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Origin of the Tree of Life

Lucidthots

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Binyamin said:
Yehoshua 11:5 וַיִּוָּעֲדוּ, כֹּל הַמְּלָכִים הָאֵלֶּה; וַיָּבֹאוּ וַיַּחֲנוּ יַחְדָּו, אֶל-מֵי מֵרוֹם, לְהִלָּחֵם, עִם-יִשְׂרָאֵל

Next?

Also, Americans did the same to the Native Americans, does that make...

S A TA N I C?

Please stop enlarging your text it's very immature.

"Americans" are not a religion.

Nonetheless, it is disgusting and Satanic, especially when done in the name of God!
 

Binyamin

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Lucidthots said:
JOSHUA 11: 6

"........I will have them all lying dead before Israel!"



DISGUSTING!
Well, they started it. :cool: We ended it, what's the problem?

Lucidthots said:
GENESIS: 9: 25
Cursed be Canaan:
The lowest of the slaves he shall be to his brothers.

Blessed be the Lord, God of Shem:

Let Canaan be a slave to them.
RACIST!

Yes, Ham sinned and Canaan is cursed, the reason being is that Hashem had already blessed Noah and his sons, and there fore a curse can't go where a blessing has gone. Therefore, Noah cursed his gandson, who, as clearly seen by the text, was deeply involved in the humiliating incident.
 

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Lucidthots said:
"Americans" are not a religion.

Nonetheless, it is disgusting and Satanic, especially when done in the name of God!
So it's disgusting and satanic when defending yourself? I'm sure if I came at you with a knife, you would defend yourself, how disgusting of you! how satanic! :roll:
 

Lucidthots

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Binyamin said:
Yehoshua 11:5 וַיִּוָּעֲדוּ, כֹּל הַמְּלָכִים הָאֵלֶּה; וַיָּבֹאוּ וַיַּחֲנוּ יַחְדָּו, אֶל-מֵי מֵרוֹם, לְהִלָּחֵם, עִם-יִשְׂרָאֵל

Next?

Also, Americans did the same to the Native Americans, does that make them...

S A TA N I C?

HILLARIOUS! A JEW DEFENDING GENOCIDE; I AM GOING TO REMEMBER THAT NEXT TIME THE JEWS START RANTING ABOUT HITLER, THE NAZIS AND THE HOLOCAUST!
 
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Lucidthots

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Binyamin said:
So it's disgusting and satanic when defending yourself? I'm sure if I came at you with a knife, you would defend yourself, how disgusting of you! how satanic! :roll:

No the Israelites INVADED CANAAN!

Have you not read the Torah?

NUMBERS

The created their army in the desert, sent scouts to Canaan and then invaded, crossing the Jordan river and began their genocidal mania.

It is the Canaanites who were defending their land.
 

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Lucidthots said:
HILLARIOUS! A JEW DEFENDING GENOCIDE; I AM GOING TO REMEBER THAT NEXT TIME THE JEWS START RANTING ABOUT HITLER, THE NAZIS AND THE HOLOCAUST!

I'm defending the people who you assert don't have the right to defend themselves.

I know this is going to be difficult for you, but let's try and knock some knowledge into you.

Yehoshua 11: 1-5
וַיְהִי, כִּשְׁמֹעַ יָבִין מֶלֶךְ-חָצוֹר; וַיִּשְׁלַח, אֶל-יוֹבָב מֶלֶךְ מָדוֹן, וְאֶל-מֶלֶךְ שִׁמְרוֹן, וְאֶל-מֶלֶךְ אַכְשָׁף

וְאֶל-הַמְּלָכִים אֲשֶׁר מִצְּפוֹן, בָּהָר וּבָעֲרָבָה נֶגֶב כִּנְרוֹת--וּבַשְּׁפֵלָה; וּבְנָפוֹת דּוֹר, מִיָּם

הַכְּנַעֲנִי מִמִּזְרָח וּמִיָּם, וְהָאֱמֹרִי וְהַחִתִּי וְהַפְּרִזִּי וְהַיְבוּסִי בָּהָר; וְהַחִוִּי תַּחַת חֶרְמוֹן, בְּאֶרֶץ הַמִּצְפָּה

וַיֵּצְאוּ הֵם, וְכָל-מַחֲנֵיהֶם עִמָּם--עַם-רָב, כַּחוֹל אֲשֶׁר עַל-שְׂפַת-הַיָּם לָרֹב; וְסוּס וָרֶכֶב, רַב-מְאֹד

