The Amsterdam Hooligans: Israel In a Nutshell

[stevecanuck]

You're right , I don't believe you …….

LOL! All righty then.

 

[stevecanuck]

Well, let's say there is a certain extent to my "botherment" in that I go by what those Muslims that I've encountered in life, both in their own countries and elsewhere, show as behavior.

Fair enough, but be aware that those who do treat you (or secretly think of you - and how would you know?) as the worst of God's creatures do so because their god has said exactly that about you as a non-Muslim.

Those that feel I should be eradicated on account of not being of their faith can expect the back of my hand and, on those very rare occasions where that occurred, have received it (and worse).

OTH those that have interpreted their faith as making no allowance for any such behavior (towards me and mine), have and always have had my respect.

I see no wiggle room for interpreting the Quran's message as live-and-let-live. Non-compliance with Allah's message of hate is, IMO, what you're seeing when Muslims respect non-Muslims.

It's necessary to add here that I've kept my own lack of ANY religious faith more under wraps when in Muslim countries, than I would have "in the West", simply because I don't go shitting all over any house that I happen to be guest in.

Then again I'm not prone to argue religion with someone of faith even in my own house, long since having recognized my few past excursion into the corresponding forum here as having been entirely my own mistake and fault.

I hold a similar stance towards sharks in that I stay out of their waters as long as they stay out of my pub.

I just heard a shark order a pint at the far end of the bar.

In Canada alone, 20 people have been arrested in the last 3ish years for planning terrorist activity. We have been extremely lucky so far. It won't last.

 

[oneworld2]

We all see that all you do is bash Israel. AT some point a common thread appears. Hatred of Jews.

Your ignorance of the terminology and your hopelessly obvious goading posts are offering nothing to the sub forum and that you think people don't notice this should be embarrassing for you.

 

[oneworld2]

Points?

You mean shit like this >>> The truth about 7th October will never come out because the Israeli side has blocked any investigation and buried much of the evidence <<<

The point is valid ( note not "shit") because it is supported by the facts.

You also dodged the point about Palestinians having the same right as others to resist an illegal occupation.

See how easy it is to undermine your self promoting bs?

 

[oneworld2]

LOL! All righty then.

The obvious bigotry in your positions undermines your claims.

No wonder you never addressed the post.

In fact that's the history of our exchanges, you single out some event/action carried out by Muslims in response to something and I undermine it by giving examples of the same or similar by none Muslims. ( IE the bigoted presentation is rubbished)

Then you disappear from the discussion.

People need only to notice this in order to dispel, with utter contempt, the rationale you tried to give for your reading of the Quran and the use of it to spread Islamophobic rhetoric/sentiments.

 

[Chagos]

Fair enough, but be aware that those who do treat you (or secretly think of you - and how would you know?) as the worst of God's creatures do so because their god has said exactly that about you as a non-Muslim.

since you mention the "how do you know" angle, right back atcha, amigo. But yeah, if they wish to have such secret attitudes converted into action towards me or my neighborhood, they'd better send unmarried orphans that have no kids.

I see no wiggle room for interpreting the Quran's message as live-and-let-live. Non-compliance with Allah's message of hate is, IMO, what you're seeing when Muslims respect non-Muslims.

So let it be non-compliance or not, heretics are my favorite people anyway.

I just heard a shark order a pint at the far end of the bar.

Well, I neither take nor even need loans and YOU should maybe order your drinks a good distance from any pool.

In Canada alone, 20 people have been arrested in the last 3ish years for planning terrorist activity. We have been extremely lucky so far. It won't last.

Oh, that's frequently been happening here in Spain as well, much as in the rest of Europe.

Still doesn't have me (figuratively speaking) pull a gun on anyone I meet and can identify as a Muslim. Certainly not on those Moroccans that recently re-roofed my porch.

 

[oneworld2]

In Canada alone, 20 people have been arrested in the last 3ish years for planning terrorist activity. We have been extremely lucky so far. It won't last.

Maybe you should ask why that would be the case and if it applies to other groups of people.

But you won't for obvious reasons.

Whatever terrorism Muslims have managed to attack the West with, it is massively , massively dwarfed by the state terrorism dished out to Muslims around the globe by the West and it's allies.

Yet I never hear you say that terrorism must be in the Wests DNA and we both know why.

 

[Bodi]

Your ignorance of the terminology and your hopelessly obvious goading posts are offering nothing to the sub forum and that you think people don't notice this should be embarrassing for you.

 

[stevecanuck]

since you mention the "how do you know" angle, right back atcha, amigo. But yeah, if they wish to have such secret attitudes converted into action towards me or my neighborhood, they'd better send unmarried orphans that have no kids.

