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Supreme Court upholds Tennessee’s ban on gender-affirming care for trans youth

CLAX1911 said:
I agree with much of what you said and including this but I do have to have a little sympathy for the parents. Essentially their apprehension is met with the ultimatum of have a dead daughter or a living son or a dead son in a living daughter.
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This is a false dichotomy. 90% of childhood gender dysphoria resolved naturally by adulthood. It’s not, get your dick chopped off or commit suicide.
 
rahl said:
Meaningless appeal to authority. It isn’t healthcare.
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Yeah this idea of calling this healthcare seems to be a doorway into essentially obliterating childhood.

If I have a 9-year-old that identifies as someone with a face tattoo and he threatens to kill himself unless I let him get a face tattoo that's less harmful than puberty blockers and cross sex hormones.
 
rahl said:
This is a false dichotomy.
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Yes I agree it absolutely is a false dichotomy. Often times these are used to manipulate people.

I just wanted to point out someone made this point to me that when a medical practitioner gives you a false dichotomy and it's essentially you're killing your child or you're doing this weird experiment that for some reason is political.

Losing a child is tragic. Losing them to suicide is probably worse I'm not a parent but I think I would imagine this to be one of my greatest fears if I was.
rahl said:
90% of childhood gender dysphoria resolved naturally by adulthood. It’s not, get your dick chopped off or commit suicide.
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Agreed I think the number of resolutions is probably higher than that but I agree with your point.
 
j brown's body said:
Help me understand the logic. You support a policy that makes their suicide rate go up but express concern for them -
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It has not been determined that this is the case. The only people seeming to make this case seem to have way too much interest in transitioning kids.
j brown's body said:
and with absolutely no evidence that supports youre position.
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There's absolutely no evidence that supports the claim that it's causing suicide to increase.
j brown's body said:
There are no statistics showing that a raft of transgenders oppose the treatment they received because things turned out badly. I have heard of one or two.
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Well I could make this case about children consuming alcohol or marijuana. 80% of the people I know drank alcohol and smoked marijuana before they were 18. The number of times that turned out badly for them out of the people I know is 0%.
j brown's body said:
Your arguments are rife with emotion, as the first sentence in your post above bears out, and a clear lack of knowledge -
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It's not lack of knowledge it's lack of accepting your claims.
j brown's body said:
typified by your suggestion that all the experts just happen to be wrong.
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What makes an expert right?
 
j brown's body said:
So knowing (I assume you know, I can provide a citation if needed) that the suicide rate for young transgenders is high,
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It would suggest that it's probably a good idea not to fit this demographic.

It's more likely that the incongruence that they will always be living in and never being able to measure up to what they're supposed to be causes them depression, then just accepting themselves for who they are.
j brown's body said:
is it surprising that it would go up if an option where evidence of later regret is scant, was eliminated?

Seems like common sense.
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Yeah I'm familiar with manipulation of data to help make things seem like they're common sense.
 
rahl said:
yes. We’ve been over this many times.
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Yes. We have been over your fragility in examining the evidence that shows your claims to be false. Here it is again. Continue being frail about it but it won't change the actual facts. Here they are again.

DSM

It is important to note that gender identity is different from gender expression. Whereas gender identity refers to one’s psychological sense of their gender, gender expression refers to the way in which one presents to the world in a gendered way. For example, in much of the U.S., wearing a dress is considered a “feminine” gender expression, and wearing a tuxedo is considered a “masculine” gender expression. Such expectations are culturally defined and vary across time and culture. One’s gender expression does not necessarily align with their gender identity. Diverse gender expressions, much like diverse gender identities, are not indications of a mental disorder.
 
This idea that you two, ignorant, non Healthcare educated posters thinking you understand what real Healthcare is the pretending you're looking for.
 