וַיִּוָּעֲדוּ, כֹּל הַמְּלָכִים הָאֵלֶּה; וַיָּבֹאוּ וַיַּחֲנוּ יַחְדָּו, אֶל-מֵי מֵרוֹם, לְהִלָּחֵם, עִם-יִשְׂרָאֵל

1. And it was, when Jabin king of Hazor heard, he sent to Jobab king of Madon, and to the king of Shimron, to the king of Achshaph.
2. And to the kings that were on the north of the mountains, and of the plains south of Chinnaroth, and in the valley, and in the regions of Dor on the west.
3. (To) the Canaanite on the east and on the west, and (to) the Amorite, and the Hittite, and the Perizzite, and the Jebusite in the mountains, and (to) the Hivite under Hermon in the land of Mizpah.
4. And they went out, they and all their hosts with them, many people, as the sand that is upon the seashore in multitude, with many horses and chariots.
5. And all these kings met together, they came and camped together at the waters of Merom, to fight with Israel.

Okay, so THEY are attacking Israel and Israel is defending themselves, what's the problem? Are you really to ****ing retarded to read the passages before the one verse?

If I come at you with a gun with all my neighbors, and you kill EVERYSINGLE one of us, does that make you satanic? No, it means you're defending yourself. Stop being a moron.
 

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Lucidthots said:
No the Israelites INVADED CANAAN!

Have you not read the Torah?

NUMBERS

The created their army in the desert, sent scouts to Canaan and then invaded, crossing the Jordan river and began their genocidal mania.

It is the Canaanites who were defending their land.
Read my above post, you ****ing retard.
 

Lucidthots

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Binyamin said:
I'm defending the people who you assert don't have the right to defend themselves.


Okay, so THEY are attacking Israel and Israel is defending themselves, what's the problem? Are you really to ****ing retarded to read the passages before the one verse?

If I come at you with a gun with all my neighbors, and you kill EVERYSINGLE one of us, does that make you satanic? No, it means you're defending yourself. Stop being a moron.

Read NUMBERS!

THE ISRAELITES FORMED AN ARMY, THEN INVADED AND STARTED A GENOCIDAL WAR AGAINST INNOCENT PEOPLE.

What does that have to with religion?
 

Binyamin

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We're talking about Yehoshua right now, why do you keep referencing different aspects? Do you still think the people of Israel didn't have the right to defend themselves? Would you defend yourself?

Lucidthots said:
Read NUMBERS!

THE ISRAELITES FORMED AN ARMY, THEN INVADED AND STARTED A GENOCIDAL WAR AGAINST INNOCENT PEOPLE.

What does that have to with religion?
What part of Bamidbar are you having trouble with?

Again, stop posting in bold, it only shows your immaturity and lack of knowledge, by the way, I noticed you gave up on Yehoshua, nothing else to say on the subject of self-defense?

Oh wait... Didn't you say this... "No the Israelites INVADED CANAAN!"

If you want me to continually correct your mistakes, have some curtousy to be:
1) Respectful
2) Respectful
3) Respectful
4) Stop using large letters, I can read, it's you you can't read one verse before the one you quote.


Any reason you're not answering any of my questions?

4th time: Here's a question since you claim to be an expert, who gave us the oral law? When was it given to the Jews? When was the Torah given to the Jews? What's the Mishnah? What's the Gemora? What's the Midrash? What is a Kri? A ktiv?
 

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NUMBERS: 1 : 2

TAKE A CENSUS OF THE WHOLE ISRAELITE COMMUNITY......LISTING ALL THE NAMES OF THE MALES HEAD BY HEAD.

......ALL THOSE IN ISRAEL WHO ARE ABLE TO BEAR ARMS.



Interesting, they were in the middle of the desert, who were they "defending" themselves against?

Answer: they were not, rather they were putting together an invasion force to exterminate innocent people.

THIS IS PURE EVIL!
 
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Binyamin said:
So a translation is better then the original text?

I trust the JPS (I assume you know that it stands for the Jewish Publishing Society). My copy of the Tanakh has the hebrew and english translations.

Binyamin said:
The fact is Rashi, Ramban, and all sages commentary points that the meaning of this isn't "Divine beings" or angels. Elohim implies rulership.

Elohim is plural which means the text is speaking of more than one divine being. There is no real evidence of a trinity so deductive logic shows that it is speaking of both God and the angels.

