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the awful truth about tax cuts



The awful truth about not knowing what you are talking about...

From your sourced article of "PROOF" Extending all of the 2001 and 2003 tax cuts permanently would cost $3.3 trillion over 10
years,
Or or the math challenge 330B anually.

We are running running 2T dollar deficits YEARLY! Or about 20T in deficit spending over that same period

With NOT EXTENDING, your article says we will be at a deficit in 2020 about 69% of GDP!

WHAT IS THE PROOF YOU ARE TRYING TO SHOW?

What is the Liberal Response to this stupidity?
 

it's in the article i posted. didn't you read it? you sound orwellian. btw, did you forget about the wars we are not paying for?

i remember in the old days medical experts said to starve a cold [no fluids or liquids]. that's the same logic tax cotters are using to drop the deficit.
 

Expenses are expenses, income is income... I am not discussing war, i am discussing the article you posted as proof that it is not a spending issue. The article you presented as proof on page 3 shows a graph of the US in debt on an upward projection of 69% of GDP in 2020 WITHOUT EXTENSIONS OF ANY TAX CUTS! This is your article not mine.

The article on page 1 states "while extending the cuts for everybody would cost $3.3 trillion over the same [10 year] period" OR APX 330B per year. We are spending 2T in deficit yearly.

PS the person who wrote your article is an idiot... As we are currently at about 100% of debt to GDP EDIT: and was at about 90% of debt to GDP in 2010 when the article was written, and the article states we were at about 63% of debt to GDP....

US Debt To GDP Hits 98.9% And Rising - Business Insider
 
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No, the reason for our financial mess is the amount of money Congress has chosen to spend in light of the tax cuts. The problem isn't the amount of money coming in -- the problem is the amount of money going out.
 

The Liberal response would be that there will be no one solution to end our deficit problems. Also speaking of math the CBO projected deficit is 1.1 trillion for 2013...that 330 billion is about a third of that! It's nothing to sneeze at!
 
The Liberal response would be that there will be no one solution to end our deficit problems. Also speaking of math the CBO projected deficit is 1.1 trillion for 2013...that 330 billion is about a third of that! It's nothing to sneeze at!

I agree that 1/3 is a good start. However, this is his proof that lower tax rates are causing the deficit and it is not spending related... With higher taxes we are still spending about 850B more than we take in with no end in sight to deficit spending.
 
No, the reason for our financial mess is the amount of money Congress has chosen to spend in light of the tax cuts. The problem isn't the amount of money coming in -- the problem is the amount of money going out.

yeah it's part of the reagan legacy which even the dems bought into,

Borrowing money for tax cuts is just silly.
 
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Well hopefully this economic malaise and the ending of the Afghanistan war will put a huge dent in the deficit as well.

Medical cost overall is by far the scariest long term problem for our budget in my opinion.
 
yeah it's part of the reafgan legacy which even the dems bought into,

Borrowing money for tax cuts is just silly.

What percentage of YOUR salary do you feel should go to the federal government?
 

Oh yeah don't talk about a war that we borrow to carry on. it has absolutely nothing yo do with the deficit. Yeah right.
 
Oh yeah don't talk about a war that we borrow to carry on. it has absolutely nothing yo do with the deficit. Yeah right.

Does your article assume "The War" will still be ongoing in 2020? Because it does not state that. It only shows an upward trendline for debt to GDP regardless of the projected imposed tax.

You said spending is not the issue, it is taxes and here's the proof. Your proof is garbage. If you want to discuss the war, then start that thread of the cost of the war and it's impact on the deficit VS the cost of ending the war, and lower government spending - a hallmark of liberal thinking.

I think we need to cut spending EVERYWHERE and be on a path to balance the budget.

You still never said what percentage of your salary should go directly to the federal government in the form of FEDERAL INCOME TAX.
 

i did too look at prior posta
 
What percentage of YOUR salary do you feel should go to the federal government?

None I am on SS. Your turn.

I could not have said it any better. I think the term is "leach".

Don't tell me what I should pay if you are not willing to pay 1 penny and expect me to support you. I have no respect for you.

Where is the "SHARED SACRIFICE"?

You complain about the deficit but care do to nothing but add to it.

Notice no one, not even the liberals come to your defense on this one!


Nor did you discuss any of the points in the post

Does your article assume "The War" will still be ongoing in 2020? Because it does not state that. It only shows an upward trendline for debt to GDP regardless of the projected imposed tax.

You said spending is not the issue, it is taxes and here's the proof. Your proof is garbage. If you want to discuss the war, then start that thread of the cost of the war and it's impact on the deficit VS the cost of ending the war, and lower government spending - a hallmark of liberal thinking.

I think we need to cut spending EVERYWHERE and be on a path to balance the budget.
 
