Shutdown Inevitable?

[noonereal]

Things just keep getting better and better………..

House passes bill to avert shutdown and suspend debt limit

The House of Representatives voted to pass legislation on Tuesday to prevent a government shutdown at the end of the month and suspend the nation's borrowing limit, setting up a showdown with Republicans who insist Democrats should act alone to stave off a looming debt crisis. The party line...

www.cnn.com

I know I am gonna be sorry but I'd like to ask the folks here who support the GQP in this, why?

I see no political upside. They are most responsible for the debt.

What is the strategy here?

I do not understand the political advantage they see.

I know neither side gives a **** about the country but generally they have a strategy to **** up America.

All I see is the GQP doing this for sadistic fun.,

 

[grip]

The GOP is using the debt ceiling as an excuse to not pass the Infrastructure Bill. They've become shameless jerks.

 

[OrphanSlug]

The idea of a 'debt ceiling' is and always was a stupid idea, and it quickly became political for all the worst reasons.

 

[Callen]

It is pathetic when governing becomes gamesmanship instead of responsible governance and even more pathetic when citizens revel in the gamesmanship instead of demanding good governance.

 

[gbg3]

Looks like a shutdown might not happen. This is exactly what I predicted would happen - that the Dems would be forced to decouple the short term government funding bill from the debt ceiling piece.
This article doesn't specify enough of exactly what is in this bill so it's hard to say yet whether they've tossed in things the GOP can't agree with but that should become apparent soon. If this is close to what McConnell said he'd support, I'd say it's looking promising that a shutdown won't occur for now.
So, this Nancy blink will give the Dems the bit of time and space they need to see if they can figure out/find agreement on what happens with the bipartisan bill and their massive spending mess of a bill.

Democrats put forward new bill to avert government shutdown, leaving out debt ceiling fix

www.msn.com

 

[KingLeo]

IF that's true then simply table the debt ceiling bill and move onto the budget which cannot be filibustered.

If. . .

Tabling the debt ceiling means you are risking the US defaulting on their debt (the $7.2 trillion incurred by the Trump administration).
The effects to the US, and world economy, would be disastrous.
So Republicans want to make a political point at the expense of the entire US.
Very typical of them.

 

[seymourflops]

Tabling the debt ceiling means you are risking the US defaulting on their debt (the $7.2 trillion incurred by the Trump administration).
The effects to the US, and world economy, would be disastrous.
So Republicans want to make a political point at the expense of the entire US.
Very typical of them.

During the Trump administration, the president originated spending bills?

 

[KingLeo]

During the Trump administration, the president originated spending bills?

Of course not, Congress decides that.
And the first 2 years of Trump saw Republicans with control of the House and the Senate.
You forget about the $1.7 trillion unpaid for Trump Tax Scam?

 

[Lovebug]

Both parties should be ashamed of themselves.

 

[seymourflops]

Of course not, Congress decides that.
And the first 2 years of Trump saw Republicans with control of the House and the Senate.
You forget about the $1.7 trillion unpaid for Trump Tax Scam?

No, I'm sick of all the DC scum.

Focusing on one that's gone already allows the rest free reign.

 

[KingLeo]

No, I'm sick of all the DC scum.

Focusing on one that's gone already allows the rest free reign.

But you ignore the current debt ceiling increase is about paying for PAST government spending.

 

[seymourflops]

But you ignore the current debt ceiling increase is about paying for PAST government spending.

No, I don't ignore that.

You said:

What many fail to understand, including Mitch Turtle McConnell, is that raising the debt ceiling is about debt incurred during the prior administration that is now coming due for payment. It has nothing to do with any new proposals being offered.

I said:

IF that's true then simply table the debt ceiling bill and move onto the budget which cannot be filibustered.

If. . .

Because it in fact does have something to do with any new proposals, because, as you said:

Tabling the debt ceiling means you are risking the US defaulting on their debt

and we are not going to be able to fund any new proposals if we default on our debt. So, you knew you were caught in a relatively minor error. Did you admit it and move on?