Binyamin said:
This has not to do with just translating, but a lot to do with understanding the language. Kind of like when you guys ****ed up every translation Melachim II 8:10 in every book. Your translations are not perfect and you need to understand the Hebrew, which also means understanding what a Kri and Ktiv are when it comes to biblical study..

Hey, back off.. I am not your enemy here..theres no need to lash out at me. The Jewish Publication Society translated the text that way. I had nothing to do with how the bible is officially translated. I'm not a christian either. I am currently learning Hebrew but don't be so pretentious in your assertions..you do not know everything. Speak to your Rabbi and get back to me.


Binyamin said:
Where do you get the idea that angels can do more then one purpose? They have more then one function?

Angels serve multiple purposes. They are messengers, worshipers, and warriors of God. They have free will and this is proven by the rebellion of Satan.

Binyamin said:
From the Midrash, "One angel does not perform two missions."

I do not believe this passage to be true. Gabriel performed more than one mission.

Binyamin said:
Again, I don't believe the JPS to be anywhere close to being perfect. Nor is the NIV, NASB, or any other translation. If you want to learn the meaning of the Torah, learn hebrew, and I don't mean being able to go to a book and look up every word in the sentance.

The english translation is along side the hebrew in my Tanakh. I have run some of the translations by several professors of Hebrew at my university. They believe they are accurate.


Binyamin said:
It helps if you support your claims w/ passages.

Enoch for example and even Noah.
 

Lucidthots

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I think the point Ben, is that you can not invade and exterminate innocent men women and children.......and then claim that you had to kill everyone in self defense.

Capice?
 

Lucidthots

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Binyamin said:
If I come at you with a gun with all my neighbors, and you kill EVERYSINGLE one of us, does that make you satanic? No, it means you're defending yourself.

You know the NAZI's used this same logic against the Jews.

"The Rothschilds are oppressing us!"

"We must kill all the Jews of the world!"
 

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An intelligent reply. :2wave: Toda! (Thank you!)
Napoleon's Nightingale said:
I trust the JPS (I assume you know that it stands for the Jewish Publishing Society). My copy of the Tanakh has the hebrew and english translations.
I know what the JPS is, although I don't suggest reading the TaNaKh w/out reading the commentary from the sages which one book won't cover. I have a book thicker then the christian bible for every Hebrew book of canon filled with commentary I can acess when I need to.


Napoleon's Nightingale said:
Elohim is plural which means the text is speaking of more than one divine being. There is no real evidence of a trinity so deductive logic shows that it is speaking of both God and the angels.
Elohim is also plural in the verse I cited. I just wanted to bold that part, and look at it again, oh such great news :)



Napoleon's Nightingale said:
Hey, back off.. I am not your enemy here..theres no need to lash out at me.
Sorry if I get an attidue, part of it has to w/ me being an ESL another part has to do w/ posting rebuttal after rebuttal for the clown that started this thread which he completely ignores.

Napoleon's Nightingale said:
The Jewish Publication Society translated the text that way. I had nothing to do with how the bible is officially translated. I'm not a christian either.
Cool. :)

Napoleon's Nightingale said:
I am currently learning Hebrew but don't be so pretentious in your assertions..you do not know everything. Speak to your Rabbi and get back to me.
I don't think I need too speak w/ my rabbi on this particular issue...

But trust me, I'll be more then willing to just say, "I don't know...but I can find out" which I have done in tons of threads.

Napoleon's Nightingale said:
Angels serve multiple purposes. They are messengers, worshipers, and warriors of God. They have free will and this is proven by the rebellion of Satan.
The Jewish perspective is that he didn't rebel, so that would be a Christian perspective, which I reject. If for some reason you do think Jewish scripture indicates he rebelled and has several missions, I welcome scripture from the Torah, Mishnah, Gemora, Midrash, or just about any other Jewish source.

Napoleon's Nightingale said:
I do not believe this passage to be true. Gabriel performed more than one mission.
Such as...?

Napoleon's Nightingale said:
The english translation is along side the hebrew in my Tanakh. I have run some of the translations by several professors of Hebrew at my university. They believe they are accurate.
I have a English Chumash that I use if I'm too lazy to check the Hebrew. If it's a verse I believe to be questionable then i just go to the hebrew.


Napoleon's Nightingale said:
Enoch for example and even Noah.
I forgot what we were arguing and it only shows the last 10 replies, gimme a sec to look back to page 1 and I'll respond.
 

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Lucidthots said:
You know the NAZI's used this same logic against the Jews.

"The Rothschilds are oppressing us!"

