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No Indictment in Chokehold Death [W:1903,2680]

Re: No Indictment in Chokehold Death

beefheart said:
Oh, but I am sure that you raised phony outrage about Michelle Obama and school lunches...and taxes on soda.

Because you really care about people's health don't you?
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You are absolutely ridiculous. Saying someone's health issues are caused by bad diet choices IS NOT an endorsement of Government Nanny State eating regulations. Mr. Gradener should be allowed to eat all the unhealthy crap he wants, but he also lived, and died with the consequences.

How would you feel if an inmate in a jail, awaiting trial who was diabetic and wasn't given insulin died because of that?

Deborah Braillard Lawsuit: Family Of Deceased Inmate Wins $3.25 Million From Sheriff Joe Arpaio's Department
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I think the court ruled correctly. Are you now going to try and equate the denial of insulin for several days with a 13 second choke hold? Please do, I haven't laughed enough today.
 
Re: No Indictment in Chokehold Death


Uh, "what you read" isn't even close to accurate.
 
Re: No Indictment in Chokehold Death

beefheart said:
It was uncalled for and negligent, and the officer should be charged accordingly.

Cops shouldn't have a different set of laws....that is not the kind of country we want to have....
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How would you have handled it? Be specific.

What different laws?
 
Re: No Indictment in Chokehold Death

Moot said:
But they're right.....the police are targeting the poor because they're the ones that can't afford to pay the luxury tax on cigarettes in NY...or the jay walking tax in Ferguson and end up becoming felons and dependent on the system.
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No, the police aren't targeting them. Big government New York is, if anyone.

Local store owners complained about Gardner, and the police responded. That's not targeting. That's serving the local businesses who Gardner was affecting by selling cigarettes illegally in competition with them.
 
Re: No Indictment in Chokehold Death


Depends on circumstances. In the case you described, likely wouldn't go over, and cop gets into trouble. This case though is very different. The guy knew he was being placed under arrest and that these guys were cops.
 
Re: NYPD officer in Eric Garner chokehold death not indicted by Staten Island grand j

Do you understand what paraphrase means? Obama's own words on numerous occasion implied what I stated.
 
Re: No Indictment in Chokehold Death

Tettsuo said:
Please show in what actions lead to the arrest. Or are you simply talking out of your ass.
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Have the threads been merged yet? What you're asking for is in the original thread on this topic. The video is only a small slice of what happened and doesn't show what got him arrested. He's been done 31 times previously for selling illegal merchandise (cigs). An undercover cop approached him for number 32 and he recognized him as a cop. He decided he had had enough of getting arrested and told them he was going to resist. The cops moved in and then the video begins.
 
Re: No Indictment in Chokehold Death

MaggieD said:
Next time don't quote the New York Times for information about the legality or illegality of detention by a police officer:

Here's the New York State statute:



Article 140 Criminal Procedure Law - Arrest Without Warrant
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So cops can touch you whenever they want and if you "resist" then that gives them precedence to arrest with force? According to the wording of that law a cop can come up to you and rub your face sensually. And if you physically flinch or move back he suddenly gets a free pass from the whole "arresting thing" and he can now assault you legally?
 
Re: NYPD officer in Eric Garner chokehold death not indicted by Staten Island grand j

vesper said:
Do you understand what paraphrase means? Obama's own words on numerous occasion implied what I stated.
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No, no they did not. You have given us nothing that supports your "paraphrasing."
 
Re: No Indictment in Chokehold Death

Kobie said:
Are you going to post anything even remotely germane to this specific incident?
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Do you answer people that post up to you.....is that to big of a ****in clue for ya?
 
Re: No Indictment in Chokehold Death

MMC said:
Do you answer people that post up to you.....is that to big of a ****in clue for ya?
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English, please.
 
