Net Zero fanaticism is dragging us back to the Dark Ages

[longview]

Net Zero fanaticism is dragging us back to the Dark Ages

We cannot, for example, just materialise thousands of functioning gigafactories for batteries tomorrow – let alone supply them with materials, staff them, and deploy the product on unprepared grids. Nor are there the necessary heat pumps in homes or the powertrains of unbuilt factories for electric transport.

I have said before, the current plans of conservation and battery electric cars, cannot change emissions enough to have much
of an impact. We have to address the why and how people use energy globally, and that will really only change,
because market conditions make a viable alternative, less expensive.

 

[Donatello]

Net Zero fanaticism is dragging us back to the Dark Ages

I have said before, the current plans of conservation and battery electric cars, cannot change emissions enough to have much
of an impact. We have to address the why and how people use energy globally, and that will really only change,
because market conditions make a viable alternative, less expensive.

Do you really believe that the scores of people in the Energy sector are NOT studying the "why and how people use energy"? Sounds pretty misleading.

 

[craig]

Net Zero fanaticism is dragging us back to the Dark Ages

I have said before, the current plans of conservation and battery electric cars, cannot change emissions enough to have much
of an impact. We have to address the why and how people use energy globally, and that will really only change,
because market conditions make a viable alternative, less expensive.

We already have natural gas to support the 30 year transition. The delivery infrastructure already exists to support local/regional peak generation.

 

[Paradoxical]

Net Zero fanaticism is dragging us back to the Dark Ages

I have said before, the current plans of conservation and battery electric cars, cannot change emissions enough to have much
of an impact. We have to address the why and how people use energy globally, and that will really only change,
because market conditions make a viable alternative, less expensive.

If you go back in time. the weather was hotter and the animals never gave it a care. Matter of fact, plants and animals flourished.

 

[craig]

If you go back in time. the weather was hotter and the animals never gave it a care. Matter of fact, plants and animals flourished.

That is why we have fossil fuels now.

 

[Paradoxical]

That is why we have fossil fuels now.

They didn't die because of the weather but because God knew we would need oil right now since he sees and knows all. Oil is God's gift to humanity.

What amuses and also distresses me is the clamor by the left for electrical cars and solar this and battery that and the claim by the government that it will be cheaper. I can assure you that when we start using more and more renewable energy, the cost of power will increase tenfold.

Why? They will tax it to death. Already, Kalifornia has a scheme to tax people per mile. They are imposing regulations on power plants which is where your electricity comes from. Electricity costs are already a killer in the People's Republik of Kalifornia. You all just wait. It will be way too late when you all wake up to the net cost per mile of driving a car of a dollar a mile and the cost for solar power electricity or "electric" power plants (which run on gas or coal now) are triple what you pay now.

 

[soylentgreen]

Net Zero fanaticism is dragging us back to the Dark Ages

I have said before, the current plans of conservation and battery electric cars, cannot change emissions enough to have much
of an impact. We have to address the why and how people use energy globally, and that will really only change,
because

You do understand that there is no silver bullet here? Pointing out that one example of the many changes needed to be made will not be sufficient by itself to make any real change, is simply ignoring the forest for the tree.

The part in bold. That's doublespeak for let's muddy the waters enough so that nothing gets done.

market conditions make a viable alternative, less expensive.

So here is a chicken and egg question for you. Which comes first? The need for a product or the production of a product.

It really is limited economic thinking to always use expense as a golden rule not to buy rather than as just one of the alternatives to be considered when making a purchase.

 

[longview]

We already have natural gas to support the 30 year transition. The delivery infrastructure already exists to support local/regional peak generation.

But peak does not include the extra load of charging millions of cars a day.
Remember that after Carnot losses each gallon of gasoline has about 6.6 kWh of energy, to replace millions of cars means to send that extra amount of energy through the grid.

 

[longview]

You do understand that there is no silver bullet here? Pointing out that one example of the many changes needed to be made will not be sufficient by itself to make any real change, is simply ignoring the forest for the tree.

The part in bold. That's doublespeak for let's muddy the waters enough so that nothing gets done.


So here is a chicken and egg question for you. Which comes first? The need for a product or the production of a product.

It really is limited economic thinking to always use expense as a golden rule not to buy rather than as just one of the alternatives to be considered when making a purchase.

I disagree about the silver bullet, and I think it will happen anyway because of market conditions.
We have several real problems, but all line up with storing surplus energy as hydrocarbon fuels.