Nope.

You went on to say:

(the $7.2 trillion incurred by the Trump administration).
The effects to the US, and world economy, would be disastrous.
So Republicans want to make a political point at the expense of the entire US.
Very typical of them.

because your tribal thinking was

Ooga-booga! Bad man from other tribe disagree with mighty KingLeo! Bad man must be from the Orange Man-Repuglithug-conservoperv tribe. No one else ever disagree with Mighty KingLeo! If I blaspheme his orange god, he will get mad and cry!

 

[KingLeo]

No, I don't ignore that.

You said:

I said:

Because it in fact does have something to do with any new proposals, because, as you said:

and we are not going to be able to fund any new proposals if we default on our debt. So, you knew you were caught in a relatively minor error. Did you admit it and move on?

Nope.

You went on to say:

because your tribal thinking was

Ooga-booga! Bad man from other tribe disagree with mighty KingLeo! Bad man must be from the Orange Man-Repuglithug-conservoperv tribe. No one else ever disagree with Mighty KingLeo! If I blaspheme his orange god, he will get mad and cry!

You are poorly informed and desperately trying to BS your way out of it.
Nice try but total failure.

 

[gbg3]

I mentioned a Pew poll in comments #21 and 22. Here is a bit more on that and this new AP piece (linked) also discusses the current Dem bill situation.

"A recent poll from the Pew Research Center, in line with internal polling on the Republican and Democratic sides, paints a darkening picture for the president and his party. It found a 14-percentage point drop since July in his support from voters between the ages of 18 and 29, a 16-point drop among Latinos and an 18-point drop among African Americans. The shift among Black voters from 85% to 67% was particularly troubling given that they were Biden’s most reliable source of support in 2020."

Biden risks losing support from Democrats amid DC gridlock

www.msn.com

 

[MaryP]

There was a poll out recently (maybe the Gallup poll that has been getting a lot of attention) saying that about twice as many will blame Dems for the shut down as will blame Republicans.
I think this is why:


Oops, not Gallup. It was Morning Consult.

"More voters would blame Democrats than Republicans if the U.S. defaults on the national debt, according to a new poll.

The survey, conducted by Politico and Morning Consult, found that 33 percent of registered voters surveyed said they would blame the Democratic Party if the U.S. defaults on the national debt, while 16 percent would place the onus on the Republican Party."

Democrats would shoulder more blame than Republicans if US defaults on debt: poll

More voters would blame Democrats than Republicans if the U.S. defaults on the national debt, according to a new poll.The survey, conducted by Politico and Morning Consult, found that 33 percent of…

thehill.com

33 + 16 = 49%, which means half of Americans haven't got a clue about this budget business and equally important, they don't care. I've taken surveys where a scripted piece of information is read to me and then I'm asked questions that lead to a certain conclusion. That a third of random Americans are following this tug of war closely enough to say Democrats are at fault, all I can guess is that it's a big talking point on Fox at the moment. I don't have tv, so I'm only guessing. Either that or it was a skewed poll.

 

[gbg3]

33 + 16 = 49%, which means half of Americans haven't got a clue about this budget business and equally important, they don't care. I've taken surveys where a scripted piece of information is read to me and then I'm asked questions that lead to a certain conclusion. That a third of random Americans are following this tug of war closely enough to say Democrats are at fault, all I can guess is that it's a big talking point on Fox at the moment. I don't have tv, so I'm only guessing. Either that or it was a skewed poll.

I think it's a lot simpler than that. Whether people follow the "budget business" or not, it's well understood that Dems have the power to do this alone and they don't need any GOP help. Therefore, it's easy to understand why there would be more blaming the party in the majority and with adequate control to go it alone.

 

[MaryP]

I think it's a lot simpler than that. Whether people follow the "budget business" or not, it's well understood that Dems have the power to do this alone and they don't need any GOP help. Therefore, it's easy to understand why there would be more blaming the party in the majority and with adequate control to go it alone.

