Panel Proposes That New Jersey End Executions (1 Viewer)

[26 X World Champs]

Just when we Democrats are reviving ourselves in the House, Senate, Governor mansions and State Legislatures (ALL DEMOCRATIC MAJORITIES) more good news! It looks like New Jersey will become the first state in 35 years to ban capital punishment. HOORAY! Nothing like some 21st Century decency to restore some creditability to the USA.

I hope this starts a wave that spreads throughout the USA. It's about time. A positive side effect will be to begin to restore the perception that the USA has some ethics and decency in it's government and that we're joining most of the world in putting capital punishment away forever.

The only reason we have executions in the USA is for revenge. It does not prevent any crimes so therefore how can a civilized nation like the USA execute people?

Here's the piece from today's NY Times....

Panel Proposes That New Jersey End Executions

By LAURA MANSNERUS - New York Times
Published: January 3, 2007

TRENTON, Jan. 2 — A legislative commission recommended on Tuesday that New Jersey become the first state in more than 35 years to abolish the death penalty, finding “no compelling evidence” that capital punishment serves a legitimate purpose, and increasing evidence that it “is inconsistent with evolving standards of decency.”

The report, whose lone dissenter was the original author of the state’s modern death penalty statute, came a year after New Jersey joined Illinois and Maryland in imposing moratoriums on executions, and amid growing unease among politicians and the public about capital punishment. Nine other states, including New York, have also suspended executions in recent years, most because of court decisions. Maryland had lifted its moratorium in 2003, after a year, but a court essentially reinstated it last month.

Death penalty experts said that New Jersey was the first state to receive an official recommendation that capital punishment be abandoned, and it lands in a state where legislators have a Democratic majority along with a Democratic governor who supports repeal of the statute.

The governor, Jon S. Corzine, embraced the report on Tuesday. “As someone who has long opposed the death penalty,” he said in a statement, “I look forward to working with the Legislature” to carry out the recommendations.

Source: Panel Proposes That New Jersey End Executions - New York Times

 

[cherokee]

Just when we Democrats are reviving ourselves in the House, Senate, Governor mansions and State Legislatures (ALL DEMOCRATIC MAJORITIES) more good news! It looks like New Jersey will become the first state in 35 years to ban capital punishment. HOORAY! Nothing like some 21st Century decency to restore some creditability to the USA.

I hope this starts a wave that spreads throughout the USA. It's about time. A positive side effect will be to begin to restore the perception that the USA has some ethics and decency in it's government and that we're joining most of the world in putting capital punishment away forever.

The only reason we have executions in the USA is for revenge. It does not prevent any crimes so therefore how can a civilized nation like the USA execute people?

Here's the piece from today's NY Times....


Source: Panel Proposes That New Jersey End Executions - New York Times

I disagree 100% with you. (What else it new) Ending the life of a child molester or the person below insures he will never and I do mean never attack anyone again.
Read this and tell you wish this perp to live..

BREVARD COUNTY, Fla. -- A blind man in Brevard County, whose throat was slashed, shared his remarkable story of survival Tuesday. Elijah Brown's caretaker, who was five months pregnant, was also attacked, but neither she nor her baby survived.

It's been almost a year since Brown was attacked and Laura Davis and her unborn child were murdered. In his first interview, he said he wishes the man who cut his throat would get the death penalty.

"I couldn't talk about it for a long time. I couldn't talk about it," said 74-year-old Elijah "Willie" Brown.

Brown may be blind, but he said he knows it was John Moore who cut his throat and left him for dead.

Blind Man Gives First Interview Since Throat Slashing - News

 

[Kandahar]

I disagree 100% with you. (What else it new) Ending the life of a child molester or the person below insures he will never and I do mean never attack anyone again.

So does life in solitary confinement with no parole.

Read this and tell you wish this perp to live..

Would the death penalty bring the woman back to life?

 

[cherokee]

So does life in solitary confinement with no parole.

With the chance to attack the guards, Doctor, Nurse, Head Dr.?

Would the death penalty bring the woman back to life?

No it won’t. Nothing will.
But he will never take a life again. Ever.

 

[Kandahar]

With the chance to attack the guards, Doctor, Nurse, Head Dr.?

If a person is that dangerous, then you send in several guards to restrain him before he sees a doctor or a nurse. That's one of the risks you take as a prison guard.

And that's really the only contact a person in solitary confinement would have with the outside world.

No it won’t. Nothing will.
But he will never take a life again. Ever.

See above. You don't need to kill him to make sure of that.

 

[Navy Pride]

I believe there are several left wing or blue states that don't have the death penalty..........

 

[Kandahar]

I believe there are several left wing or blue states that don't have the death penalty..........

Correct. And the murder rate in those states, generally speaking, is no higher than it is in states of comparable urban/rural demographics that DO have the death penalty.

