Post Conception Opt-Out FOR MEN

[Lursa]

Nope, not what I meant. Not sure how your brain even reached that conclusion based on what I wrote?

Instead of responding civilly to civil debate, he's not even trying to rein in the misogyny, he wont even comment when I relate the exact same to couples, he only blames women. Come on @Bodi, why not try to debate in good faith? Current abusive posting is not helping support your OP at all.

 

[EnchantedMuggle]

Women having children that they can not afford and that will end up in drug and gang infested communities, with abuse and poor education and and and... but that is okay and society has to pay for that

Women aren't supposed to have to try to afford children all on their own; that's where the father -- the other party responsible for the pregnancy -- comes in.

He played, he paid.

They both paid. Her body will never be the same no matter what option she chooses, and her mind and emotions probably won't be, either. That's forever. He pays financially; that's over in 18 years.

Tought darts in both cases.

Once the child is here, it's just that, a child, and the state WILL require that it is supported, and the parties responsible for the creation of that child, the mother *and* the father, will be gone after first to support that child, and the taxpayers second.

 

[Lursa]

Once the child is here, it's just that, a child, and the state WILL require that it is supported, and the parties responsible for the creation of that child, the mother *and* the father, will be gone after first to support that child, and the taxpayers second.

I think this is why he wants some kind of "post-conception/pre-birth" opt out but he's not explaining why that specifically because:

a) It doesnt prevent her from having the kid (which he acknowledges)​

b) it will not supersede the child's right to support from both parents if she does have it​

c) it will not prevent the father from contacting the kid/kid contacting the father in the future and so the father can choose to 'opt back in' to fatherhood any time he wants​

So his entire full page OP post seems mostly venting. I dont know what actual end result he's expecting from his opt out. It doesnt get men "legally" out of the financial side of fatherhood. Does it @Bodi? If so, how?

 

[Bodi]

Women aren't supposed to have to try to afford children all on their own; that's where the father -- the other party responsible for the pregnancy -- comes in.

Why do other people have to pay for the woman's decision? Why can't she pay for her own choices?

He played, he paid.

Yet when she plays she does not have to pay. Inequal treatment under the law.

They both paid. Her body will never be the same no matter what option she chooses

She played she pays... *shrug*

, and her mind and emotions probably won't be, either

Oh, a pity card? LOL

. That's forever. He pays financially; that's over in 18 years.

What about his mind and emotions? He is just a wallet, huh?

Tought darts in both cases.

Once the child is here

There is no child at the post-conception, pre-birth part.

 

[Lursa]

Why do other people have to pay for the woman's decision? Why can't she pay for her own choices?

Why do other people have to pay for couples' decisions to have kids they cant afford? Why dont we make them pay for their own choices?

Why do you only call out women?

 

[Bodi]

Why do other people have to pay for couples' decisions to have kids they cant afford? Why dont we make them pay for their own choices?

Red Herring. This thread is not about couples that want a kid.

Why do you only call out women?

I don't.



,

 

[Lursa]

Red Herring. This thread is not about couples that want a kid.

But the complaint you have is exactly the same. It's hypocritical to only complain about women. (The thread wasnt about "biology" either, until biology screwed up your "legal arguments only" demands. And then suddenly you resorted to using biology )

Anybody that has read my posts on abortion knows that what you say is not true.

We know you support abortion, that's not what's in question. I can repost the link to the "Elephant in the Room" thread where you start leaning towards eugenics tho.

 

[Bodi]

But the complaint you have is exactly the same.

No. It isn't. If there are two people that want a kid in your scenario and there are only one, or none, that want one in my scenario, then they are not exactly the same. How can a persons logic be this bad?

It's hypocritical to only complain about women.

That is what the thread is about... women keeping a kid that the dad does not want and a kid that she can not care for properly.

Any time you'd like to address my posts directly and prove that, I'll be here.

No interest in the slightest. LOL

Otherwise, so far your post is BS.

Nope.

 

[Lursa]

No. It isn't. If there are two people that want a kid in your scenario and there are only one, or none, that want one in my scenario, then they are not exactly the same. How can a persons logic be this bad?

Here you go: The fact is that they're the same because they made a choice to have kid they cant afford...just like the women you are singling out.

Why do you deny this, is your logic "that bad."

That is what the thread is about... women keeping a kid that the dad does not want and a kid that she can not care for properly.

See: B above and you know this: it doesnt matter what she can or cannot afford. The child has a right to support from both parents, no matter what their income. It's clearly stated in what I sourced.

