Potential 'smoking gun' showing Obama administration spied on Trump team, source says

[Vern]

Re: Potential 'smoking gun' showing Obama administration spied on Trump team, source

If its fake news then I'm sure that you'll be able to provide the proof that the Fox story in the OP did not happen?

to be fair Kal, you too should be skeptical of fox news. Here's the perfect example of fake news


EXCLUSIVE: CIA operators were denied request for help during Benghazi attack, sources say | Fox News

That bald faced lie was found to be a bald faced lie in the first Benghazi investigation. We had 7 or 8 more investigations and they all found the stand down order was a bald faced lie. And the only purpose of that bald faced lie was to try to influence the election. How funny is it that conservatives have been peppered with fake news for 8 years (examples available upon request) and obediently believed every single lie now claim they don’t have to believe actual facts because of “fake news”.

Anyhoo, based on the current conservative narrative where you if you pretend that the CBO, CIA, FBI ,CNN etc. lied so you no longer have to believe anything they ever say again, you must now call Fox news liars and refuse to believe anything they ever tell you again. Oh and by the way, Fox is still lying. As I said the 8 or 9 investigations proved the stand down order was a bald faced lie.

No stand down order or military missteps in Benghazi attack, GOP-controlled intel panel finds | Fox News

Oh look, fox is still pushing the stand down lies. Just like conservatives here, once they have a narrative they like, they don't care what the facts are.

Heroes of Benghazi to Megyn Kelly: 'We Were Told to Stand Down'
Heroes of Benghazi to Megyn Kelly: 'We Were Told to Stand Down' | Fox News Insider

 

[Kal'Stang]

Re: Potential 'smoking gun' showing Obama administration spied on Trump team, source

to be fair Kal, you too should be skeptical of fox news. Here's the perfect example of fake news


EXCLUSIVE: CIA operators were denied request for help during Benghazi attack, sources say | Fox News

That bald faced lie was found to be a bald faced lie in the first Benghazi investigation. We had 7 or 8 more investigations and they all found the stand down order was a bald faced lie. And the only purpose of that bald faced lie was to try to influence the election. How funny is it that conservatives have been peppered with fake news for 8 years (examples available upon request) and obediently believed every single lie now claim they don’t have to believe actual facts because of “fake news”.

Anyhoo, based on the current conservative narrative where you if you pretend that the CBO, CIA, FBI ,CNN etc. lied so you no longer have to believe anything they ever say again, you must now call Fox news liars and refuse to believe anything they ever tell you again. Oh and by the way, Fox is still lying. As I said the 8 or 9 investigations proved the stand down order was a bald faced lie.

No stand down order or military missteps in Benghazi attack, GOP-controlled intel panel finds | Fox News

Oh look, fox is still pushing the stand down lies. Just like conservatives here, once they have a narrative they like, they don't care what the facts are.

Heroes of Benghazi to Megyn Kelly: 'We Were Told to Stand Down'
Heroes of Benghazi to Megyn Kelly: 'We Were Told to Stand Down' | Fox News Insider

I always am skeptical no matter the news site. :shrug: The only time I even read/watch Fox is when its brought up here at DP.

 

[CanadaJohn]

Re: Potential 'smoking gun' showing Obama administration spied on Trump team, source

Nunes now admits he did to provide political help to a besieged President. That is NOT his job as chair of that committee.

It is my opinion that the chair of a congressional committee looking into possible criminality in the executive branch DOES NOT run to the White House like a little lap dog to his master with every tiny nugget he thinks he may have found and thereby jeopardizing the very congressional investigation he has been entrusted to head up.

If you want to take steps toward American fascism, one good way to do that is to weaken the checks and balances and reduce one branch to the servant of the other. That is what Nunes did. He took some of the first steps to weakening his own branch and their responsibilities.

Nonsense.

And I would like you to point to a reference, if you can, where Nunes stated he "did provide political help to a besieged President". I'm guessing that's just your wishful twist of what actually happened.

 

[OlNate]

Re: Potential 'smoking gun' showing Obama administration spied on Trump team, source

Nonsense.

And I would like you to point to a reference, if you can, where Nunes stated he "did provide political help to a besieged President". I'm guessing that's just your wishful twist of what actually happened.