"We must kill all the Jews of the world!"
The Rothschilds weren't standing there ready to attack. Your analogy is fale.
 
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Lucidthots said:
NUMBERS: 1 : 2

TAKE A CENSUS OF THE WHOLE ISRAELITE COMMUNITY......LISTING ALL THE NAMES OF THE MALES HEAD BY HEAD.

......ALL THOSE IN ISRAEL WHO ARE ABLE TO BEAR ARMS.


Interesting, they were in the middle of the desert, who were they "defending" themselves against?

Answer: they were not, rather they were putting together an invasion force to exterminate innocent people.

THIS IS PURE EVIL!


The point of taking the cencus was to organize the Israelites into clans and give the clans the means to defend themselves and the treasures they had. It had nothing to do with preparing an invasion army. The Israelites were, by definition, monadic at that point in time. The desert was a dangerous place..there were probably bandits roaming about not to mention an x number of hostile forces. They had a right to defend themselves.
 
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Lucidthots

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Binyamin said:
The Rothschilds weren't standing there ready to attack. Your analogy is fale.


The Israelites formed their Army in the desert, then invaded!

The Israelites were never a religion, they were always thugs and murderers.
 

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Napoleon's Nightingale said:
Enoch for example and even Noah.
If anything that proves my point.

וַיִּקְרָא אֶת-שְׁמוֹ נֹחַ, לֵאמֹר: זֶה יְנַחֲמֵנוּ מִמַּעֲשֵׂנוּ, וּמֵעִצְּבוֹן יָדֵינוּ, מִן-הָאֲדָמָה, אֲשֶׁר אֵרְרָהּ יְהוָה

Bereishis (Genesis)5:29

And he named him Noah, saying, "This one will give us rest from our work and from the toil of our hands from the ground, which the Lord has cursed."
 

Lucidthots

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Napoleon's Nightingale said:
The point of taking the cencus was to organize the Israelites into clans and give the clans the means to defend themselves and the treasures they had. It had nothing to do with preparing an invasion army. The Israelites were, by definition, monadic at that point in time. The desert was a dangerous place..there were probably bandits roaming about not to mention an x number of hostile forces. It wasn't evil..it was self-defense.

No, the Israelites were merely Mafia thugs, who murdered people and stole their property.

Buddha never had an army.

Mormons dont show up at your door with a gun and kill you and take your house.

Just the Israelites...how come?
 

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Lucidthots said:
No, the Israelites were merely Mafia thugs, who murdered people and stole their property.

Buddha never had an army.

Mormons dont show up at your door with a gun and kill you and take your house.

Just the Israelites...how come?
Have you flipped on a TV? Those wonderful Muslims blow themselves up daily in Israel. You know Jews have to put aside holy days to defend other Jews?

And I've had mormons appear at my door, two of them, a man a woman, they were shocked because I refused to shake hands with the woman, they didn't even bother sticking around after that.
 

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Binyamin said:
And I've had mormons appear at my door, two of them, a man a woman, they were shocked because I refused to shake hands with the woman, they didn't even bother sticking around after that.

But did the Mormons "come at you with a sword" like the Israelites did to the Canaanites?


How come Buddha did not kill anybody?
 

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Lucidthots said:
But did the Mormons "come at you with a sword" like the Israelites did to the Canaanites?
There is nothing wrong w/ arming yourself. Where did the Israelites in your opinion, go after someone unjustly? You keep saying they did, you've cited Yehoshua which you no longer even mention after I pointed out how stupid you were.


Lucidthots said:
How come Buddha did not kill anybody?
I don't know enough about Buddha to answer that question, nor am I interested in hearing from Buddha.
 

Lucidthots

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Binyamin said:
And I've had mormons appear at my door, two of them, a man a woman, they were shocked because I refused to shake hands with the woman, they didn't even bother sticking around after that.

Wow, that is rude.

Here in civilization we have this thing called "manners."
 

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Lucidthots said:
Wow, that is rude.

Here in civilization we have this thing called "manners."
It was bad-mannered for her to offer her hand to me.
 

Lucidthots

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Binyamin said:
There is nothing wrong w/ arming yourself. Where did the Israelites in your opinion, go after someone unjustly? You keep saying they did, you've cited Yehoshua which you no longer even mention after I pointed out how stupid you were.



I don't know enough about Buddha to answer that question, nor am I interested in hearing from Buddha.

Of course not......Buddha was not a murderous thug....why would you be interested?
 
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