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Rep. Allen West Says Up To 81 House Members Are Communists


McCarthy was a drunk and a trouble maker..

West is no different.
 
AdamT said:
I can't believe that there are 45 pages worth of idiotic posts still trying to defend the patently insane statement by Rep. West. :2rofll:
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I can believe it. I am frankly surprised it took as long as it did to get to this length.
 
Possible? Yes but very unlikely. Probable? I'm afraid not seeing as you gave me 1 example that was even remotely probable. Accusations of this severity shouldn't be based on assumptions and guesses, so seeing as you've provided a grand total of 1 plausible examples, I'll take that as a white flag.
 
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:roll: Yes, yes...Dismiss and declare victory...Another playbook oldie but goodie. Pfft. Thanks for revealing that rational discussion is rather pointless with those that take similar stances to yours here.


j-mac
 

Alright j-mac

I concede that a progressive system of taxation is one demand that Karl Marx makes in the Communist Manifesto. However, it is SHORT-TERM demand to facilitate the transition to a true communist (stateless and classless) society. The implementation of the above 10 demands was meant as PRECURSOR to communism, not true communism itself.

Regardless, the point remains that just because a country implements a system of progressive taxation doesn't make it inherently Communist. As spud said, that's like saying any country with a strong military or sense of nationalism is fascist.
 
Hare said:
Because Communists are evil correct?
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Not necessarily, but they are stupid. And it was the forced implementation of these stupid ideas that caused the deaths of over 100 million people and the ruination of millions of more lives. Defend Fascism, Racism, Communism, Nazism, or any of these other isms that would destroy human freedoms and rights, but you'll get the contempt you deserve.

Sounds like a rebirth of the Mccarthy era to me.
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Does it? Then you probably know dick about "The Mccarthy era", or the eventual fallout.


The only reputation he's damaged is his own, perhaps Mr West should avoid making such idiotic claims in the future to avoid any future embarrassment.
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How do you know they are idiotic? What evidence do you have that that's the case? Are you saying it's just "Red's under the bed"?
 
sharon said:
McCarthy was a drunk and a trouble maker..

West is no different.
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So you would prefer that we remain silent about Nazis, Communists, Fascists, Racists etc, in the government because to expose them would make trouble. Brilliant!
 

The forces of socialism starting with the New Deal/Great Society and currently represented by the secular progressive movement have irreparably hobbled America economically. For whatever reason post WW-II America has become a litigious society, and that more than anything else has driven this idea that literally every behavior of every citizen needs to be structured 100% of the time by the government.
 
sharon said:
McCarthy was a drunk and a trouble maker..

West is no different.
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Wow, ignorance clearly is bliss

The McCarthy critics like to ignore Venona project decrypted Soviet messages and recently released Soviet espionage data that confirms many of the people accused by McCarthy were in fact communists....commie ****bags
 
Um....the members of congress are elected, are they not?

So....uh.....someone tell me.....why anyone should CARE if those members are communist, or support communist leaning legislation, or not?

American gets exactly the leaders she both wants and deserves.
 
ric27 said:
Wow, ignorance clearly is bliss

The McCarthy critics like to ignore Venona project decrypted Soviet messages and recently released Soviet espionage data that confirms many of the people accused by McCarthy were in fact communists....commie ****bags
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If you fire a couple of rounds of bird shot into a large crowd of people, you're bound to hit at least ONE or two communists.


What I mean to say is, of COURSE he accused a few actual, honest to god communists...because he accused just about everyone around him. He accused so many people, and had so many people on the suspect list, that, frankly, I'd be more shocked if a few of them WEREN'T communist...
 

Perhaps these members of Congress didn't declare themselves as communists for fear it might damage their chances of being elected.

Just a hunch.
 
KevinKohler said:
If you fire a couple of rounds of bird shot into a large crowd of people, you're bound to hit at least ONE or two communists.
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It would be a start.

But why do you suppose, given its record of failure and gross inhumanity, there are any communists around at all?

Is it a form of insanity?
 
Grant said:
It would be a start.

But why do you suppose, given its record of failure and gross inhumanity, there are any communists around at all?

Is it a form of insanity?
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I wouldn't call it insanity, just self delusion. A "true", hard core commy, who would likely call themselves anrcho capitalist, would say that it's the ONLY way to be free, lol. Me? I don't drink the cool aid.

