex in the hierarchy of human sexuality in accurately describing who a person is. Why is this such a problem for you?

Trans people very much have a sexual orientation. They can be gay/les, bi, or hetero. Even asexual occasionally.

I've heard all of this rationalization before it wasn't true the first time you said it it will not be true any subsequent time you say it. I have no gender identity I have no need for one.

You very much have a gender identity. You would be a medical miracle if you didn't have a gender idnetity. Is the idea that you have a gender identity threatening to you in some core way of who you are? Your gender idneity is the same as your biological sex. That is why you are cisgender male because they are both the same. Unless you dont want them to be the same, but you dont want to discuss it right now.

 

[CANON]

It's a negative claim. Sequential hermaphrodites don't exist in the human species.

Sequential hermaphroditism - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

Like saying leprechauns don't exist. You are burdened with proving they do.
It's a negative claim. You have to show proof that it happens.

You are trying to apply a burden of proof to me that I simply don't carry.

Okay, so you don’t have proof, or evidence - just excuses.

Why are you not applying that same logic to Imane Khelif? Prove that she is what you believe to be true, provide what evidence you have.

 

[CLAX1911]

That is a utterly brilliant rebuttal to facts.

Beliefs but opinion noted.

I didn't deny that sexual orientation exists.

You really did you just don't understand why.

They are very different. Sex and gender identity exist but gender identity is more important than bio' sex in the hierarchy of human sexuality in accurately describing who a person is. Why is this such a problem for you?

Nope gain choices are largely but relevant.

Trans people very much have a sexual orientation.

Yeah trans women that like men are gay because they are men that want to be with men.

They can be gay/les, bi, or hetero. Even asexual occasionally.

Yeah and gender identity doesn't mean anything to any of this.

You very much have a gender identity. You would be a medical miracle if you didn't have a gender idnetity.

Well I guess I do have a gender identity but it's because of my sex

Is the idea that you have a gender identity threatening to you in some core way of who you are?

no it's largely meaningless.

Your gender idneity is the same as your biological sex.

no my gender identity exists because of my sex. The only reason I tell people I'm a man is because I have a dick. It's not because of this inner identity nonsense.

That is why you are cisgender male because they are both the same.

male is sufficient. The only time you need to distinguish someone is Trans is if they're trans.

Unless you dont want them to be the same, but you dont want to discuss it right now.

they're the same because one follows the other. I don't identify as a man because of some inner concept of gender identity. I identify as a man because I have a penis. And before you tell me no you don't you better have some proof. You need to prove to me that I identify as a man or some other reason where I'm sitting I would know infinitely better than you.

 

[CLAX1911]

Okay, so you don’t have proof,

It's a negative claim. So I'm excused whether you know what that is or not.

Burden of proof (philosophy) - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

Look under the heading proving a negative I don't have to prove a negative. It's not my burden of proof.

 

[MrNiceGuy]

Interesting presentation -

 

[MrNiceGuy]

Beliefs but opinion noted.

You really did you just don't understand why.
Nope gain choices are largely but relevant.
Yeah trans women that like men are gay because they are men that want to be with men.
Yeah and gender identity doesn't mean anything to any of this.

Well I guess I do have a gender identity but it's because of my sex
no it's largely meaningless.
no my gender identity exists because of my sex. The only reason I tell people I'm a man is because I have a dick. It's not because of this inner identity nonsense.
male is sufficient. The only time you need to distinguish someone is Trans is if they're trans.


they're the same because one follows the other. I don't identify as a man because of some inner concept of gender identity. I identify as a man because I have a penis. And before you tell me no you don't you better have some proof. You need to prove to me that I identify as a man or some other reason where I'm sitting I would know infinitely better than you.

To expand on your point, I do not recognize a "gender" identity. I have an identity. It's me. My personal identity, and as part of that identity have a sex. I find I have sexual attraction to females. I have a certain education, experience, and personality, and that is my identity. I do not, however, feel like some defined gender identity of "man" or "woman" at all - I just am a man -- I am a human male, and I'm an adult. I'm a man. That's it. I don't know how any women feel, so it's impossible for me to honestly say I feel like a woman. I wouldn't know. For all I know, my dysphoria in that regard would be causing me to think I feel like a woman, but I can never ever know that I really do feel like women feel.

This is all manufactured horse shit. And, the day is coming soon, I hope, when this fad ends. It's damaging children, and causing them to have high rates of mental issues, and they are being brainwashed into a narcissistic navel-gazing extravaganza that causes anxiety and depression at huge rates. That seems to be intentional.

 

[MrNiceGuy]

 

[CLAX1911]

To expand on your point, I do not recognize a "gender" identity. I have an identity. It's me. My personal identity, and as part of that identity have a sex. I find I have sexual attraction to females. I have a certain education, experience, and personality, and that is my identity. I do not, however, feel like some defined gender identity of "man" or "woman" at all - I just am a man -- I am a human male, and I'm an adult. I'm a man. That's it. I don't know how any women feel, so it's impossible for me to honestly say I feel like a woman. I wouldn't know. For all I know, my dysphoria in that regard would be causing me to think I feel like a woman, but I can never ever know that I really do feel like women feel.