They have the power to do WHAT alone? I don't know what you're talking about. If there's talk of a shutdown, obviously it means no agreement was reached, so it wasn't done by Dems alone.

 

[911Sparky]

My guess is that Moscow McTurtle wants to hurt the economy for the midterms and 2024.

The house passed it, Schumer needs to bring it to the floor for a vote, and let those republicans who wish to allow the country to go into default go on the record. That might make it a little tougher for them in the midterms.

 

[911Sparky]

the democrats can avoid this...you know this, i know this, the majority of america knows this

they dont like how they can avoid it, but nevertheless it can easily be done

and no...the GOP doesnt have to work with democrats to HELP you

you sure in the hell didnt help the last administration get their priorities met

That's a huge pile of bullshit! Democrats voted 3 times to raise the debt ceiling while trump was in office.

 

[gdgyva]

They have the power to do WHAT alone? I don't know what you're talking about. If there's talk of a shutdown, obviously it means no agreement was reached, so it wasn't done by Dems alone.

Explainer: What are Congress' options for funding government and raising the debt limit?

The U.S. Congress faces a pair of approaching deadlines to fund the government and address the nation's $28.4 trillion debt ceiling that will require tricky maneuvering by President Joe Biden's Democrats over the next few weeks.

www.reuters.com

Budget reconciliation is a maneuver that bypasses the normal Senate requirement of 60 votes to advance a bill. It's the technique that the chamber's top Republican, Mitch McConnell, used to pass a sweeping tax-cut bill skewed to the wealthy when his party controlled the Senate in 2017. Now in the minority, he wants Democrats to use this to address the debt so that no Republicans have to vote for, and take responsibility for, a debt limit increase even though they want one

But it's complicated.

Democrats can do this on their own.....they just dont want to.....

But they cant attach the 3.5T bill to it which is what Pelosi really wants to do....

 

[MaryP]

Explainer: What are Congress' options for funding government and raising the debt limit?

The U.S. Congress faces a pair of approaching deadlines to fund the government and address the nation's $28.4 trillion debt ceiling that will require tricky maneuvering by President Joe Biden's Democrats over the next few weeks.

www.reuters.com

Budget reconciliation is a maneuver that bypasses the normal Senate requirement of 60 votes to advance a bill. It's the technique that the chamber's top Republican, Mitch McConnell, used to pass a sweeping tax-cut bill skewed to the wealthy when his party controlled the Senate in 2017. Now in the minority, he wants Democrats to use this to address the debt so that no Republicans have to vote for, and take responsibility for, a debt limit increase even though they want one

But it's complicated.

Democrats can do this on their own.....they just dont want to.....

But they cant attach the 3.5T bill to it which is what Pelosi really wants to do....

Thx

 

[Ishm]

The default on debt option is so incredibly dangerous that I dom't think either party woukd be that stupid while they still have other options open. The US economy is so incredibly reliant on ongoing debt, that boosting interest rates for future borrowing by defaulting now could be ruinous. Imagine having an Argentina type 10yr bond rate in the 40% range, or even Mexico's at just 4.5%. Still double or even triple the 100's of $Billions the country already pays in interest each year. Then imagine people abandoning the US$. The dollar crashes and inflation sky rockets. In an export driven economy that might be OK, but the US economy is driven primarily by consumerism.

Let's all pray that at least some parts of congress still care beyond their personal interests and political objectives.

 

[Bodecea]

Things just keep getting better and better………..

House passes bill to avert shutdown and suspend debt limit

The House of Representatives voted to pass legislation on Tuesday to prevent a government shutdown at the end of the month and suspend the nation's borrowing limit, setting up a showdown with Republicans who insist Democrats should act alone to stave off a looming debt crisis. The party line...

www.cnn.com

Will we have Cancun Cruz reading "Green Eggs & Ham" again?