School Shootings Aren’t Caused By Faulty Gun Laws But By The Collapse Of The Family

[Irredentist]

Word.

This is what I’ve been saying. Lack of fathers in the home and cultural family values are no longer time honored tradition in America. In addition the further our country pulls away from God the closer it becomes to Satan.

And the results aren’t pretty

———-


Until we are willing to address the breakdown of family and community, nothing will change, the massacres will continue.

At a press conference Wednesday in the aftermath of the school shooting in Uvalde, Texas, Gov. Greg Abbott almost said something profound. Almost.

Asked by reporters about gun laws in Texas, Abbott responded by talking about the need for more “mental health-resources” — a catch-all term often bandied about by Republican politicians in the wake of mass shootings like the one in Uvalde, in which 19 elementary school kids and two teachers were killed by a deeply disturbed 18-year-old.

Abbott can pretend not to know, but I suspect that he, along with most everyone else in America, knows perfectly well the answer to that question. It has nothing to do with gun technology or gun control laws and everything to do with our corrupt culture, and especially with the collapse of the family.

School Shootings Aren't About Gun Laws But The Collapse Of The Family

Until we are willing to address the breakdown of family and community, nothing will change, the massacres will continue.

thefederalist.com

You are correct about there being a cultural problem at play here, but like Abbott you have not yet accurately defined it's nature. The mass proliferation of firearms, and the lack of adequate mental healthcare, are both symptoms of the underlying disease sickening America, but they are not the underlying cause. The real issue is a widespread cultural acceptance of masculine aggression and violence. Instead of condemning physical aggression, we condone it as a legitimate expression of masculine emotion. Instead of abhorring violence, we glorify it as an expression of masculine power and authority. The media we consume is saturated with examples of violent individuals being praised and applauded for violent acts. Is it any surprise then that guns have come to symbolize male power and authority, or that troubled young men so often engage in violence to express their emotional turmoil? It is merely the natural and unavoidable conclusion of our cultural obsession with male aggression.

 

[Evilroddy]

Facts and data? How old are you? Anybody who has lived long enough (and has open eyes) doesn't need facts and data to remember America in her full glory and now sees her decaying and declining at the cancer of liberalism spread by woke politicians, the media and Hollywood. It is a sickening spectacle and liberals are intent on destroying the greatest nation to ever grace the face of the planet. Their hatred of America is so strong that they don't even hide it anymore.

Roger Duke:

Would you please indicate when America (the USA) was in her full glory? If liberalism is a cancer, then why did your founding fathers cling so strongly to liberal principles and build them into the fabric of your nation and republic? I will agree that America is the greatest nation of the modern age but I will also caution you that "great" does not mean "good". Julius Caesar was a great man as was the Roman Empire but neither Caesar nor the empire he founded were agents of good. Thus some American policy has been for the good but some has been profoundly bad. One does not have to hate America to recognise that.

Now to guns and family collapse. Divorce rates and family break-ups have been rising since the late 1960's in countries all over the Western world. Yet only in America has gun violence and gun deaths proliferated in the 20th and 21st centuries at this astonishing rate. Countries with gun violence levels as high as America are usually in a state of real or apprehended civil war like Guatemala, Colombia or Venezuela. Familiy breakdown is likely not the main driver of gun violence in America. So what is?

I think there are at least three things driving increased violence and gun killings in America.

1) The culture of violence which permeates America from bottom to top. America loves and perpetuates violence both domestically and internationally. Your country's go-to solution is violence from spousal abuse and the beating of children, to the proliferation of SWAT teams in the 1970's until today, to the militarisation of law enforcement more generally to war where slogans like, "Bomb bomb Iran" are sung at political rallies. America adores and venerates violence and that is coming home to roost. This culture of violence combined with both political and economic polarisation is making for a societal killing culture in which no one is safe.