You just want to be able to blame women. Or...please explain the reason behind "post-conception/pre-birth?"

No interest in the slightest. LOL

Well then each of my posts showing you're wrong will remain I'm fine with that.

Why arent you just fighting to end mandatory child support? You cant control her decision to have the kid or not, I know that's what infuriates you, but it's not about her, it's about the child's right to that support from both parents. If the opt out isnt binding, what does it accomplish?

You make it about women so you can keep your bitterness fresh. Or...feel free to explain as I keep requesting.

 

[Bodi]

Here you go: The fact is that they're the same because they made a choice to have kid they cant afford...just like the women you are singling out.

And society has to pay for it... but you are fine with that, hence the hypocrisy.

See: B above and you know this: it doesnt matter what she can or cannot afford. The child has a right to support from both parents, no matter what their income. It's clearly stated in what I sourced.

You just want to be able to blame women.

LOL

Or...please explain the reason behind "post-conception/pre-birth?"

Because at that time she can make a choice that is not selfish and force others to pay for her choice AND that will not put the child into unsafe conditions.

Well then each of my posts showing you're wrong will remain I'm fine with that.

More lack of logic. If your posts are wrong and I do not address them, they are still wrong.

Why arent you just fighting to end mandatory child support? You cant control her decision to have the kid or not, I know that's what infuriates you,

Yes, I am infuriated.

but it's not about her, it's about the child's right to that support from both parents.

There is no child.

You make it about women so you can keep your bitterness fresh.

Bitter about what? LOL

Or...feel free to explain as I keep requesting.

No interest in doing that. This is much more productive.

 

[Lursa]

And society has to pay for it... but you are fine with that, hence the hypocrisy.

You keep writing that lie, I keep asking you to quote where I've been fine with it...and you just keep lying with no quotes.

So...it seems you are the one lying. Right?

LOL

Why did you laugh this off?

See: B above and you know this: it doesnt matter what she can or cannot afford. The child has a right to support from both parents, no matter what their income. It's clearly stated in what I sourced.​

​

You just want to be able to blame women.​

Something here you dont want to admit to? I hope it's not the rights of children.

Because at that time she can make a choice that is not selfish and force others to pay for her choice AND that will not put the child into unsafe conditions.

Yup. So what's the "opt out" for? That's a conversation...and women already know it. What's the point of an unenforceable opt out law or agreement?

More lack of logic. If your posts are wrong and I do not address them, they are still wrong.

You're hiding again? It's all written out and usually sourced. If you feel like 'mine' are hidden from others, it's your logic that's lacking.

 

[Lursa]

Yes, I am infuriated.

What, specifically, infuriates you about this, so much so that you couldnt respond to it?

Why arent you just fighting to end mandatory child support? You cant control her decision to have the kid or not, I know that's what infuriates you, but it's not about her, it's about the child's right to that support from both parents. If the opt out isnt binding, what does it accomplish?​

Bitter about what? LOL

Your own experiences with this process which you've posted in the past.

No interest in doing that. This is much more productive.

I'm good with it. It's only another record of your opt out's failure. Cut and paste and bookmarking are convenient.

 

[Bodi]

You keep writing that lie, I keep asking you to quote where I've been fine with it...and you just keep lying with no quotes.

So...it seems you are the one lying. Right?

I am too infuriated to remember...

Why did you laugh this off?

See: B above and you know this: it doesnt matter what she can or cannot afford. The child has a right to support from both parents, no matter what their income. It's clearly stated in what I sourced.​

​

You just want to be able to blame women.​

Something here you dont want to admit to? I hope it's not the rights of children.



Yup. So what's the "opt out" for? That's a conversation...and women already know it. What's the point of an unenforceable opt out law or agreement?



You're hiding again? It's all written out and usually sourced. If you feel like 'mine' are hidden from others, it's your logic that's lacking.

I didn't say they were hidden, whatever the hell that means... I said they were incorrect.



t

 

[Bodi]

What, specifically, infuriates you about this, so much so that you couldnt respond to it?

Why arent you just fighting to end mandatory child support? You cant control her decision to have the kid or not, I know that's what infuriates you, but it's not about her, it's about the child's right to that support from both parents. If the opt out isnt binding, what does it accomplish?​

I am too infuriated and bitter to answer this...

AAARGHHH!!!!!

Your own experiences with this process which you've posted in the past.

What experience specifically? That way we can see your lie very clearly.

I'm good with it. It's only another record of your opt out's failure. Cut and paste and bookmarking are convenient.