 

[Navy Pride]

I might even be for life without parole but I have seen to many cases where a felon got life without the chance of parole and down the road some liberal judge felt sorry for the guy and said he was rehabilitated, turned him loose and the guy raped or murdered again , besides it bugs me to see this scum locked up with cable TV, playboy magazines and state of the art gyms to beef up on.................

 

[Morrow]

I believe there are several left wing or blue states that don't have the death penalty..........

Here is a good map of the blue states that doesn't allow the death penalty

http://www.wcadp.org/images/map-death-penalty-world-800.jpg

We're orange, like Mongolia and Cuba, can you believe that China is one of the only countries more progressive than us!?

 

[Navy Pride]

Correct. And the murder rate in those states, generally speaking, is no higher than it is in states of comparable urban/rural demographics that DO have the death penalty.

Well I can guareentee that the people executed are not committing all those murders.......

 

[disneydude]

I might even be for life without parole but I have seen to many cases where a felon got life without the chance of parole and down the road some liberal judge felt sorry for the guy and said he was rehabilitated, turned him loose and the guy raped or murdered again , besides it bugs me to see this scum locked up with cable TV, playboy magazines and state of the art gyms to beef up on.................

MYTH.
Yet again another lie perpetuated by NP.
This is SUCH a lie that in California the law requires that jurors be informed that LIFE W/O parole means Life W/O parole.
This is just an example of someone who listens to too much talk radio about people being freed.
Yes....there are cases where murderers have been paroled after receiving a "life" sentence. But for those who don't work in the justice system there is a difference between "Life" and "Life w/o the possibility of parole".

 

[BWG]

The death penalty is irreversible.
I've read of cases where new evidence, recanted testimony, new technology (DNA), etc., etc. has exonerated people.

Opps, I regret to inform you that we screwed up and your loved one is still dead.

 

[RightinNYC]

Just when we Democrats are reviving ourselves in the House, Senate, Governor mansions and State Legislatures (ALL DEMOCRATIC MAJORITIES) more good news! It looks like New Jersey will become the first state in 35 years to ban capital punishment. HOORAY! Nothing like some 21st Century decency to restore some creditability to the USA.

I hope this starts a wave that spreads throughout the USA. It's about time. A positive side effect will be to begin to restore the perception that the USA has some ethics and decency in it's government and that we're joining most of the world in putting capital punishment away forever.

The only reason we have executions in the USA is for revenge. It does not prevent any crimes so therefore how can a civilized nation like the USA execute people?

Here's the piece from today's NY Times....


Source: Panel Proposes That New Jersey End Executions - New York Times

Anything that results in less Jerseyites, I'm happy with.

 

[CaptainCourtesy]

Anything that results in less Jerseyites, I'm happy with.

Here's one for ya...no more executions in NJ, continuing executions in NY, more Jerseyans, fewer New Yorkers; the way it should be...life couldn't be better. :mrgreen:

 

[26 X World Champs]

I might even be for life without parole but I have seen to many cases where a felon got life without the chance of parole and down the road some liberal judge felt sorry for the guy and said he was rehabilitated, turned him loose and the guy raped or murdered again , besides it bugs me to see this scum locked up with cable TV, playboy magazines and state of the art gyms to beef up on.................

AAAH......The Navy Pride hearsay post...make a totally untrue unsubstantiated claim....don't bother to back up the falsehood with even one fact....what else is new? Who is this mystery liberal judge who changes laws and paroles murderers?

More importantly, even if what Navy Pride wrote has an actual truth to it (I doubt it)...how often has that happened versus executing the wrong person? How does NP or any of you pro-deathies account for killing the wrong person? How do you make it up to him?

 

[Marilyn Monroe]

If a person is that dangerous, then you send in several guards to restrain him before he sees a doctor or a nurse. That's one of the risks you take as a prison guard.

There is still always a possibility that he can kill, again.

And that's really the only contact a person in solitary confinement would have with the outside world.
See above. You don't need to kill him to make sure of that.

Solitary confinement is to me more cruel than the death penalty.

If all prisoners know that no matter what they do there is no DP this will mean they can and will become more dangerous in prison.

The DP may seem barbaric, but imprisonment is barbaric, too. When you soften one thing it could lead to more softening of other things. Shorter sentencing, easier parole. Don't know, but this is probably what could happen.

 

[reaganburch]

I agree with the purpose of the death penalty, but not how it is carried out. It shouldn't be some political thing that some prosecutor who wants to get elected to higher office decides he wants it for some poor black man or poor white man to show he's tough on crime.

If you are shown to be guilty of a crime, no doubt... what I mean is circumstantial evidence is not shown to be the primary factor in convicting. You should be given the death penalty. If you're convicted on circumstantial evidence only? Then no death penalty, just life without the possibility of parole.