I can accept gender identity it's just that I identify as the gender that I am because of my sex. When I was a child I was told I was a boy because I had a penis and girls had something else and I was okay with it. I didn't have like rigid parents that said that's not something boys do. I was a boy because of my anatomy and anything I did was what boys do.

He said was a bit of confusion when I realized I was gay and doesn't matter of reality that's gender non-conforming. If I was conforming to gender I would be straight. Ivory gender as a sex role nothing more. How did the postmodernist with this I don't think there's such a thing. But then again I'm not married to all and that sort of thing changes.

This is all manufactured horse shit. And, the day is coming soon, I hope, when this fad ends. It's damaging children, and causing them to have high rates of mental issues, and they are being brainwashed into a narcissistic navel-gazing extravaganza that causes anxiety and depression at huge rates. That seems to be intentional.

The parts of this that are new is the widespread popularity and that will go out of fashion and the assistant that someone born male is a woman. Other than that there has been minute with this women and women who have with his men for centuries possibly longer. But they're closing of tavistock is it encouraging thing.

 

[Spock]

Humans can't change their sex.

The problem with this sort of statement is your assumptions about what the word "sex" means.

 

[Spock]

Anytime you mention anything dealing with gender even if it is gender identity you are talking about a social construct

A "social construct" is an external perception imposed upon individuals by a community.
Race, for example, is a social construct.
Gender identity perceived by the individual is not a social construct any more than a person's psychology (id, ego, or superego) is a social construct.
Gender assigned by the observations of others would be a social construct.

 

[Spock]

To expand on your point, I do not recognize a "gender" identity. I have an identity. It's me. My personal identity, and as part of that identity have a sex. I find I have sexual attraction to females. I have a certain education, experience, and personality, and that is my identity. I do not, however, feel like some defined gender identity of "man" or "woman" at all - I just am a man -- I am a human male, and I'm an adult. I'm a man. That's it. I don't know how any women feel, so it's impossible for me to honestly say I feel like a woman. I wouldn't know. For all I know, my dysphoria in that regard would be causing me to think I feel like a woman, but I can never ever know that I really do feel like women feel.

Very confused and inconsistent commentary. IMO, you are demonstrating the classic failure to understand circumstances that are outside your comfort zone. This sort of rationalization of bigotry has occurred go justify opposition in the 50's to miscegenation; in the 60's to desegregation and anti-discrimination attempts; in 70's in opposition to women's liberation; and in the 80's-90's with decriminalization of homosexuality.

This is all manufactured horse shit. And, the day is coming soon, I hope, when this fad ends. It's damaging children, and causing them to have high rates of mental issues, and they are being brainwashed into a narcissistic navel-gazing extravaganza that causes anxiety and depression at huge rates. That seems to be intentional.

Not manufactured at all. Transgender conditions have existed literally for thousands of years of recorded human history.

 

[CLAX1911]

A "social construct" is an external perception imposed upon individuals by a community.
Race, for example, is a social construct.
Gender identity perceived by the individual is not a social construct any more than a person's psychology (id, ego, or superego) is a social construct.
Gender assigned by the observations of others would be a social construct.

Identity with a social construct is in identity with gender requires learning about the social construct. Yes it's part of a person's psychology but psychology develops it's not just what you were born with otherwise trauma wouldn't make a difference.

 

[CLAX1911]

The problem with this sort of statement is your assumptions about what the word "sex" means.

That's fine I'll define the term as the way I'm using it. Sex means either one of two types based on presences of structures that would be used in procreation. That means if you have a vagina ovaries even if you don't have ovaries a uterus Fallopian tubes and so forth you're female and if you're my only have a penis and testicles.

That's what I mean by sex.

 

[Spock]

Identity with a social construct is in identity with gender requires learning about the social construct. Yes it's part of a person's psychology but psychology develops it's not just what you were born with otherwise trauma wouldn't make a difference.

Not making a lot of sense there.

 

[Spock]

That's fine I'll define the term as the way I'm using it. Sex means either one of two types based on presences of structures that would be used in procreation. That means if you have a vagina ovaries even if you don't have ovaries a uterus Fallopian tubes and so forth you're female and if you're my only have a penis and testicles.

That's what I mean by sex.

What are the myriad variations in sexual morphology due to genetic or metabolic variations to be labelled and why do some people conceptualize their identity differently from the categories you have created?

 

[CLAX1911]

Not making a lot of sense there.

Psychology is something that is developed. Gender identity is identity with the gender unless it means something else.

Gender is a social construct that you have to learn about in order to identify with it.

It cannot be something you're born with.