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Minuteman Project Saves Life

RightinNYC

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http://www.azstarnet.com/sn/border/68659.php

Wanted to see what you guys thought about this whole plan.

Basic Background: There's a group of people who are sick of the multitudes of illegal immigrants coming into the US from Mexico, and who think the Border Patrol is doing a horrible job. So they gathered up, and are patrolling sections of the border to observe and report on.

Proponents: Claim that this peaceful observance will bring attention to the fact that the government is doing an inadequate job of protecting our border. They are being non-violent, and only observing and reporting.

Opponents: Claim that they are just vigilantes, more likely to incite violence than cure any problems. Claim that they are getting in the way of the border patrol, and that once they started, they would likely cause significant problems with any illegals they met.

Well, it started a while ago, and what happened?


 
Aww. Ya beat me to it, I was thinking of starting a thread about the minutemen too. Here's the groundwork I had so far:
President Bush calls them vigilantes and the Mexican government has warned it will file civil suits against any who lays a finger on Mexican nationals during the exercise.

"We've been repeatedly accused of being people who are taking the law into our own hands," said Gilchrist, 56, of Aliso Viejo, Calif. "That is an outright bogus statement. We are going down there to assist law enforcement."
What Minuteman volunteers have succeeded in doing is setting off false alarms by tripping ground sensors on the border, he said.

"We're having to work around them instead of concentrating on the actual border where we need to work," Adame said.
Here's a link to the Minuteman Project as well. And some info that is pertinent like this statement:
The Minuteman Project has no affiliation with, nor will we accept any assistance by or interference from separatists, racists or supremacy groups or individuals, no matter what their race, color, or creed.
And
 

Yea, at first it seemed like it was a bad idea, but it's been working well so far.

That claim about the sensors seems like sour eggs to me by the border patrol.
 
RightatNYU said:
Yea, at first it seemed like it was a bad idea, but it's been working well so far.

That claim about the sensors seems like sour eggs to me by the border patrol.

Historically, Law Enforcement hates it when citizens get involved in their business. Oh they say they like these neighborhood watch programs. Often they assign an officer to be a liaison to the group. But trust me, I have some experience working with LE and they hate it citizens get involved with their work. They see it as a no win.

Personally if all these people are sneaking over our borders and the Gov. can’t do anything about it- why not let these citizens patrol?

 

In the UK I've never heard of these neighbourhood watches or viglantes. Is crime really that bad over there? Or you guys just paranoid?
 
GarzaUK said:
In the UK I've never heard of these neighbourhood watches or viglantes. Is crime really that bad over there? Or you guys just paranoid?


Neighborhood watches are just programs set up where parents get together and rotate shifts of making sure that there are no problems on the streets. It's useful in keeping things under control.

In this specific case, it's because we have a border with mexico that is thousands of miles long, and has minimal protection.
 

Exactly. It seems like a ******* contest to me. The border patrol wants to hide the fact that is is horribly ineffective, to the tune of 10 million illegals (and that only counts how many stayed).
 
I give these folks a double thumbs up.

Unfortunatly, I think it will wear out on the volunteers before anything is done.
 
We will follow illegal aliens from a distance and continue spotting them until authorities answer our cell phone and/or back-pack radio calls.

Mexican hunting, eh? I guess the novelty of the mourning-dove season has already worn off.

Seriously, I've next to no opinion on this issue. I just have to comment, though, that illegal immigrants do play a vital role in the American economy, not least up here in the Breadbasket/Midwest rural region. I wonder what long-term effects this Minuteman project will have on the sort of agricultural jobs that those illegal aliens tend to take, and how much of that will spread to affect the rest of the nation. Any thoughts?

(Note: I'm not condoning illegal immigration at all -- just saying that it exists and that they form a component of our economy.)

SE
 
This project will have minimal to no impact. Currently they have only stopped 5000 of the 100,000's that pass the border. They are only watching one area.

I agree that illegals have a role in our society. Unfortunatly, it has promoted laziness. May of the jobs that youngers should be doing are pushed off due to capitolism and simple manpower that the typical US citizen refuses to do.

Slowing or even stopping this would again help support all of our own folks. This would again create a bottum to top economy rather than just high end and poverty. When the demand goes up, so does the salary.