2) The proliferation of firearms and the trend in gun purchases to buy more and more deadly weapons to put into the hands of any civilian, despite the very real possibility that some of those civilians may present a real threat to those around them. There are 170 million legal gun owners and over 400 million known firearms in your country! Those are astronomical numbers and the numbers are going up at an accelerating rate. While many of those lawful gun owners should be no problem, some small fraction of 170 million will snap and eventually go "postal". Even a small percentage of 170,000,000 is a huge number of potential shooters killing Americans. Hopefully they chose suicide but the culture of violence seems to be convincing some that mass shootings are some sort of performance art where the suicidal can go out in a blaze of misplaced glory. More concerning is the surplus of firearms which find their way into the hands of unlawful possessors of firearms. Gun-crime by criminals is also a major contributor to gun deaths in America. That gun crime is venerated by your media and entertainment industries and has been for a very long time. So firearms and gun proliferation are a major component (I think the dominant component) of gun deaths in America.

Continued next post.

 

[Evilroddy]

3) Gun Culture in America. The Cult of the Gun is strong in America and while that might have made sense when America was a low population density, agrarian. settler-colonialist country expanding by violence across the continent, it is a toxic culture now in a high population density, urban and polarised society like America has become since the late 1970's. This gun culture pushes lawful gun ownership, unlawful gun possession and gun purchases without regard for the damage firearms are doing in America to Americans. That culture is radicalising some gun owners and gun-rights advocates to resist any pragmatic reforms or policies that might lessen gun violence or gun deaths based on fundamentalist ideological objections to regulating firearms by any level of government. This culture actually benefits from the fear engendered by firearms mass shootings because the fear drives higher and higher gun sales and pushes new buyers to buy more powerful weapons (not just powerful by projectile mass and velocity). Gun culture has paralysed America from dealing with this problem effectively since the early 1990's and is thus also a big part of the problem.

So this is my triad of supporting pillars upon which modern-day gun violence and mass shooting sit. These are the things which must be dealt with so that fewer of the almost 40,000 Americans who die annually from firearms related deaths may live longer lives.

Cheers and be well.
Evilroddy.

 

[The Old Soul]

Roger, I do not know what fantasy world you live in that is so skewed toward favoring the Republicans and trashing the Democrats but it isn't this world for sure.

What does "America Great" mean? One thing that history shows us is that America was great when it represented life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness. I am sure you agree with me on all of these factors as both parties want the same. Nonetheless, here is where defining each one of these gets changed from one party to the next.

The standard definition of having a good life is based on quality of life, which is:

Health, Education, Environmental Quality, Personal Security, Civic Engagement and Work-Life Balance.

Here is where things begin to change between the parties as the Republicans believe that this "quality of life" is entirely dependent on economic success and power to make things happen and therefore they fight to accomplish that through individual accomplishments in the economic area. Money and control being what makes a person happy. Have no one be accountable to others. The best be the winners and the rest "eat ****"

Nonetheless and on the other side of the coin, Democrats view quality of life as being in the sharing with others area. Not individualism but team work. Things like achieving love, sharing a sunset or a good meal with a friend or a loved one, justice and equal treatment for all, caring for one another through good and bad times, and being part of a family, Money being a "need" but not a requirement to achieving happiness.

Here is where things have gone in different paths totally and where neither party agrees with the other and now hate each other because neither values what the other party stands for.

The truth is that both parties seek the same life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness but the definition of what that means is totally different.

Let me ask you (a die hard Republican) a couple of questions

1) do you want love to be part of your life?
2) do you want to have friends?
3) do you want to respected for who you are as a person or as a money maker that makes things happen?

If any of these things are important to you, you then must realize that none of these are accomplished by money or power. If they are important to you, then there is a part of a Democrat in you.

By the way and giving a caveat to what I said. Nothing and no one in life is perfect so you can always find exceptions-to-the-rule, you can always find wrong things among the right things.

What is important is that you get more of what you want and need rather than less. Meaning that neither side (Republicans or Democrats) are 100% right.