That self same, "true" commy, would also likely point out that "true" communism has never been tried before. Then, you would tell them something like, "well, that's because it's simply not logistically possible to do", and the response would be a very intellectual sounding "Nuh UH!!!!", with a bunch or long, dry, boring reading material references that I would be "required" to read, in order to debate it "honestly". Just from my experience, anyway.
 
Grant said:
Perhaps these members of Congress didn't declare themselves as communists for fear it might damage their chances of being elected.

Just a hunch.
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More likely they didn't call themselves communists, because they don't believe they are. Having a few social leanings, does not make one a socialist, just like having a few conservative leanings does not make one a conservative. Much to the chagrin of just about all of the so called "conservatives" currently spending their way through all of our current and tomorrows tax projections as if tomorrow doesn't exist.
 
GhostlyJoe said:
. . .But we also understand that fostering such opportunity requires political will and that sometimes in the real world cooperation works better than competition.
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I thought about this statement for a bit. I realized that you are making two very big, unstated assumptions concerning the value of cooperation. First in order to cooperate we have to agree on our purpose, or if you prefer, we have to agree on what we want to be done. Second we have to agree on the right course of action which will allow us to accomplish our purpose. I do not believe either of your assumptions are true.

Therefore, competition is better. It does not require that we agree upon our purpose nor upon the method we must use to accomplish our purpose. Competition encourages creativity. Cooperation does not. Competition helps us determine the things we know and the things we do not know.
 
In free market capitalism I get to decide how to pursue my happiness, my self interest. You have said nothing above that diminishes that in any way. Capitalism has created the greatest quantity of goods, services and wealth for more people than any other method of organizing human activity. We know how to act in our best interest better than anyone else. When we do what is best for us it turns out that we maximize what is best for all.

Your second statement shows that you have the mindset and heart of a tyrant. You want the government to determine what our needs are and to compel markets to comply. I wonder why that is. Did you grow up under one of the many totalitarian utopias that mar the globe? Perhaps your formative years were spent behind the Iron Curtain where the central planners did such an amazing job.

Government ought to do very little when it comes to business. Unfortunately it does way, way, way too much.
 
Hare said:
We've had a progressive tax system for the entirety of our history save one year in the late 19th century.
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This just did not sound right to me, especially since no provision was made for an income tax in the Constitution. Wikipedia says, "The first income tax suggested in the United States was during the War of 1812."

Then, after losing in court, "Congress proposed the Sixteenth Amendment (ratified by the requisite number of states in 1913),[22] which states:
The Congress shall have power to lay and collect taxes on incomes, from whatever source derived, without apportionment among the several States, and without regard to any census or enumeration."

No indications of a progressive income tax there. Just the ability to tax incomes. It was a very bad idea.

After the Congress got a hold of a little bit of our money they gradually added in layer after lay, gradually taking as much of our liberty as possible like little slices of salami. At this point about the feds intend to take about a third.

And yes, Radical Karl did say that a steeply progressive income tax was necessary to wreck capital formation and therefore defeat capitalism.

Your mileage may vary.
 
StillBallin75 said:
The point remains that just because progressive taxation is a pillar of communism (a debatable point to begin with), doesn't mean that progressive taxation is inherently or uniquely socialist. I think that was the takeaway.
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Radical Karl understood that one cannot move a nation to socialism without the capital formation wrecking influence of a steeply progressive income tax. That is the purpose of the steeply progressive income tax. It prevents or it hinders the accumulation of capital. If one makes it a pillar of one's society then that society is on its way to socialism. Anything else is just discussion about how long it will take for us to get there. Tax the rich anybody? Who needs a job anyway. If the government wants me to have a job they will give me one, right?
 
Redress said:
Mixed economy - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
So history is not your only weak subject.
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Redress, you are the one who is wrong. Early America did not have a strong regulatory oversight over businesses. We did not have two and a half million busy-body bureaucrats dreaming idiotic rules and regulations to harass, confound and harry every business doing everything until quite recently.
 
sharon said:
McCarthy was a drunk and a trouble maker..
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McCarthy was also right. Ouch!

Senator Joe McCarthy was a lout, generally speaking. But he was on the right side of history and, in a broad sense, of morality as well. If, in some sort of parallel-universe exercise, the same number of (now proven) Soviet-Communist spies, collaborators, sympathizers, and the like were somehow switched to Nazis, and McCarthy went after them with the same vehemence as he went after Reds, Joe McCarthy might well have universities and foundations named after him today.​

Two Cheers For “McCarthyism”? - Jonah Goldberg - National Review Online
 
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