So let it be non-compliance or not, heretics are my favorite people anyway.

Well, I neither take nor even need loans and YOU should maybe order your drinks a good distance from any pool.

Oh, that's frequently been happening here in Spain as well, much as in the rest of Europe.

Still doesn't have me (figuratively speaking) pull a gun on anyone I meet and can identify as a Muslim. Certainly not on those Moroccans that recently re-roofed my porch.

My point being that Islamic extremism is spreading and growing. It's a cancer that is slowly but surely metastasising before our eyes - and all in accordance with the commands in the Quran and the example set by Mohamed and the first Muslims. Am I getting that wrong?

 

[Chagos]

My point being that Islamic extremism is spreading and growing. It's a cancer that is slowly but surely metastasising before our eyes - and all in accordance with the commands in the Quran and the example set by Mohamed and the first Muslims. Am I getting that wrong?

Your point does not contravene MY point on how I conduct myself with and towards Muslims in general.

In fact both points are totally separate and should not be held in juxtaposition, certainly not to the point of cancelling each other out.

 

[stevecanuck]

Your point does not contravene MY point on how I conduct myself with and towards Muslims in general.

In fact both points are totally separate and should not be held in juxtaposition, certainly not to the point of cancelling each other out.

All good.

 

[oneworld2]

My point being that Islamic extremism is spreading and growing.

But you don't want to see it as a reaction to western imperialist actions which it surely is.

To you it is innate to Islams DNA but you don't want to ascribe the massively more destructive and dangerous actions of the countries which make up the West and its allies as being innate in the DNA of those people.

We both know why you refuse to do this, because if you apply standards equally then bigoted positions don't tend to stand the challenge

It's a cancer that is slowly but surely metastasising before our eyes -

Really.

Maybe the destruction of Iraq and the further destruction of Afghanistan might have played a role in that ?

Maybe the Wests actions to get rid of Muslim leaders that refuse to bow to them plays a part in that too.

Libya is in chaos, Syria is in chaos, Iraq is in chaos, Palestine is in chaos and many of the rest have western backed autocrats ruling over them

and all in accordance with the commands in the Quran and the example set by Mohamed and the first Muslims. Am I getting that wrong?

The first Christians that arrived in the Americas, did they not kill as many of the locals they encountered and worked to enslave the rest of them?

What was their record in Africa? What is their legacy in Africa?

What was their record in Asia ?

But it magically seems to not matter in your perspective, as you single out only Muslims, it's not in Christian DNA or western capitalism.

Just the muzzies who you tried so desperately tried to defend by ignoring the entire history of humanity.

That's some bs story if ever there was one!!!

 

[stevecanuck]

Your point does not contravene MY point on how I conduct myself with and towards Muslims in general.

In fact both points are totally separate and should not be held in juxtaposition, certainly not to the point of cancelling each other out.

Now for the tricky bit. While I agree that individual Muslims, just like everyone else, should be judged on their actions, IMO, they can have a dangerous mob mentality when gathered in suffucient numbers. When I lived in Egypt, we heard of occasional mob murders of Christians, and we were warned not to travel to certain areas because of increased militancy. In Pakistan, suspected blasphemers are beaten to death before they can make it to court. The police chief in Berlin warned Jews and gays to hide their identites in Muslim neighborhoods. It's getting worse and it's never going to get better. NEVER. Islam is on the move. I'm afraid we're back to "First they came for the Jews .........."

MSN

 

[Craig234]

Maybe the Wests actions to get rid of Muslim leaders that refuse to bow to them plays a part in that too.

This came to a head with Nasser, who wanted to unite the region, and was fought by the US unless he'd bow to the US. Similarly when Patrice Lumumba tried to unite Africa - with incoming President Kennedy's support - and Eisenhower had him assassinated to prevent it. How many Americans are aware of any of that?

 

[Fledermaus]

This came to a head with Nasser, who wanted to unite the region, and was fought by the US unless he'd bow to the US. Similarly when Patrice Lumumba tried to unite Africa - with incoming President Kennedy's support - and Eisenhower had him assassinated to prevent it. How many Americans are aware of any of that?

"Later that night, Lumumba, Mpolo, and Okito were driven to an isolated spot where three firing squads had been assembled that were commanded by Belgian contract officer Julien Gat.[140] The orders to murder Lumumba were given by Katangan leaders. The last stage of the execution was personally undertaken by the Belgian contracts led by Police Commissioner Frans Verscheure.[140] Lumumba, Mpolo, and Okito were put up against a tree and shot one at a time. The execution is thought to have taken place on 17 January 1961, between 21:40 and 21:43 according to a later Belgian parliamentary inquiry. Tshombe, two other ministers, and four Belgian officers under the command of the Katangan authorities were present.[140] The bodies were thrown into a shallow grave."