Bottom line is that we all search for the same thing but with different values and neither is 100% wrong. The only thing that is 100% wrong is your kind of thinking where you see the other side as being 100% wrong. That is where YOU personally fail totally.

I agree with your summary, but wish to comment on the one point I feel quite strongly about:
"What is important is that you get more of what you want and need rather than less."

IMO, the Want can be problematic when it overarches the Need. We all need food, shelter, and a reasonable amount of security, comfort, and happiness in life in general. Rather than be in a state of want beyond need, comfort and happiness are much easier to achieve by being happy with what you already have, and making the most of it rather than perpetually try to replace it with something 'better.' We are a society of excess, and for the most part, have far beyond what we actually need. Focus on community instead of self, and the rest will come to us all.

 

[gdgyva]

I agree with your summary, but wish to comment on the one point I feel quite strongly about:
"What is important is that you get more of what you want and need rather than less."

IMO, the Want can be problematic when it overarches the Need. We all need food, shelter, and a reasonable amount of security, comfort, and happiness in life in general. Rather than be in a state of want beyond need, comfort and happiness are much easier to achieve by being happy with what you already have, and making the most of it rather than perpetually try to replace it with something 'better.' We are a society of excess, and for the most part, have far beyond what we actually need. Focus on community instead of self, and the rest will come to us all.

Some of us are/were willing to sacrifice a lot to make we got more than the basics

Reaching and striving for more was the way i was raised

I dont see that as a negative.....We are the ones who provide jobs, and give back to the community

 

[Geoist]

Yes, but we like our gun laws. So we have to find another solution. Personally, I think we should stop letting 9 year olds spent 8 hours a day playing video games that do nothing but simulate mass murder. I don't know if it will make a difference in shootings, but it can't hurt anyway.

Video games arent turning kids into mass murderers. That's just social conservative bullshit.

 

[Outlook]

LOL ... right-wing spinners are workin' overtime.

Yeah, it would be nice if every kid got to grow up in a stable household ... but here's the 800-POUND GORILLA in the room that righties have such great difficulty addressing...

That 18-year-old monster in texas SHOULD NEVER HAVE BEEN ABLE TO LEGALLY PURCHASE THOSE MASS-KILLING MACHINES...

Yea, those mass killing machines- -AR 15

Charles Whitman - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

It's the guns.

Mass Murder without Guns | National Review

We’re focusing on the wrong thing.

www.nationalreview.com

 

[Noodlegawd]

Video games arent turning kids into mass murderers. That's just social conservative bullshit.

It's common sense, but then again what do gun control zealots know about common sense except how to say it? They are, after all, the people who never shut up about banning rifles based on whether or not they have pistol grips.

 

[The Old Soul]

Some of us are/were willing to sacrifice a lot to make we got more than the basics

Reaching and striving for more was the way i was raised

I dont see that as a negative.....We are the ones who provide jobs, and give back to the community

Sometimes a different perspective is good for the soul. Having been on both ends of the spectrum socially and financially, I found the greatest satisfaction in life when I finally achieved a balance between what I had, and what I wanted and needed. It was a little South of the middle of the road.

It is close to impossible to actually get 'ahead' in America; the harder you work, the more you acquire, the more elusive getting ahead seems to get. Once on that horse, it feels like trying to break a mechanical bronco. But after taking a long hard look in the mirror and seeing only the image I presented and the value of the mirror I was looking into, I realized that my wants and possessions owned me rather than me owning them.

We all struggle and sacrifice, and in some cases it may be unintentional, but we all contribute. And rather than trying to get the whole pie, being satisfied by the slice you get is best.

 

[Outlook]

This is what democrats think about school safety.

Under SB 1273, educators would also be empowered to decide whether to report to police when a student attacks, assaults, or physically threatens any school employee.

Schools Would Have More Discretion, No Longer Be Required to Report Certain Student Behavior to Police Under CA Bill |

witnessla.com

 

[poweRob]

Cons are flailing all over the place trying to divert from our gun problem.

