Should govn't be banned from spending money on abortion matters contrary to beliefs?

[Ryan5]

Re: Should govn't be banned from spending money on abortion matters contrary to belie

question, how does government factually spend money on abortions? im not aware of this happening? what did i miss?

Answer:

Government doesn't 'Officially' spend on abortions. When a poor person making $14,000-$20,000 a year or $0.00 a year walks into an abortion clinic, they aren't denied an abortion. They simply agree to a payment plan (which everyone in the room knows they cannot and will not ever be able to pay) and they then have the abortion on the states dime. They then leave into the night and never pay and the state eats that cost and, obviously, you and I just paid for it indirectly seeing as it's hard to sue an unemployed poor person.


THAT SAID, in the long run that is actually cheaper for you and me and everyone else rather than a -500 opportunity child be born and become a criminal and become a $25,000 a year state prisoner. So yes, in the end subsidized abortion is cheaper than not doing it.

THAT SAID, to a simple minded person this is not easy to see, which is why we have our current catastrophic illogical debate.

 

[AGENT J]

Re: Should govn't be banned from spending money on abortion matters contrary to belie

Answer:

1.)Government doesn't 'Officially' spend on abortions. When a poor person making $14,000-$20,000 a year or $0.00 a year walks into an abortion clinic, they aren't denied an abortion. They simply agree to a payment plan (which everyone in the room knows they cannot and will not ever be able to pay) and they then have the abortion on the states dime. They then leave into the night and never pay and the state eats that cost and, obviously, you and I just paid for it indirectly seeing as it's hard to sue an unemployed poor person.

2.)THAT SAID, in the long run that is actually cheaper for you and me and everyone else rather than a -500 opportunity child be born and become a criminal and become a $25,000 a year state prisoner. So yes, in the end subsidized abortion is cheaper than not doing it.

3.) THAT SAID, to a simple minded person this is not easy to see, which is why we have our current catastrophic illogical debate.

1.) then officially they dont pay for them any more then they pay for the vast majority of anything medical (not saying you said otherwise just saying)
2.) this i totally agree with that banning abortion would lead to bigger financial problems
3.) agree here also

 

[minnie616]

Re: Should govn't be banned from spending money on abortion matters contrary to belie

Answer:

Government doesn't 'Officially' spend on abortions. When a poor person making $14,000-$20,000 a year or $0.00 a year walks into an abortion clinic, they aren't denied an abortion. They simply agree to a payment plan (which everyone in the room knows they cannot and will not ever be able to pay) and they then have the abortion on the states dime. They then leave into the night and never pay and the state eats that cost and, obviously, you and I just paid for it indirectly seeing as it's hard to sue an unemployed poor person.


THAT SAID, in the long run that is actually cheaper for you and me and everyone else rather than a -500 opportunity child be born and become a criminal and become a $25,000 a year state prisoner. So yes, in the end subsidized abortion is cheaper than not doing it.

THAT SAID, to a simple minded person this is not easy to see, which is why we have our current catastrophic illogical debate.

I think you are wrong.
There are no payment plans for an abortion that I have ever heard of.

There are many people who like myself donate monies to the clinics to be used to help offset the cost of abortions for women who cannot an abortion but who desperately want one.

 

[Ryan5]

Re: Should govn't be banned from spending money on abortion matters contrary to belie

I think you are wrong.
There are no payment plans for an abortion that I have ever heard of.

There are many people who like myself donate monies to the clinics to be used to help offset the cost of abortions for women who cannot an abortion but who desperately want one.

As I said, Hospitals, Clinics do not go around suing poor people who fail to pay their abortions. Nor do hospitals go around promoting the fact (or even mentioning it, for obvious reasons) that they will perform an abortion for free if it's clear you're poor. Now obviously many people do not know these things. Most Americans assume if you don't have enough money and are poor, that the hospital, Clinic turns you down for an abortion. They don't. They give you the abortion (or steer you in the right direction) and attempt to assign you a payment plan knowing you won't ever pay because you can't. That's what people mean when they speak of subsidized abortions in America. That's what happens. It's just officially unofficial because admitting this happens to most Americans would mean society had become over 50% rational and clear minded, which obviously it hasn't, hence 'officially' all these poor people earning $18,000 a year are 'officially' paying for their $500-1000 abortion.

 

[minnie616]

Re: Should govn't be banned from spending money on abortion matters contrary to belie

As I said, Hospitals do not go around suing poor people who fail to pay their abortions. Nor do hospitals go around promoting the fact (or even mentioning it, for obvious reasons) that they will perform an abortion for free if it's clear you're poor. Now obviously many people do not know these things. Most Americans assume if you don't have enough money and are poor, that the hospital turns you down for an abortion. They don't. They give you the abortion (or steer you in the right direction) and attempt to assign you a payment plan knowing you won't ever pay because you can't. That's what people mean when they speak of subsidized abortions in America. That's what happens. It's just officially unofficial because admitting this happens to most Americans would mean society had become over 50% rational and clear minded, which obviously it hasn't, hence 'officially' all these poor people earning $18,000 a year are 'officially' paying for their $500-1000 abortion.