For instance, Scott Peterson. I believe, without a doubt, he killed his wife, Laci. But, from what I read about the trial, and I could be wrong here, he was convicted on circumstantial evidence only. Therefore, he should NOT have gotten the death penalty.

The guy who murdered and raped that little girl in Florida? I can't remember his or the girl's name, but he confessed... I don't care if he was high or had a hard life, he gets the death penalty.

Andrea Yates? Death penalty... I don't care if she was insane. She did it, she gets the death penalty and the crime was heinous enough.

The problem with the death penalty is the political aspect of it all IMO.

 

[Marilyn Monroe]

I agree with the purpose of the death penalty, but not how it is carried out. It shouldn't be some political thing that some prosecutor who wants to get elected to higher office decides he wants it for some poor black man or poor white man to show he's tough on crime.

You make a good point. I think it can also be used by groups such as the ACLU to show the inhumanity of it. To me it's one side of the coin.

If you're convicted on circumstantial evidence only? Then no death penalty, just life without the possibility of parole.

For instance, Scott Peterson. I believe, without a doubt, he killed his wife, Laci. But, from what I read about the trial, and I could be wrong here, he was convicted on circumstantial evidence only. Therefore, he should NOT have gotten the death penalty.

Circumstantial evidence in MO can sometimes be better than eyewitness testimony. Eyewitnesses can lie, or distort what they saw or heard, and their memories may not match up to what occurred.

The guy who murdered and raped that little girl in Florida? I can't remember his or the girl's name, but he confessed... I don't care if he was high or had a hard life, he gets the death penalty.

This sounds logical.

Andrea Yates? Death penalty... I don't care if she was insane. She did it, she gets the death penalty and the crime was heinous enough.

I kind of agree on this one. She had to be a monster to do what she did. God can have mercy on her, but I don't think we should.

 

[Kandahar]

There is still always a possibility that he can kill, again.

Well, that's a risk of being a prison guard. They knew the risks when they took the job, just as police officers, firefighters, and soldiers do.

Solitary confinement is to me more cruel than the death penalty.

Fair enough, but each individual prisoner should be able to decide that. I have no problem with prison-lifers requesting the death penalty if they think it's less cruel.

If all prisoners know that no matter what they do there is no DP this will mean they can and will become more dangerous in prison.

Why? If it's more cruel to spend their life in prison, then they'd be dangerous and hoping to get put on death row. Right?

I'm not aware of any statistics suggesting prisons are more violent in DP states than in non-DP states.

The DP may seem barbaric, but imprisonment is barbaric, too. When you soften one thing it could lead to more softening of other things. Shorter sentencing, easier parole. Don't know, but this is probably what could happen.

So is removing the DP cruel or soft?

 

[reaganburch]

Circumstantial evidence in MO can sometimes be better than eyewitness testimony. Eyewitnesses can lie, or distort what they saw or heard, and their memories may not match up to what occurred.

If you're referring to DNA or something to that sort that really only points to ONE person, then yes, I'm all for that being a baseline for the death penalty.

Eyewitnesses CAN lie or not remember, but how 'bout we do something like they do in Texas? They use a 3 eyewitness baseline, at least that's what I have read or heard.

 

[26 X World Champs]

If you're referring to DNA or something to that sort that really only points to ONE person, then yes, I'm all for that being a baseline for the death penalty.

Eyewitnesses CAN lie or not remember, but how 'bout we do something like they do in Texas? They use a 3 eyewitness baseline, at least that's what I have read or heard.

This issue is confusing to me because civilized democracies have no business executing criminals. A strong majority of democracies in the world have banned the death penalty and/or have not performed it in at least 10 years:

Amnesty International classifies countries in four categories. 69 countries still maintain the death penalty in both law and practice. 88 countries have abolished it completely; 11 retain it, but only for crimes committed in exceptional circumstances (such as crimes committed in time of war). 29 other countries maintain laws permitting the use of the death penalty for ordinary crimes, but have allowed the death penalty to fall into disuse for at least 10 years

Source: Use of capital punishment by nation - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Out of 197 countries only 35% "maintian the death penalty in both law and practice. Who are these 35%? I will highlight for you the crowd the US hangs out with concerning the Death Penalty by bolding the ones I find the nastiest. I think you'll find very few "good guys" on the DP list and most of the "good guys" on the list that follows that has countries that have banned the DP.