1. Video games
2. Collapse of the family unit (I particularly like this one because it's usually coming out of the mouths of some dude on his 2nd or 3rd marriage).
3. Lack of God in our lives. (Another great hypocrisy that spills from the lips of child diddling preachers).
4. It was a doors fault.
5. It was a teacher's fault.
6. Now cons are orchestrating a move against pot by saying smoking it is linked to violence.

As someone said in that thread, if pot stoked violence, Willie Nelsen would have been committing weekly mass murders.

 

[Maidenrules29]

Dylan Klebold and Eric Harris had fathers in their homes. Nikolas Cruz's father lovingly raised him until he died. Adam Lanza's father was an executive who lived a few towns away and supported his child.

Ok so in this case they all had fathers. So what is the common denominator amongst all of them that contributed to them wanting to kill people?

 

[bullseyelqcs]

It's common sense, but then again what do gun control zealots know about common sense except how to say it? They are, after all, the people who never shut up about banning rifles based on whether or not they have pistol grips.

Bullshit. Ive played video games for nigh on 35 years, and have never had the inclination to pick up a gun and go for the gusto. That is just idiots trying to blame everything under the sun except for easy access to firearms and a lack of mental health support.

 

[Noodlegawd]

Bullshit. Ive played video games for nigh on 35 years, and have never had the inclination to pick up a gun and go for the gusto. That is just idiots trying to blame everything under the sun except for easy access to firearms and a lack of mental health support.

It's funny how people who never shut up about science have no clue what it is. You sound just like a vaccine denier. Your personal anecdote is totally irrelevant to the point.

 

[Geoist]

It's common sense, but then again what do gun control zealots know about common sense except how to say it? They are, after all, the people who never shut up about banning rifles based on whether or not they have pistol grips.

It is not common sense, it's nonsensical deflection. Millions of people play violent video games. 99.99% of them dont become serial killers or mass murderers.

 

[bullseyelqcs]

It's funny how people who never shut up about science have no clue what it is. You sound just like a vaccine denier. Your personal anecdote is totally irrelevant to the point.

What science are you talking about?

At any given time, there are 2 million people playing Call of Duty online. Seems like a pretty large pool of people, and yet the percentage of those people who also go out and commit atrocities is so low as to be basically non-existent. There are far more people who own the game, so the pool is actually even bigger.

Oh, and lets not factor in the number of people from other countries who play the game and yet they dont have the problem of mass casualty events happening on a nearly weekly basis.

Claiming video games is the cause of this is just plain silly. Any "science" that tries to tie those two things together simply has to ignore that this shit doesnt happen anywhere else in the world with the regularity that it does here, so it seems that maybe at best its a stretch connecting the two.

Remember......correlation does not equal causation.

I would also point out that there is only one instantly recognizable common denominator in every mass shooting. Care to take a stab at what it is?

 

[Geoist]

Ok so in this case they all had fathers. So what is the common denominator amongst all of them that contributed to them wanting to kill people?

That they are sociopaths? Would you support legislation banning animal abusers and domestic abusers from ever owning a firearm?

 

[Noodlegawd]

It is not common sense, it's nonsensical deflection. Millions of people play violent video games. 99.99% of them dont become serial killers or mass murderers.

So only 0.01% of them become serial killers? That seems about right, and points out the flaw in your thinking. Actually, it's probably more like 0.0001%.

 

[Geoist]

So only 0.01% of them become serial killers? That seems about right, and points out the flaw in your thinking. Actually, it's probably more like 0.0001%.

What is the 'flaw' in my thinking? And thank you for reinforcing my point.

 

[bullseyelqcs]

So only 0.01% of them become serial killers? That seems about right, and points out the flaw in your thinking. Actually, it's probably more like 0.0001%.

Its probably even lower than that.

Not sure what point you are trying to make here. Kinda negates the idea that video games are the reason these things happen.

 

[tres borrachos]

That they are sociopaths? Would you support legislation banning animal abusers and domestic abusers from ever owning a firearm?