Since when do hospitals give abortions on demand?

Most hospitals only perform abortions to save a woman's life. If the woman's life is at risk than yes, taxpayers do pick up that tab.

 

[minnie616]

Re: Should govn't be banned from spending money on abortion matters contrary to belie

Over 200,000 women (in the United States) a year seek help in funding their abortions through an abortion fund.

Since a little less than a million abortions take place each year in the US that means about 1 out of every 5 or about 20% of the women who get abortions are in financial distress and need help to pay for their abortions.

Here is a <snip> of a woman with 5 children. She loves children but her family was in finanical distress when she found she was pregnant again.

Sonia has 5 kids and her husband was just laid off.

I love my big family...and I love my children too much to have another baby right now.

My husband and I have five children. We love kids and we love having a big family. But when my husband got laid off from his contractor job, having a big family got really hard.

When I found out I was pregnant again, it was terrifying. We love the idea of another child -- but we love the children we have too much to add that kind of stress to our family right now.

I'm only working part-time and I couldn't get maternity leave, so I might not be able to keep my job with another little one.
I hated that we had to make this decision, but it turned out that making the decision was the easiest part.
Because then we had to find the money to pay for an abortion.

We started taking stuff to the pawn shop: our vacuum cleaner, my wedding ring, our family television, the old desktop computer.
When that wasn't enough, we took my husband's tools and his drills.


That was the hardest trip. My husband's been trying to pick up construction work. Without his tools or his drills, there's hardly anyone who'll hire him.

Even after all that, we were short on what we needed. But the woman at the clinic gave us the name of an abortion fund.<SNIP>

read more:

Sonia has 5 kids and her husband was just laid off. | Fund Abortion Now.org

 

[minnie616]

Re: Should govn't be banned from spending money on abortion matters contrary to belie

IN THE NEWS:

Doctors Urge More Hospitals to Perform Abortions
Women’s-health professionals and a younger generation of providers are demanding change as clinics face closures

Aug. 23, 2013

There are many ways to pressure an institution into steering clear of providing abortion. In Toledo, Ohio, the last remaining abortion clinic may be forced to close next week after area hospitals refused to provide transfer agreements, citing a desire to remain “neutral” in the abortion debate. Earlier this month, the sole abortion doctor in Green Bay, Wis., agreed to stop providing the procedure after a local private hospital acquired his clinic. This comes as laws tightening regulations on abortion providers threaten to close clinics in at least five states, part of a Republican-led push that both pro-life and pro-choice activists say is designed to chip away access to abortion rights.

Now a group of medical professors is responding to the crackdown by urging hospitals to fill the void and reverse a decades-long trend that has isolated abortion providers from the mainstream medical community.

<SNIP>

Hospitals provide just 4% of abortions in the U.S., according to the Guttmacher Institute, a nonprofit sexual-health-research organization, and many facilities limit the procedure to rare cases, like fetal abnormalities or when the life of the woman is at risk.

The majority of hospitals perform fewer than 30 abortions per year. Others refuse to provide the procedure at all.

Read more: In New Letter, Doctors Urge More Hospitals to Perform Abortions | TIME.com

 

[Ryan5]

Re: Should govn't be banned from spending money on abortion matters contrary to belie

Since when do hospitals give abortions on demand?

Since forever.


The state has always eaten the cost. Just because you didn't know this doesn't mean it hasn't been so.


This is what people mean by state subsidized abortions. All poor abortions are basically subsidized by the government as a crime prevention and or basic medical, societal progression move. When you don't pay for an abortion but you signed a piece of paper saying you would, the state pays for it. It's just that nobody, especially the state, is out saying this openly. This has always been the case.

 

[minnie616]

Re: Should govn't be banned from spending money on abortion matters contrary to belie

Since forever.


The state has always eaten the cost. Just because you didn't know this doesn't mean it hasn't been so.


This is what people mean by state subsidized abortions. All poor abortions are basically subsidized by the government as a crime prevention and or basic medical, societal progression move. When you don't pay for an abortion but you signed a piece of paper saying you would, the state pays for it. It's just that nobody, especially the state, is out saying this openly. This has always been the case.

I did a little searching and believe it OR not it looks like we are both correct.

It just depends on the state we live in.

The state I live will only cover abortions in the case of rape, incest or if her life is at risk.
Perhaps you live in one of the 17 states that does use state medicaid funds for abortions for those who cannot afford one.

Seventeen states fund abortions at the state level. While Medicaid is a federally funded health insurance program that funds legal abortions when the mother's health is at risk, it is estimated that only 1 in 5 Medicaid-eligible women receive this funding. Government aid for abortion procedures aside, there is still the issue of government funding for the teaching of abortion procedures.

Read more: How Much Money Does the Federal Government Spend on Abortions Each Year? | eHow

Here is a PDF file with more info and the list of states with medicaid paid abortions.

http://www.guttmacher.org/statecenter/spibs/spib_SFAM.pdf