Yet you get it all wrong every time... quite funny. LOL



.

 

[Lursa]

What experience specifically? That way we can see your lie very clearly.

Isnt honesty just easier? I wish you'd stick with that rather than falsely accusing me:

Bitterness at what? :roll: I have two beautiful daughters that I have 50% of the time and that I would gladly talke full time from my bitch ex-wife. I pay. Why would I be bitter at men paying even when I pay $800 dollars more a month to her than she does to me based off of income, because she "chooses" to no work? Even then I am not bitter. It sucks but that is life. I AM disappointed at the dishonesty of some posters here that will not acknowldge that there is more than one valid option in this debate though...

I am not concerned about me... I talked to the police a few times alone because of my crazy bitch ex-wife laying false allegations. I am just concerned over that police mentality. How about when the DA wants to talk to a witness... is getting your lawyer also a bad move, according to you/cops?

Simple search. And you accuse me of lying when you know you are? WTF? (And you should see the ones I didnt grab. Say thank you.)

 

[Bodi]

Isnt honesty just easier? I wish you'd stick with that rather than falsely accusing me:



Simple search. And you accuse me of lying when you know you are? WTF? (And you should see the ones I didnt grab. Say thank you.)

I asked what I was bitter about... but apparently all you can do is drudge up a few posts where I am saying that I am not bitter, funnily enough!


/

 

[Lursa]

I asked what I was bitter about... but apparently all you can do is drudge up a few posts where I am saying that I am not bitter, funnily enough!

A few?

Searching on your tag and "ex-wife" brought up 10 pages (and it only goes to 10)! You asked about "what experience." Those were just some of the milder and less personal ones.

 

[Bodi]

A few?

Searching on your tag and "ex-wife" brought up 10 pages (and it only goes to 10)! You asked about "what experience." Those were just some of the milder and less personal ones.

I have an ex-wife that screwed me, and our kids but you seem to think the whole thing is some kind of joke, that's fine... (interestingly enough, she is doing that right now to her last husband)... yeah, that all sucked. So what? I don't care if you consider that bitter... no biggy. I view it is matter of fact. Try dealing with a person that has chronic depression and BPD for a while and see how you like it.

 

[Lursa]

I have an ex-wife that screwed me (and interestingly enough, is doing right now to her last husband)... yeah, that sucks. So what? I don't care if you consider that bitter... no biggy. I view it is matter of fact. Try dealing with a person that has chronic depression and BPD for a while and see how you like it.

Hey...you accused me and now are mad. You should know by now I dont lie...yet you never learn. Please stick to the discussion, I only posted that to prove once again, that you lie and I dont.

The way you use that falsehood constantly, accusing me of lying, is only a tactic to get out of good faith discussion. Doesnt really work out well for you tho, does it?

 

[Bodi]

Hey...you accused me and now are mad.

Mad?

You should know by now I dont lie...yet you never learn. Please stick to the discussion, I only posted that to prove once again, that you lie and I dont.

The way you use that falsehood constantly, accusing me of lying, is only a tactic to get out of good faith discussion.

We are not having a good faith discussion...

Doesnt really work out well for you tho, does it?

Works out just fine... LOL. You think you have the hammer, or something?



0

 

[Lursa]

We are not having a good faith discussion...

Which one of us is trying? And it's not you

 

[Bodi]

Which one of us is trying?

No idea...

And it's not you

Trying ...





,

 

[Lursa]

No idea...



Trying ...

Get ahold of yourself. You are posting flowers and grins and chuckles and we're discussing your proven lies, abandoning kids, your (so far) failed opt out scheme, and your previous personal difficulties. These are some scary mood swings.

I'll try to get the discussion back on track, it's still relevant to try and get some explanations here. The questions are valid...dont hide and use personal insults to avoid them please.

Why arent you just fighting to end mandatory child support? You cant control her decision to have the kid or not, I know that's what infuriates you, but it's not about her, it's about the child's right to that support from both parents. If the opt out isnt binding, what does it accomplish?​

 

[Jagged]

Abort the child to protect it from abuse... that is a good thing.



How can you not even know that that is what you meant?

That's her choice to make. And who knows why you think you know what I meant after your last post thoroughly demonstrated you didn't.

 

[Jagged]

Instead of responding civilly to civil debate, he's not even trying to rein in the misogyny, he wont even comment when I relate the exact same to couples, he only blames women. Come on @Bodi, why not try to debate in good faith? Current abusive posting is not helping support your OP at all.

A clear sign even he knows he's lost this debate.