The Uvalde shooter was a known animal abuser. He posted videos of himself holding bloody bags of dead cats. He abused small dogs. That piece of shit never should have been near a gun.

The Buffalo shooter enjoyed torturing a cat before killing it. His mother knew it too.

 

[Noodlegawd]

What science are you talking about?

At any given time, there are 2 million people playing Call of Duty online. Seems like a pretty large pool of people, and yet the percentage of those people who also go out and commit atrocities is so low as to be basically non-existent. There are far more people who own the game, so the pool is actually even bigger.

If only 100 out of those 2 million people were predisposed to commit mass murder based on existing mental illness or other factors, and a lifetime of playing games like Call of Duty made them 25% more likely to do it, that would go a long way to explaining the increase in mass shootings we've seen in the last 15 years. The point is that it's not something that can be tested for in a 2-week study of a few hundred subjects.

Oh, and lets not factor in the number of people from other countries who play the game and yet they dont have the problem of mass casualty events happening on a nearly weekly basis.

Those people don't live in countries with 400 million guns. But they do have plenty of mass murders. France has had more people killed in mass murders per capita than the US has in the past 20 years.

Claiming video games is the cause of this is just plain silly. Any "science" that tries to tie those two things together simply has to ignore that this shit doesnt happen anywhere else in the world with the regularity that it does here, so it seems that maybe at best its a stretch connecting the two.

Remember......correlation does not equal causation.

Correlation with a plausible mechanism is a good start for understanding whether there is a causal relationship.

I would also point out that there is only one instantly recognizable common denominator in every mass shooting. Care to take a stab at what it is?

It's certainly not that it's easier to buy guns now than it was in the 1980s.

 

[Noodlegawd]

The Uvalde shooter was a known animal abuser. He posted videos of himself holding bloody bags of dead cats. He abused small dogs. That piece of shit never should have been near a gun.

The Buffalo shooter enjoyed torturing a cat before killing it. His mother knew it too.

They never should have been near a McDonalds. They should have been locked up.

 

[Noodlegawd]

What is the 'flaw' in my thinking? And thank you for reinforcing my point.

I just pointed out to you that your own numbers indicate the flaw in your thinking. We're talking about a tiny, tiny percentage of people doing these things. If 1 person in a million is made 50% more likely to commit a mass murder because of a lifelong of relentless exposure to increasingly violent media, that would pretty much account for the increase we're seeing.

 

[Indydave]

Word.

This is what I’ve been saying. Lack of fathers in the home and cultural family values are no longer time honored tradition in America. In addition the further our country pulls away from God the closer it becomes to Satan.

And the results aren’t pretty

———-


Until we are willing to address the breakdown of family and community, nothing will change, the massacres will continue.

At a press conference Wednesday in the aftermath of the school shooting in Uvalde, Texas, Gov. Greg Abbott almost said something profound. Almost.

Asked by reporters about gun laws in Texas, Abbott responded by talking about the need for more “mental health-resources” — a catch-all term often bandied about by Republican politicians in the wake of mass shootings like the one in Uvalde, in which 19 elementary school kids and two teachers were killed by a deeply disturbed 18-year-old.

Abbott can pretend not to know, but I suspect that he, along with most everyone else in America, knows perfectly well the answer to that question. It has nothing to do with gun technology or gun control laws and everything to do with our corrupt culture, and especially with the collapse of the family.

School Shootings Aren't About Gun Laws But The Collapse Of The Family

Until we are willing to address the breakdown of family and community, nothing will change, the massacres will continue.

thefederalist.com

'Until we are willing to address the breakdown of family and community, nothing will change, the massacres will continue.'

what is your suggestion.....how do we as a nation change this......how do we make dads and moms stay together......how do we make people do the right thing....
how do we make them go to church.......how do we make them stay sober......how do we make them love their children......do we make laws where they are punished for not living to these 'standards'.......put them in prison for being deadbeats and irresponsible......take away their welfare.....what