Putin again demands that Ukraine withdraw from Donbass for a possible ceasefire

[iguanaman]

Yes, I did, by pointing out how nonsensical trying to equate support for a ceasefire to “siding with Trump” is.

Support for Russia's ludicrous and insulting demands for a "possible" ceasefire is siding with Putin. Trump is just his pawn.

 

[iguanaman]

Clearly false. East Germany, for example, gave up its land over the Oder even before the Treaty of Zgorzelec was officially signed.

LOL And before the nation of E. Germany was even formed..... You failed yet again.

The statement is a historical simplification. Following World War II, the territories east of the Oder-Neisse line, including land that had been part of East Germany's historical predecessors, were placed under Polish and Soviet administration by the Potsdam Agreement, not "given up" by East Germany as a separate entity, since the country had not yet been formed. Germany lost this territory because the Allied powers redrew the map of Europe, compensating Poland for its wartime losses while creating a buffer zone for the Soviet Union. This was followed by the expulsion of millions of ethnic Germans from these lands, who were replaced by Polish settlers.

https://www.google.com/search?q=East+Germany,+for+example,+gave+up+its+land+over+the+Oder&rlz=1C1CHBD_enUS882US882&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8

 

[Tigerace117]

Support for Russia's ludicrous and insulting demands for a "possible" ceasefire is siding with Putin. Trump is just his pawn.

Diplomatic conditions for a ceasefire are entirely normal behavior.

 

[iguanaman]

Diplomatic conditions for a ceasefire are entirely normal behavior.

If you don't really want a ceasefire you make outlandish demands. That is the case with Putin.

 

[Tigerace117]

LOL And before the nation of E. Germany was even formed.....

The statement is a historical simplification. Following World War II, the territories east of the Oder-Neisse line, including land that had been part of East Germany's historical predecessors, were placed under Polish and Soviet administration by the Potsdam Agreement, not "given up" by East Germany as a separate entity, since the country had not yet been formed. Germany lost this territory because the Allied powers redrew the map of Europe, compensating Poland for its wartime losses while creating a buffer zone for the Soviet Union. This was followed by the expulsion of millions of ethnic Germans from these lands, who were replaced by Polish settlers.

https://www.google.com/search?q=East+Germany,+for+example,+gave+up+its+land+over+the+Oder&rlz=1C1CHBD_enUS882US882&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8

….East Germany explicitly gave up and renounced all claim on the land within a year of its “official” independence. It was already formed in 1950.

 

[Tigerace117]

If you don't really want a ceasefire maybe.

I get you don’t actually want the killing to stop because you are clinging to fantasies that the next Ukrainian charge will have some miracle breakthrough when the last, like, half a dozen haven’t, but that doesn’t change the facts on the ground.

 

[iguanaman]

I get you don’t actually want the killing to stop because you are clinging to fantasies that the next Ukrainian charge will have some miracle breakthrough when the last, like, half a dozen haven’t, but that doesn’t change the facts on the ground.

The Ukrainians have "breakthroughs" daily when they annihilate multiple Russian attacks and destroy dozens of vehicles and 1000's of invading soldiers. This is a war of attrition and that is how you gauge success or failure. Those are the facts on the ground and but Putin does not care how many Russians die and will just get more to take their place . He has taken Stalin's advice and "victory at any price" is his creed. Putin could stop the killing at any time by agreeing to a ceasefire but he can't.

• Total casualties (Jan-Oct 2025): The UK Ministry of Defence estimates total Russian casualties since 2022 have reached 1.1 million, with over 332,000 of those occurring in 2025 alone.

https://www.google.com/search?q=Rus...AgiwAgHxBU1jIxCPW6lw&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8

 

[ColdHardTruth]

Not a peace agreement just a possible ceasefire. That is what Putin told Trump in his phone call. Trump calls that progress? That is what this new meeting is about? It is just more stalling and manipulating Trump to help Russia continue this war. Putin will never agree to any meeting where Zelensky is present either.

Putin needs to withdraw from Ukraine and stay the hell out of it.