 

[Craig234]

"Later that night, Lumumba, Mpolo, and Okito were driven to an isolated spot where three firing squads had been assembled that were commanded by Belgian contract officer Julien Gat.[140] The orders to murder Lumumba were given by Katangan leaders. The last stage of the execution was personally undertaken by the Belgian contracts led by Police Commissioner Frans Verscheure.[140] Lumumba, Mpolo, and Okito were put up against a tree and shot one at a time. The execution is thought to have taken place on 17 January 1961, between 21:40 and 21:43 according to a later Belgian parliamentary inquiry. Tshombe, two other ministers, and four Belgian officers under the command of the Katangan authorities were present.[140] The bodies were thrown into a shallow grave."

I saw this post. What's your point?

Eisenhower gave the order. Others carried it out. You left out the horrible parts about Lumumba's torture. There are a lot of details you left out, but the details aren't the topic.

 

[Fledermaus]

I saw this post. What's your point?

Eisenhower gave the order. Others carried it out. You left out the horrible parts about Lumumba's torture. There are a lot of details you left out, but the details aren't the topic.

My point is....

"Later that night, Lumumba, Mpolo, and Okito were driven to an isolated spot where three firing squads had been assembled that were commanded by Belgian contract officer Julien Gat.[140] The orders to murder Lumumba were given by Katangan leaders. The last stage of the execution was personally undertaken by the Belgian contracts led by Police Commissioner Frans Verscheure.[140] Lumumba, Mpolo, and Okito were put up against a tree and shot one at a time. The execution is thought to have taken place on 17 January 1961, between 21:40 and 21:43 according to a later Belgian parliamentary inquiry. Tshombe, two other ministers, and four Belgian officers under the command of the Katangan authorities were present.[140] The bodies were thrown into a shallow grave."

 

[oneworld2]

"First they came for the Jews .........."

That's not the first line in Niemoller piece and he was talking about Christians

I know you won't respond because you are seeking to peddle your Islamophobic bigotry unmolested but people should be aware of the truth about what you reference , what you are using it for and why you NEVER want to talk about the crimes/actions of others.

 

[stevecanuck]

That's not the first line in Niemoller piece and he was talking about Christians

I know you won't respond because you are seeking to peddle your Islamophobic bigotry unmolested but people should be aware of the truth about what you reference , what you are using it for and why you NEVER want to talk about the crimes/actions of others.

Why would I ever reply to someone who comes right out and say he doesn't believe me?

Bye.

 

[oneworld2]

Why would I ever reply to someone who comes right out and say he doesn't believe me?

Bye.

You don't have to reply/respond to my posts but as long as I am here I will challenge your promotion of anti Muslim bigotry.

Hello.

 

[Rumpelstil]

This incident really is Israel in a nutshell. Go to another nation, engage in mass fascistic violence, claim to be the victim when you meet resistance, and then have the media cover up for you.

I dis.agree

 

[oneworld2]

I dis.agree

But you make absolutely zero argument to support your position?

 

[Manc Skipper]

Fair enough, but be aware that those who do treat you (or secretly think of you - and how would you know?) as the worst of God's creatures do so because their god has said exactly that about you as a non-Muslim.



I see no wiggle room for interpreting the Quran's message as live-and-let-live. Non-compliance with Allah's message of hate is, IMO, what you're seeing when Muslims respect non-Muslims.



I just heard a shark order a pint at the far end of the bar.

In Canada alone, 20 people have been arrested in the last 3ish years for planning terrorist activity. We have been extremely lucky so far. It won't last.

Your perverse interpretation of the Koran bears no relation to real life as I have experienced it while living and working among people of all faiths and none.
In Britain alone in the last 24 hours 3 neo-Nazis have been jailed for plotting terrorist attacks on Mosqes and individuals. There are bad people out there.

 

[Manc Skipper]

That's not the first line in Niemoller piece and he was talking about Christians

I know you won't respond because you are seeking to peddle your Islamophobic bigotry unmolested but people should be aware of the truth about what you reference , what you are using it for and why you NEVER want to talk about the crimes/actions of others.

Ideed. Niemoller's speech has various versions because he himself varied it depending on the audiences. ,As he spoke to a German audience/congregation of the time in terms of groups they would broadly see as unpopular, such as communists,socialist, or trade unionists. Jews were never at the head of his list at the time.
It still resonates today and activist will co-opt it to include their topical struggles such as Hispanics

 

[stevecanuck]

Your perverse interpretation of the Koran .....

Please give an example of my "perverse interpretation". And be specific. Got that? Specific.