Re: NYPD officer in Eric Garner chokehold death not indicted by Staten Island grand j

vesper said:
Do you understand what paraphrase means? Obama's own words on numerous occasion implied what I stated.
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... Yes, I understand what it means. However, by stating the facts that A) blacks are distrustful of police and B) this is due to factual discrepancies in sentencing (which go by race) is not paraphrasing: cops are there to harass black people. I'll give you one more shot to be honest what he said and post something even remotely consistent with what you claimed he alluded to.
 
Re: No Indictment in Chokehold Death


No. He would also have to justify his actions. Explain how you justify caressing a person and what that would have to do with an arrest. The cop would be in trouble, and rightfully subject to charges. It is all about the circumstances.
 
Re: No Indictment in Chokehold Death


Maybe Garner was accidently "Burked" by the police?

"Burking" was (and on rare occasions still is) a method used by English criminals to kill somebody, with out leaving any injuries on the victim's body. In addition, even experienced coroners have difficulty establishing the true cause of death- it often looks like a heart attack.

Basically, the persons air supply is cut off (choke hold) and then somebody else sits on his chest, and thus compresses it. Evidently, a person is poor physical condition like Garner does not need to be "Burked" very long to kill him.

As a side note, this casino heir (and heroin addict- short "Burking" time, no defensive marks from a long struggle) was murdered by the technique Articles about Ted Binion - Los Angeles Times It took the coroner along time to figure out what happened.
 
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Re: No Indictment in Chokehold Death

roguenuke said:
Depends on circumstances. In the case you described, likely wouldn't go over, and cop gets into trouble. This case though is very different. The guy knew he was being placed under arrest and that these guys were cops.
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Ummm... he knew was being placed under arrest when he wasn't informed of it? Why isn't it possible he defended himself from what he saw as an unlawful assault? Again, that's the glaring hole in your argument that cops don't have to inform people of their arrests.... What is to stop a civilian from considering a cop's approach as an incoming assault and defending themselves accordingly?
 
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Re: No Indictment in Chokehold Death


The video was kind of blurry, but Gardner never seemed to close his fists or take a swing in self defense the entire time, not even while he was being taken down or struggling for his last breath. He was a big man, why didn't he fight back? I can only think he might have been more afraid of getting shot full of holes than pummeled.

Something is amiss when %99.999(?) of all GJ cases get an indictment but the one that has video evidence clearly showing an illegal choke hold resulting in death and witnessed by millions doesn't??? Yes, it's very hard to believe.
 
Re: No Indictment in Chokehold Death

Kobie said:
English, please.
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Oh did you have trouble with that English.....please inform us with your lack of English education and your confusion as to which which English word or words caused the grey matter to harden and not act like a sponge.
 
Re: No Indictment in Chokehold Death


He wasn't pulled over for DUI, was he?:roll:

Would it be fair to say that it is your opinion those who fought in the American Revolutionary War were perfectly evil and should have been killed for "resisting?"
 
Re: No Indictment in Chokehold Death




Under the law it is called "taken as found". Any condition, disease, substances ingested are irrelevant.

In the end it is this: The police officer made physical contact and the man died. He would not have died, according to the coroner, has the officer not done what he did.

That in most areas is homicide, death at the hands of another person or persons.
 
Re: No Indictment in Chokehold Death


There's really no need to go there with all the imagined scenarios. That's not what happened here. He announced his intent to resist arrest before they even touched him. the 32cd time being arrested was just too much for him.
 
Re: No Indictment in Chokehold Death


His actions and words showed that he believed he was being placed under arrest, by the police, even if he didn't believe he should have been. There is no question there, no ambiguity or question about what is happening, especially during the actual resistance.
 
Re: No Indictment in Chokehold Death


You should repeat this excellent message now and then.
 
Re: No Indictment in Chokehold Death


Oh bulls***. First off, Gardener didn't die of shock. Second, anyone who would go in to fatal circulatory shock after a 2 second choke would likely not be standing on a street corner. The amount of cellular oxygen deprivation needed as a prerequisite to start a cascading lethal shock to the system after only 2 seconds of chocking would need to be so pervasive that the person would be non-functional even before the choking.
 
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