 

[soylentgreen]

I disagree about the silver bullet, and I think it will happen anyway because of market conditions.
We have several real problems, but all line up with storing surplus energy as hydrocarbon fuels.

You disagree about the silver bullet because you do not think you were talking about a silver bullet. Or because you think electric cars is the silver bullet?

And countries that have the technology and ability to finance such research do so. But as the problem is getting people to change habits then countries will also have to focus on those many more than just several real problems.

 

[Paradoxical]

You disagree about the silver bullet because you do not think you were talking about a silver bullet. Or because you think electric cars is the silver bullet?

And countries that have the technology and ability to finance such research do so. But as the problem is getting people to change habits then countries will also have to focus on those many more than just several real problems.

If I am the ruler of Africa or some other impoverished nation, am I supposed to stay that way because some greenies demand that I not use oil?

This is precisely why this administration and Europe are globalists. They want everyone to do what they want. They are true totalitarians.

 

[craig]

If I am the ruler of Africa or some other impoverished nation, am I supposed to stay that way because some greenies demand that I not use oil?

This is precisely why this administration and Europe are globalists. They want everyone to do what they want. They are true totalitarians.

The United Democratic States of the World (UDSW) is not totalitarian.

 

[Paradoxical]

The United Democratic States of the World (UDSW) is not totalitarian.

Link?

 

[longview]

You disagree about the silver bullet because you do not think you were talking about a silver bullet. Or because you think electric cars is the silver bullet?

And countries that have the technology and ability to finance such research do so. But as the problem is getting people to change habits then countries will also have to focus on those many more than just several real problems.

Battery electric car will not solve our energy problems. The solution is to store the natural surplus that results from wind and solar power generation as carbon neutral transport fuels.
When the man made fuel are less expensive than the fuels made from oil, it will be difficult to stop people from buying them.

 

[craig]

Battery electric car will not solve our energy problems. The solution is to store the natural surplus that results from wind and solar power generation as carbon neutral transport fuels.
When the man made fuel are less expensive than the fuels made from oil, it will be difficult to stop people from buying them.

Yes. It is called natural gas.

 

[longview]

Yes. It is called natural gas.

Organic CH4 is not carbon neutral in the short term!

 

[Lord of Planar]

We already have natural gas to support the 30 year transition. The delivery infrastructure already exists to support local/regional peak generation.

But we need to upgrade the electrical grids nation wide to handle more power as well.

 

[craig]

But we need to upgrade the electrical grids nation wide to handle more power as well.

It is not clear that if new generation and storage are geographically distributed the capacity of the existing grid needs to increase.

 

[Deuce]

Net Zero fanaticism is dragging us back to the Dark Ages

I have said before, the current plans of conservation and battery electric cars, cannot change emissions enough to have much
of an impact. We have to address the why and how people use energy globally, and that will really only change,
because market conditions make a viable alternative, less expensive.

For the Dark Ages, your internet connection is pretty good.

 

[Deuce]

But we need to upgrade the electrical grids nation wide to handle more power as well.

Yes we should absolutely do that.

 

[longview]

It is not clear that if new generation and storage are geographically distributed the capacity of the existing grid needs to increase.

I think it is very clear that we cannot add the load of all the energy we get from hydrocarbons to the grid without some additional capacity.
England is already seeing it. Homes do not have the grid capability to run the now required heat pumps.

 

[PoS]

Net Zero fanaticism is dragging us back to the Dark Ages

I have said before, the current plans of conservation and battery electric cars, cannot change emissions enough to have much
of an impact. We have to address the why and how people use energy globally, and that will really only change,
because market conditions make a viable alternative, less expensive.

If the West keeps this up, all the brainiest people will leave, and the countries they emigrate to will pick up the slack.

 

[craig]

If the West keeps this up, all the brainiest people will leave, and the countries they emigrate to will pick up the slack.

The brainiest people are moving to which countries?

 

[soylentgreen]

If I am the ruler of Africa or some other impoverished nation, am I supposed to stay that way because some greenies demand that I not use oil?

This is precisely why this administration and Europe are globalists. They want everyone to do what they want. They are true totalitarians.

Yet the only one I see here who does nothing but harp on about co2 to the exclusion of everything else is a denier.

 

[soylentgreen]

Battery electric car will not solve our energy problems. The solution is to store the natural surplus that results from wind and solar power generation as carbon neutral transport fuels.
When the man made fuel are less expensive than the fuels made from oil, it will be difficult to stop people from buying them.

That's nice a simple solution for a simple problem. Now we can all sleep easy.