Stanford Scales Back Trans Care for Minors

Stanford Medicine has paused gender-affirming surgeries for minors, citing evolving federal guidance. The move comes amid growing national scrutiny of trans health care for youth.
www.realcleareducation.com

We're a bit slow, but finally catching up to the rest of the world in recognizing that unregulated, pseudoscientific experimentation on children in NOT the way to go.
 
rahl said:
pointing out reality isn’t fragility.
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Not being able to address that you were wrong about what the DSM says however is very fragile. Publicly fragile. Here's what you said the DSM said.

rahl said:
Those uses are for actual medical conditions. They are not FDA approved to give to children with mental illnesses.

An unapproved use of them.

Treating actual medical conditions, not delusions.
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Master Debator said:
Its not being used to treat delusions. Where did you imagine seeing that?
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rahl said:
No imagining. It’s right there in the DSM.
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Is it in the DSM though? Here is DSM again and what it actually says.

DSM

It is important to note that gender identity is different from gender expression. Whereas gender identity refers to one’s psychological sense of their gender, gender expression refers to the way in which one presents to the world in a gendered way. For example, in much of the U.S., wearing a dress is considered a “feminine” gender expression, and wearing a tuxedo is considered a “masculine” gender expression. Such expectations are culturally defined and vary across time and culture. One’s gender expression does not necessarily align with their gender identity. Diverse gender expressions, much like diverse gender identities, are not indications of a mental disorder.
rahl said:
Meaningless appeal to authority.
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You're the one who appealed to what the DSM said you fragile little poster. Im just linking to their actually info instead of pretending to speak for them. But the fragile have to do what the fragile have to do.
 
rahl said:
This is a false dichotomy. 90% of childhood gender dysphoria resolved naturally by adulthood. It’s not, get your dick chopped off or commit suicide.
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I have shown why this study you refer to is flawed.
 

But contrary to the advice of the American Medical Association, the American Academy of Pediatrics and the American Psychological Association.

What's it like knowing the policy you support raises the suicide attempts by transgenders?

Are you trying to eliminate them?
 
rahl said:
uh, because I’m not wrong lol
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You are. Here is what the DSM says again about diverse gender identities. Why are you being so fragile about it?

DSM

It is important to note that gender identity is different from gender expression. Whereas gender identity refers to one’s psychological sense of their gender, gender expression refers to the way in which one presents to the world in a gendered way. For example, in much of the U.S., wearing a dress is considered a “feminine” gender expression, and wearing a tuxedo is considered a “masculine” gender expression. Such expectations are culturally defined and vary across time and culture. One’s gender expression does not necessarily align with their gender identity. Diverse gender expressions, much like diverse gender identities, are not indications of a mental disorder.
 
rahl said:
I’m not. You keep quoting something that has nothing to do with anything I’ve said.
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I quoted you claiming that trans people were delusional and mentally ill per the DSM and then I quoted the DSM saying the opposite. Here it is again since you insist on being so frail about it.

rahl said:
Those uses are for actual medical conditions. They are not FDA approved to give to children with mental illnesses.

An unapproved use of them.

Treating actual medical conditions, not delusions.
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Master Debator said:
Its not being used to treat delusions. Where did you imagine seeing that?
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rahl said:
No imagining. It’s right there in the DSM.
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Ok. Well let's see what's in the DSM.

DSM

It is important to note that gender identity is different from gender expression. Whereas gender identity refers to one’s psychological sense of their gender, gender expression refers to the way in which one presents to the world in a gendered way. For example, in much of the U.S., wearing a dress is considered a “feminine” gender expression, and wearing a tuxedo is considered a “masculine” gender expression. Such expectations are culturally defined and vary across time and culture. One’s gender expression does not necessarily align with their gender identity. Diverse gender expressions, much like diverse gender identities, are not indications of a mental disorder.
 
j brown's body said:
The judges know better about health than the American Medical Association, the American Academy of Pediatrics and the American Psychological Association.
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In the same way that you see yourself as more astute in legal matters than Supreme Court Judges?
 
Master Debator said:


I quoted you claiming that trans people were delusional and mentally ill per the DSM
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and I’ve quoted the DSM criteria for delusional disorder. If you believe you are something that you provably are not, you are by definition and diagnosis, delusional.
 
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