Is this what you guys are looking for?

Nunes Admits ?Duty and Obligation? to Trump

The quote being:

"“I felt I had a duty and obligation to tell him because as you know he’s been taking a lot of heat in the news media,” Nunes said on Hannity’s Fox News show. “I think to some degree there are some things that he should look at to see whether in fact he thinks the collection was proper or not.”"

 

[haymarket]

Re: Potential 'smoking gun' showing Obama administration spied on Trump team, source

Nonsense.

And I would like you to point to a reference, if you can, where Nunes stated he "did provide political help to a besieged President". I'm guessing that's just your wishful twist of what actually happened.

Sure - its right here

TONIGHT on 'Hannity': Devin Nunes Discusses Explosive Surveillance Revelations | Fox News Insider

btw - the quotes you put around MY CHARACTERIZATION of the Nunes lap dog excuse should not be confused with a quote from Nunes.

 

[Kal'Stang]

Re: Potential 'smoking gun' showing Obama administration spied on Trump team, source

Sure - its right here

TONIGHT on 'Hannity': Devin Nunes Discusses Explosive Surveillance Revelations | Fox News Insider

btw - the quotes you put around MY CHARACTERIZATION of the Nunes lap dog excuse should not be confused with a quote from Nunes.

Wait a second here....didn't you say the following....

I am 67 years old. I was raised to mean what you say and say what you mean. When somebody tells me that Jack killed his neighbors pig - I hear that somebody named Jack killed a pig who belonged to his neighbor. I do not stop and ask if he is being literal or figurative or if the word pig is clumsy shorthand for something different that a pig or if the word killed means something other than what it does.

Say what you mean and mean what you say....that generally entails that you do not characterize what other people say. And yet here you are admitting that you are doing that very thing.

It is cute that you're backtracking though...

 

[haymarket]

Re: Potential 'smoking gun' showing Obama administration spied on Trump team, source

Wait a second here....didn't you say the following....



Say what you mean and mean what you say....that generally entails that you do not characterize what other people say. And yet here you are admitting that you are doing that very thing.

It is cute that you're backtracking though...

I am confident that what you wrote makes sense to you. It makes no sense to me however.

Every person here including myself and you characterize what lots of public figures say as a normal way to avoid filling our posts with hundreds of quotes when there is no real dispute about what the person said.

Do you think I unfairly described what Nunes said?

 

[CanadaJohn]

Re: Potential 'smoking gun' showing Obama administration spied on Trump team, source

Sure - its right here

TONIGHT on 'Hannity': Devin Nunes Discusses Explosive Surveillance Revelations | Fox News Insider

btw - the quotes you put around MY CHARACTERIZATION of the Nunes lap dog excuse should not be confused with a quote from Nunes.

I see - so your words are not to be taken literally, as you take the President's words in his tweet. You're to be given the benefit of context, whereas the President is restricted to the narrow, literal, meaning of every word. Noted.

As for the notation, fair enough - but I don't see how that is political cover for the President. It is, however, providing the President with information the Director of the FBI was circumspect about, relying on confidentiality of an investigation to hide the truth from the public. When asked, directly, in the committee hearings, if the President and/or his transition team were caught up in any communications taped/monitored, Comey would only admit that an investigation was being conducted at that time. Since it was a clear matter of public issue and speculation, Comey should have been instructed to admit such, in open hearings, and not leave the impression that no such surveillance occurred.

That's not providing political cover - that's providing honesty and transparency and refusing to let the President hang out to dry while people like you claim he made it all up.

 

[haymarket]

Re: Potential 'smoking gun' showing Obama administration spied on Trump team, source

I see - so your words are not to be taken literally, as you take the President's words in his tweet. You're to be given the benefit of context, whereas the President is restricted to the narrow, literal, meaning of every word. Noted.

Take my words as they are written... just don't put quotes around them and then make it look like they are being attributed to Nunes.