Death Penalty Permitted

* Afghanistan
* Antigua and Barbuda
* Bahamas
* Bahrain
* Bangladesh
* Barbados
* Belarus
* Belize
* Botswana
* Burundi
* Cameroon
* Chad
* China (People's Republic)
* Comoros
* Congo (Democratic Republic)
* Cuba
* Dominica
* Egypt
* Equatorial Guinea
* Eritrea
* Ethiopia
* Gabon
* Ghana
* Guatemala
* Guinea
* Guyana
* India
* Indonesia
* Iran
* Iraq
* Jamaica
* Japan
* Jordan
* Kazakhstan
* Korea, North
* Korea, South
* Kuwait
* Kyrgyzstan
* Laos
* Lebanon
* Lesotho
* Libya
* Malawi
* Malaysia
* Mongolia
* Nigeria
* Oman
* Pakistan
* Palestinian Authority
* Qatar
* Rwanda
* St. Kitts and Nevis
* St. Lucia
* St. Vincent and the Grenadines
* Saudi Arabia
* Sierra Leone
* Singapore
* Somalia
* Sudan
* Swaziland
* Syria
* Taiwan
* Tajikistan
* Tanzania
* Thailand
* Trinidad and Tobago
* Uganda
* United Arab Emirates
* United States
* Uzbekistan
* Vietnam
* Yemen
* Zambia
* Zimbabwe

Death Penalty Outlawed (year)​

* Andorra (1990)
* Angola (1992)
* Armenia (2003)
* Australia (1984)
* Austria (1950)
* Azerbaijan (1998)
* Belgium (1996)
* Bermuda (1999)
* Bhutan (2004)
* Bosnia-Herzegovina (1997)
* Bulgaria (1998)
* Cambodia (1989)
* Canada (1976)
* Cape Verde (1981)
* Colombia (1910)
* Costa Rica (1877)
* Côte d'Ivoire (2000)
* Croatia (1990)
* Cyprus (1983)
* Czech Republic (1990)
* Denmark (1933)
* Djibouti (1995)
* Dominican Republic (1966)
* East Timor (1999)
* Ecuador (1906)
* Estonia (1998)
* Finland (1949)
* France (1981)
* Georgia (1997)
* Germany (1949)
* Greece (1993)
* Guinea-Bissau (1993)
* Haiti (1987)
* Honduras (1956)
* Hungary (1990)
* Iceland (1928)
* Ireland (1990)
* Italy (1947)
* Kiribati (1979)
* Liberia (2005)
* Liechtenstein (1987)
* Lithuania (1998)
* Luxembourg (1979)
* Macedonia (1991)
* Malta (1971)
* Marshall Islands (1986)
* Mauritius (1995)
* Mexico (2005)
* Micronesia (1986)
* Moldova (1995)
* Monaco (1962)
* Montenegro (2002)
* Mozambique (1990)
* Namibia (1990)
* Nepal (1990)
* Netherlands (1870)
* New Zealand (1961)
* Nicaragua (1979)
* Niue (n.a.)
* Norway (1905)
* Palau (n.a.)
* Panama (1903)
* Paraguay (1992)
* Poland (1997)
* Portugal (1867)
* Philippines (2006)
* Romania (1989)
* Samoa (2004)
* San Marino (1848)
* São Tomé and Príncipe (1990)
* Senegal (2004)
* Serbia (2002)
* Seychelles (1993)
* Slovak Republic (1990)
* Slovenia (1989)
* Solomon Islands (1966)
* South Africa (1995)
* Spain (1978)
* Sweden (1921)
* Switzerland (1942)
* Turkey (2002)
* Turkmenistan (1999)
* Tuvalu (1978)
* Ukraine (1999)
* United Kingdom (1973)
* Uruguay (1907)
* Vanuatu (1980)
* Vatican City (1969)
* Venezuela (1863)

Source: http://www.infoplease.com/ipa/A0777460.html

 

[Marilyn Monroe]

Well, that's a risk of being a prison guard. They knew the risks when they took the job, just as police officers, firefighters, and soldiers do.

You don't go into it expecting to get killed, it's a possibility. There are also other prisoners, and not all are in for life, so if they get killed it's ok? It's not ok for people to be put in greater danger.

Fair enough, but each individual prisoner should be able to decide that. I have no problem with prison-lifers requesting the death penalty if they think it's less cruel.

If it doesn't exist how can they request it? You know the ACLU would be hollaring a blue streak. Remember Jack Kervorkian?

Why? If it's more cruel to spend their life in prison, then they'd be dangerous and hoping to get put on death row. Right?

It's just as cruel to me, possibly more so, but people don't want to die, and usually have hope no matter how hopeless something is. They say after about 7 yrs. most lifers become resigned to it.

But if there's no death row they can't be put there, so they could kill, and they'd still have the same sentence.

I'm not aware of any statistics suggesting prisons are more violent in DP states than in non-DP states.

The SCOTUS did away with the DP in the late 60's early 70's because it was felt we had progressed past it and it was cruel and unusual punishment, it was reinstated.

I think maybe NJ is the only state that is doing away with the DP right now.

So is removing the DP cruel or soft?

Removing the DP leads to too much softness. This is what I think would happen.