 

[Tigerace117]

The Ukrainians have "breakthroughs" daily when they annihilate multiple Russian attacks and destroy dozens of vehicles and 1000's of invading soldiers. This is a war of attrition and that is how you gauge success or failure. Those are the facts on the ground and but Putin does not care how many Russians die and will just get more to take their place . He has taken Stalin's advice and "victory at any price" is his creed. Putin could stop the killing at any time by agreeing to a ceasefire but he can't.

• Total casualties (Jan-Oct 2025): The UK Ministry of Defence estimates total Russian casualties since 2022 have reached 1.1 million, with over 332,000 of those occurring in 2025 alone.

https://www.google.com/search?q=Russia+had+lost+500,000+men+in+2025&rlz=1C1CHBD_enUS882US882&oq=Russia+had+lost+500,000+men+in+2025&gs_lcrp=EgZjaHJvbWUyBggAEEUYOdIBCjE3OTUwajBqMTWoAgiwAgHxBU1jIxCPW6lw&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8

The UK also thought going into Iraq was a great idea. Their “intelligence”’s track record is total trash.

I’m glad you enjoyed those War Thunder videos you’ve been watching in place of the actual news, though.

 

[Integrityrespec]

Not a peace agreement just a possible ceasefire. That is what Putin told Trump in his phone call. Trump calls that progress? That is what this new meeting is about? It is just more stalling and manipulating Trump to help Russia continue this war. Putin will never agree to any meeting where Zelensky is present either.

So exactly what do lyou want Trump to do? It's looking more and more like there will have to be very serious sanctions that will only work if European allies shut Russia off from all trade. Otherwise tomahawk missles are going to have to rain on Russia, and Eruopean neighbors are going to have to sent boots.

 

[Integrityrespec]

Putin needs to withdraw from Ukraine and stay the hell out of it.

Agreed, but he's not going to do that without some strong motivation. Talking to him is not going to work. So what is the answer? Make Putin wage war against NATO?

 

[iguanaman]

So exactly what do lyou want Trump to do? It's looking more and more like there will have to be very serious sanctions that will only work if European allies shut Russia off from all trade. Otherwise tomahawk missles are going to have to rain on Russia, and Eruopean neighbors are going to have to sent boots.

I want Trump to sanction Russia and stop making Putin a world celebrity and saying Putin wants peace when he doesn't. Putin's behavior does not warrant any meetings with him for any reason. That is just propping the war criminal up and prolonging the war. He could also at least send Ukraine the remaining $3.9 billion in weapons that Congress passed a bill to provide them to Ukraine in 2024.

In practice and rhetoric, American aid to Ukraine appears to be drying up. The administration approved a $50 million sale of military aid to Ukraine in April, but only after Kyiv signed off on a controversial minerals sharing deal. But the White House is also yet to dip into some $3.9 billion earmarked to fund military aid to Ukraine -- to be drawn from existing U.S. stocks, meaning it can be delivered quickly -- that Biden was not able to spend before the end of his term.

https://abcnews.go.com/Internationa...ose-battlefield-conundrums/story?id=122624970

 

[Tigerace117]

I want Trump to sanction Russia and stop making Putin a world celebrity and saying Putin wants peace when he doesn't. Putin's behavior does not warrant any meetings with him for any reason. That is just propping the war criminal up and prolonging the war. He could also at least send Ukraine the remaining $3.9 billion in weapons that Congress passed a bill to provide them to Ukraine in 2024.

In practice and rhetoric, American aid to Ukraine appears to be drying up. The administration approved a $50 million sale of military aid to Ukraine in April, but only after Kyiv signed off on a controversial minerals sharing deal. But the White House is also yet to dip into some $3.9 billion earmarked to fund military aid to Ukraine -- to be drawn from existing U.S. stocks, meaning it can be delivered quickly -- that Biden was not able to spend before the end of his term.

https://abcnews.go.com/Internationa...ose-battlefield-conundrums/story?id=122624970

So in other words no, you don’t actually want “the killing to stop”. Glad we’ve throughly established that.