As for the notation, fair enough - but I don't see how that is political cover for the President. It is, however, providing the President with information the Director of the FBI was circumspect about, relying on confidentiality of an investigation to hide the truth from the public. When asked, directly, in the committee hearings, if the President and/or his transition team were caught up in any communications taped/monitored, Comey would only admit that an investigation was being conducted at that time. Since it was a clear matter of public issue and speculation, Comey should have been instructed to admit such, in open hearings, and not leave the impression that no such surveillance occurred.

That's not providing political cover - that's providing honesty and transparency and refusing to let the President hang out to dry while people like you claim he made it all up.

Nunes owes Trump squat. He is a member of the legislative branch in an oversight role over the executive branch. They are investigating the executive branch as part of our constitutional checks and balances. The reason we allow the executive branch to do things in secret is because we have a check on them in terms of Congress and this committee.

When Nunes did what he did the other day running to the White House like a lap dog with a bone drop[ping it at his masters feet hoping to get his belly scratched in return, he comely violates that import checks and balances role. And when he says he did this to help the President going through some tough political times - its ten times as worse.

This bozo was a member of the Trump transition team. How he is head of the committee investigating Trump and his team is highly suspect to begin with. And now Nunes has erased all that suspicion confirming his own inability to carry out the role.

 

[CanadaJohn]

Re: Potential 'smoking gun' showing Obama administration spied on Trump team, source

Take my words as they are written... just don't put quotes around them and then make it look like they are being attributed to Nunes.

I put quotes around them because this is what you posted:

Nunes now admits he did to provide political help to a besieged President. That is NOT his job as chair of that committee.


How did Nunes "admit" if not verbally? You put the words in Nunes' mouth, not me, and now you want to weasel out of your own false narrative. Pathetic.

As for the rest, nothing but partisan BS.

 

[Grand Mal]

Re: Potential 'smoking gun' showing Obama administration spied on Trump team, source

I judge it possible based on past history of our government. Do you deny that they have done bad things and tried to cover them up? Do you deny that the CIA has a program designed specifically to leave a "fingerprint" leading back to Russia? Do you deny that our government has condoned purposely gathering private information on its own citizens?

I'm not saying that this DID happen with Trump. But it IS a possibility. Our government has a long history of doing things that they are not supposed to be doing. That you cannot deny.

I was wondering, if the FBI and the intelligence agencies were part of Obama's administration, and followed the Presidents wishes by surveilling Trump, are they now part of Trump's administration?

 

[Kal'Stang]

Re: Potential 'smoking gun' showing Obama administration spied on Trump team, source

I was wondering, if the FBI and the intelligence agencies were part of Obama's administration, and followed the Presidents wishes by surveilling Trump, are they now part of Trump's administration?

Technically yes. Doesn't mean that they are not biased due to previous allegiance though. It's why most people that are appointed are usually replaced by the incoming administration where ever possible.

 

[Kal'Stang]

Re: Potential 'smoking gun' showing Obama administration spied on Trump team, source

I am confident that what you wrote makes sense to you. It makes no sense to me however.

Every person here including myself and you characterize what lots of public figures say as a normal way to avoid filling our posts with hundreds of quotes when there is no real dispute about what the person said.

Do you think I unfairly described what Nunes said?

So you don't always say what you mean and mean what you say.

 

[haymarket]

Re: Potential 'smoking gun' showing Obama administration spied on Trump team, source

So you don't always say what you mean and mean what you say.

of course I do and what I just meant to say what what I said in asking you if I unfairly described what Nunes said. And you were impotent to answer so you attacked.

 

[Kal'Stang]

Re: Potential 'smoking gun' showing Obama administration spied on Trump team, source

of course I do and what I just meant to say what what I said in asking you if I unfairly described what Nunes said. And you were impotent to answer so you attacked.

I'm just pointing out something hypocritical that you said. If you consider that as an attack that is your problem.

 

[Grand Mal]

Re: Potential 'smoking gun' showing Obama administration spied on Trump team, source

Technically yes. Doesn't mean that they are not biased due to previous allegiance though. It's why most people that are appointed are usually replaced by the incoming administration where ever possible.

Why do you people think corruption is so rife in your government's agencies that they're not only inappropriately loyal to the President, they actually maintain that inappropriate loyalty to the last President at the expense of the current one? If there's the slightest concern, for example, that Comey is acting out of loyalty to any President, he needs to be replaced by the Attorney General.
Or is it assumed that the FBI, the NSA, etc. are creatures of the President?