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Revenues have averaged 18.1% of GDP for forty years, regardless of marginal tax rates.

Two things can cause debt to skyrocket, and both at the same time can cause it to double-skyrocket.

1) If CBO revenue projections---that we'll by able to boost revenue-as-%-of-GDP to significantly above historical average for an extended period of time---fail to happen, debt will explode.

2) If CBO outlay projections---that we'll be able to significantly reduce expenditures (even though there's no legitimate plan to do so)---fail to happen, debt will explode.

If both CBO projections don't really come true (we don't sufficiently decrease spending and we don't sufficiently raise revenues as percent of GDP), we're completely ****ed.

Raising tax rates does not guarantee much greater revenue as percent of GDP, because it's a dynamic system. Revenues jumped when Clinton was in office concurrently with tax rate CUTS to capital gains. So WTF? Tax rate cuts and hikes affect revenue, certainly, but in dynamic and not always predictable ways. Tax cuts can stimulate economic activity resulting in greater revenues, in some cases, and tax rate hikes can deter economic activity and lead to dwindling revenues, in some cases. Dynamic. We've had varying tax rates for a long time and not necessarily had meaningfully higher revenue as a percent of our GDP.

Meaningfully increasing our revenues depends most heavily on our ability to experience another economic boom. Deficit spending does not create economic booms we need to recover our deficit spending -- that is a losing game.
 
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So we should raise all taxes back to their highest level because that solves everything right? Wait. No. We should just go back to the highest rate for the rich. Because they're the only ones accountable or responsible for sustaining this country for the future.
 
The reason we have such a high deficit is not because of welfare programs, like the rich republicans would have you belive, but because the scam called tax cuts started by reagan and greenspan.
No... the reason the deficit is so high is because of the millions of people who either can't find a job or who have given up altogether - millions of potential taxpayers for which we extend unemployment, offer food stamps, and assure them month to month that the jobs are just around the corner. Priority #1 in reducing the deficit is getting people back to work, which will both increase revenue and reduce spending.

Each month that goes by we celebrate a tiny gain in employment and say sianara forever to a couple of trillion potential man-hours and all the ways those could have been used to benefit our country.
 

I have already payed more than my fair share. It's the law and you should respect it like a good conservative that you are.
 

The liberal avenger likes what you wrote... he either doesn't understand his own point or yours
 

It started with bush who squandered clinton's surplus and started a personal war against iraq.
 

Your ideas to reduce spending involve spending more. Spending more is not a reduction in spending. It's a gamble that spending more today will make you more able to pay it off (and then some) tomorrow. We stand to lose significantly when we gamble against our children's security to maximize our benefit today.

Look, in THEORY, demand creates jobs and jobs create demand. But that doesn't mean we can invent jobs out of nowhere, funded by taxes, for the sake of there being jobs, or put money in people's pockets (to stir up demand) for the sake of them spending money, and act like that automatically results in a net-positive scenario.

Labor is something that is either demanded or it's not. Private sector employment is the generation of economic activity, and we employ people here if there is consumer demand for the things that American labor produces. There isn't, not sufficiently. Consumers don't demand the types of things that incentivize hiring more American workers. "So make government the employer of last resort," you say. That fundamentally does not work, because the taxpayer is shouldering all the cost and the risk to create a job is not demanded enough for the private sector to see any need to create a job for it, so it is by definition a net inefficiency in the market. It takes more money out of the tax revenue pool to create the undesired job than the job returns to the system in productivity.

So then you look to consumer demand and allege that Americans aren't buying enough. With a relatively weak savings rate like we have, that's a tough thing to argue. How do you look someone in the eye who's living paycheck-to-paycheck and tell them they're not spending enough? Do you want them to borrow money in order to spend it immediately? That's going to create another credit bubble and cause pain for them later (not much later, even).

Long story short, we can't force economic prosperity into being through government policy. Government spending initiatives have the potential to lead to positive economic outcomes, but that depends on a litany of variables and ultimately the success of stimulus-and-welfare spending depends on whether we experience an economic boom shortly thereafter. If we don't, we've lost our traction and it is that much harder to even break even with our previous spending scheme.
 
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:dohtoo prolix to understand but i liked it anyway
 
:dohtoo prolix to understand but i liked it anyway

:shrug: It has to be explained piece-by-piece to the folks advocating increasing spending as a means to get to a place where we don't have to keep increasing spending. It's like a gambler asking you for more money. "If you just give me a little more, I'll win big this time, I swear." Possible? Technically. Probable? :thumbdown
 
What percentage of YOUR salary do you feel should go to the federal government?

Note a penny of my income, but all of yours, at least to the point that you are at the poverty level. that would be a good start.

Seriously, there is no particular percent, so I would suggest that as little as possible, and still be able to have a functioning government that can continue to be functioning as long as I live.
 
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