 

[iguanaman]

So in other words no, you don’t actually want “the killing to stop”. Glad we’ve throughly established that.

I would like Putin to agree to a ceasefire like Ukraine has but it is a false hope. Putin cannot afford to end this war.

 

[Tigerace117]

I would like Putin to agree to a ceasefire like Ukraine has but it is a false hope.

Except you just said you don’t want anyone meeting with Putin, so how would that get accomplished, exactly?

 

[Rogue Valley]

Agreed, but he's not going to do that without some strong motivation. Talking to him is not going to work.

Agreed. Putin only understands power. Then why is Trump traveling to Hungary to chat with Puitn?

To have Putin piss on his head again? Does Trump never tire of being humiliated? Is it a sexual thing with Donnie?

 

[dandolo2k]

Eisenhower did not give up land to the N. Koreans. Zelensky has agreed to an unconditional ceasefire and Putin has not. You keep forgetting that. There is no stalemate in this war of attrition either. Ukraine is clearly winning.

Ukraine is winning ? Ooops , that’s a news of a century . So why it begs for ceasefire ? Why does it beg for super weapons , all these tomahawks , HIMARS ?
We just need to sit and wait until Ukraine wins decisively . Retaking all its lands and …”going further”. Beyond its “internationally recognised borders”.

 

[iguanaman]

Ukraine is winning ? Ooops , that’s a news of a century . So why it begs for ceasefire ? Why does it beg for super weapons , all these tomahawks , HIMARS ?
We just need to sit and wait until Ukraine wins decisively . Retaking all its lands and …”going further”. Beyond its “internationally recognised borders”.

LOL Trump is the one begging for a ceasefire and Zelensky is going along to get more weapons for Ukraine. Trump offered Tomahawks to get Putin to call him and it worked. Zelensky knew they would never come. What we are waiting for is for is Russia's economic collapse and it gets closer by the day. Wait until Ukraine turns off the power in Moscow and St. Petersburg. It will be all over for Russia and Ukraine will reclaim all its territory.

 

[joluoto]

Trump is going to look like a played fool once again. He just keeps giving Putin time. I don't understand how Trump's ego puts up with this. Then again maybe his ego is so delusional he thinks he can bring Putin to heel.

I think the reason Trump wanted to give tomahawks to Ukraine until recently is because his ego was reallt hurt by Putin in Alaska. However his ego also is why he now falls for Putin again and will be made a fool of again. He think he is this big Peacemaker who alone can bring peace to the world, even though his Saudi Peace Deal in Israel already fell apart.

 

[ColdHardTruth]

Agreed, but he's not going to do that without some strong motivation. Talking to him is not going to work. So what is the answer? Make Putin wage war against NATO?

Putin has to be crushed, disgraced, and broken.

It's the only thing the Russians understand.

 

[Tigerace117]

Putin has to be crushed, disgraced, and broken.

It's the only thing the Russians understand

The U.S. lacks the power to accomplish any such thing.

 

[Roadvirus]

Not a peace agreement just a possible ceasefire. That is what Putin told Trump in his phone call. Trump calls that progress? That is what this new meeting is about? It is just more stalling and manipulating Trump to help Russia continue this war. Putin will never agree to any meeting where Zelensky is present either.

Demand ignored, denied and spat on.

Cram it up your ass sideways, Putzin.

 

[Roadvirus]

Trump is going to look like a played fool once again.

Been there, done that.

 

[dandolo2k]

Demand ignored, denied and spat on.

Cram it up your ass sideways, Putzin.

Why all this blathering over and over ?
Such desperate cries , yells , frantic whining ... Russia demands a small additional parcel of land in Donbass , why not to give it to them and seal the deal ? They can liberate much larger territory themselves ....

 

[dandolo2k]

If you don't really want a ceasefire you make outlandish demands. That is the case with Putin.

Ukraine must understand that all their subsequent attempts to reconquer Donbass will lead to new territorial losses.
So this concession is the only way to deter Ukrainian nationalists from prolongation of their eternal war against Donbass .