 

[Lethargic Aptitude]

Re: Potential 'smoking gun' showing Obama administration spied on Trump team, source

Facts are difficult, I know, when you're trying to defend a narrative. I'm not trying to defend anyone. I simply state that Trump is correct in his assertion that he and his transition team had at least some of their communications monitored, whether directly or indirectly - Nunes validated that assertion. Likewise, both the FBI Director and Nunes verified that the FBI was conducting surveillance of Russian elements in connection with the Trump campaign/transition through November, December, and January, all periods during which Obama was President and responsible for the actions of the US government and its various agencies.

You're free to keep dancing on the pinhead of "wiretapping" and Obama authorized it. I think most people are coming to an understanding and appreciation of the gist of the allegations - that being, the Obama administration monitored and leaked classified communications of the Trump transition team and while the monitoring may have been tangentially legal, the leaking was a felony.

We do not know if Trump or any of his people were monitored. If you have the evidence by all means share it. I bet the house intelligence committee would like to see it. Until then you are just repeating what Nunes sort of claimed. I mean come on: First Trump asserts that something was going to be released soon. Then Nunes magically finds something? And he just happens to run over to the white house with so called new information? perhaps you are so naive to believe shenanigans like that but most people are going to notice it. Trump hasnt disseminated anything on his claim. Trump what; predicted that out of the blue without his knowledge that Nunes was going to find this crap? Most likely Trump told Nunes to say what he said when where and how.

 

[Kal'Stang]

Re: Potential 'smoking gun' showing Obama administration spied on Trump team, source

Why do you people think corruption is so rife in your government's agencies that they're not only inappropriately loyal to the President, they actually maintain that inappropriate loyalty to the last President at the expense of the current one? If there's the slightest concern, for example, that Comey is acting out of loyalty to any President, he needs to be replaced by the Attorney General.
Or is it assumed that the FBI, the NSA, etc. are creatures of the President?

They are creatures of the President. :shrug: At least the appointed ones are. Most people that are appointed aren't done so solely on the basis of their record on how well they do their job. They get appointed because they more often than not they are great ass kissers or know how to play the politics game. I'm not saying all are like this. But most are.

As for corruption being so rife within our government...history. :shrug: No government should be spying on its own citizens unless there is an absolute need to do so. One which a warrant that isn't issued by a secret "court" is issued. No government should be using "no fly lists" or attempting to get citizens banned from exercising their 2nd amendment Rights based on the flimsiest of reasons by using that list. And those are just a few things out of a very long laundry list of dirty clothes.

Our government is corrupt because the people that are running it are more concerned with power and lining their pockets than doing what is actually right for the country. That is the biggest reason that Trump was elected. Not because people actually wanted him. But because he wasn't a politician. He wasn't a part of the "establishment". At least that is what many thought. Fact of the matter is that he's been gaming the system for decades. Just like any other politician. Only difference now is that what he was doing before vs what he is doing now is the same thing. But in reality, gaming the system and running that system are two very different things. He has yet to realize this. That imo gives We The People an edge.........if we take advantage of it. I've yet to see anyone that is capable of doing so actually do so though. I'd try if I could, but frankly, being poor white trash means that I'm not going to get anywhere close to doing what needs to be done in the time allotted. I tell you though...this is a PERFECT time for anyone that is Independent and has the capability and money if they realize the opportunity that is sitting right there in the open.

 

[CanadaJohn]

Re: Potential 'smoking gun' showing Obama administration spied on Trump team, source

We do not know if Trump or any of his people were monitored. If you have the evidence by all means share it. I bet the house intelligence committee would like to see it. Until then you are just repeating what Nunes sort of claimed. I mean come on: First Trump asserts that something was going to be released soon. Then Nunes magically finds something? And he just happens to run over to the white house with so called new information? perhaps you are so naive to believe shenanigans like that but most people are going to notice it. Trump hasnt disseminated anything on his claim. Trump what; predicted that out of the blue without his knowledge that Nunes was going to find this crap? Most likely Trump told Nunes to say what he said when where and how.

So you don't believe FBI Director Comey when he told the Congressional hearing that his agency was conducting an investigation into possible links between the Russians and Trump's campaign/transition team between November 2016 and January 2017?

So you don't believe that Chairman Nunes was telling the truth when he addressed the media about being briefed by US intelligence agencies that members of the Trump team had been caught up in monitoring and taped conversations?

So you believe that members of the House Intelligence Committee, of which Nunes is Chair, are keeping silent about Nunes lying to the media?

I'd say it takes a whole heap of willful disinterest and ignorance to take the position you have.

 

[Socrates1]

Re: Potential 'smoking gun' showing Obama administration spied on Trump team, source

So President Obama ordered a wiretap of Trumps phones during the election campaign?

Absolutely !!!

 

[Socrates1]

Re: Potential 'smoking gun' showing Obama administration spied on Trump team, source

So, in using surveillance on others, some Trump surrogates where heard, and this makes what Trump said less of a lie how? And how is it spying on some one, when you are not spying on them? I realize you are desperate to try and turn a lie into truth, but, for god's sake, at least have a little bit of actual knowledge of the topic...

Perhaps you should have a dribble of knowledge about the topic ! To continue to listen in on someone conversations is SPYING ! Trump had his conversations with Australian leaders and the Mexican president among other friendly World leaders spied on and this went on for MONTHS ! Please explain Obama's reasons for spying on AP , James Rosen , hundreds of Republican appointed JUDGES , and several FRIENDLY World leaders ? Did you conveniently forget that SPYING ?

 

[haymarket]

Re: Potential 'smoking gun' showing Obama administration spied on Trump team, source

Absolutely !!!

And your verifiable evidence for this claim of alleged fact is what?

 

[Socrates1]

Re: Potential 'smoking gun' showing Obama administration spied on Trump team, source

And your verifiable evidence for this claim of alleged fact is what?

Do your own research ! Try looking up spying on AP , Rosen , World leaders for a small dose ! :roll:

 

[haymarket]

Re: Potential 'smoking gun' showing Obama administration spied on Trump team, source

Do your own research ! Try looking up spying on AP , Rosen , World leaders for a small dose ! :roll:

So you cannot back up your statement. Got it.

YOU have 100% responsibility to prove your own claims of fact. Nobody else - including myself - has any obligation to lift one finger to assist you.

 

[Lethargic Aptitude]

Re: Potential 'smoking gun' showing Obama administration spied on Trump team, source

So you don't believe FBI Director Comey when he told the Congressional hearing that his agency was conducting an investigation into possible links between the Russians and Trump's campaign/transition team between November 2016 and January 2017?

WTF? How did you even come to that conclusion from what i wrote?

So you don't believe that Chairman Nunes was telling the truth when he addressed the media about being briefed by US intelligence agencies that members of the Trump team had been caught up in monitoring and taped conversations?

I have seen no evidence, all that I have seen is Nunes saying ****. perhaps you can just believe with faith in Nunes, but I see Nunes as being a politician, and no one should just take politicians at their word.

So you believe that members of the House Intelligence Committee, of which Nunes is Chair, are keeping silent about Nunes lying to the media?

I see no reason why to not suspect that Nunes is lying. I mean look at Trump he lies his ass off all the time. And it appears that Nunes is loyal to trump. Do you know why we dont have any evidence? Because if the information is real it was classified. So either Nunes lied or leaked classified information. Either way it is impossible to know if what he claimed is true. It would be no different than claiming at this point to know Trump colluded with Russia. Both are possible but definitely not known at this point.

I'd say it takes a whole heap of willful disinterest and ignorance to take the position you have.

You dont seem to have a clue what my position is. Ill make it clear for you: Nunes made an accusation without any evidence to support him. Just like Trump and his wiretap lie.

March 15, 2017 Trump says: " I think you’re going to find some very interesting items coming to the forefront over the next two weeks."

Then on the 22nd Nunes goes to Ryan then Trump and then straight to a impromptu news conference. Then remarkably Trump claims that he has been vindicated in his wiretap claim. Now that can all be a strange coincidence or more than likely it is a Trump orchestrated line of BS..