It's interesting to note that the same folks that complain about our economy and jobs are the same folks that many times believe in open borders and/or refuse to do anything about this very important issue.
 
I personally would like to see these volunteers stop their job and return home, but only when our current Administration pays attention to the facts that our boarder patrol is downright terrible.

A good group of boarder patrols are far more reliable than volunteers who have done this because they are fed up with these immigrants.

True that these people do play a big role in our economy but my area (North Carolina, Research Triangle Park) is becoming over-run by Mexicans. We've had to spend money till the point where our county is in the negatives, on building more schools, hiring more Spanish-English teachers, and other unneeded things.

I find it disrespectful for a person to illegally cross a border, ignore registration and all the other legal processes for one to become an American citizen.

In their defense, it is fact that illegal aliens are more consistent on their taxes then that of the naturally born citizens, this is due to the idea that if they pay their taxes then will be able to blend in. So our government knows that these illegal aliens are recorded for (because of tax payments) but they do nothing.. I still ponder whether it is better to have alot more people with more tax revenue, then to have higher costing taxes but fewer illegal immigrants.
 
Arch Enemy said:
A good group of boarder patrols are far more reliable than volunteers who have done this because they are fed up with these immigrants.

The whole point of the excursion isn't to catch people, its to raise attention about the problem.

Even so, a group of dedicated citizens acting within their legal rights is almost always more effective than a group of gov't employees who don't really work to fix the problem.
 
So what's your solution? Raise taxes to have more employees on the border? Or have, as President Bush has called them, vigilantes patrolling the border?
 
RightatNYU said:
Yea, at first it seemed like it was a bad idea, but it's been working well so far.

That claim about the sensors seems like sour eggs to me by the border patrol.
Explain? All that is happening is that the illegals are moving down the road and entering somewhere else.

Scary as it is, I agree with President Bush! :doh
 
shuamort said:
So what's your solution? Raise taxes to have more employees on the border? Or have, as President Bush has called them, vigilantes patrolling the border?

How about we start enforcing our own country's laws and prosecute and deport the illegals we find even now?

That might send a message.
 
26 X World Champs said:
Explain? All that is happening is that the illegals are moving down the road and entering somewhere else.

Scary as it is, I agree with President Bush! :doh

You and I are talking about immigration policy, aren't we? It seems to me like they're accomplishing what they're trying to do.
 
RightatNYU said:
How about we start enforcing our own country's laws and prosecute and deport the illegals we find even now?

That might send a message.
Yeah, there does seem to be a lot of look-the-other-way-ism going down there. And President Bush's amnesty offering only sweetened the pot to keep the traffic up.

Back to the MinuteMen, I've got a feeling that they're not taking this very seriously:
:roll:
 
26 X World Champs said:
Explain? All that is happening is that the illegals are moving down the road and entering somewhere else.

Scary as it is, I agree with President Bush! :doh

You agree with with President Bush on Something? I thought all liberals were unable to look at what he does logically and asses it on a per policy, per incident basis? I thought no matter what he did, liberals would by agaisnt it. Has your brain been taken over be Area 51 aliens?
 
Last edited:
Check this out Parcridge.
I disagree with Bush. Maybe the only time.

Bush, however, did not the minutemen were vigilantees. He just said that he didn't want vigilantees patroling our borders. But everyone assumes that he was talking about the minutemen. Which he probably was. I just wanted to clear that up.

I have heard that the border patrol was happy to get some help. It is not that they are lazy, just that it is such a big job for so few people. There is nothing wrong with a group of people trying to help the gov't.
 
Bush Decries "Vigilantes," For Reasonable Immigration Policy(W Calls Minutemen "Vigilantes")

Here's more from Whitehouse.gov:

 
shuamort said:
Update on this:

 
Illegal immigration is out of control in this country. These illegals have overwhelmed certain areas and are causing them to have to build more schools, they are closing down hospitals because they don't pay for their healthcare, bringing 3rd world diseases that have long since been erradicated here, they are raising health insurance and other costs for us, they are taking jobs from people and driving down all our wages, they are eating off social welfare benefits, they are refusing to assimilate into our culture and 1st world lifestyle and some are resistent to even learning English. I sympathize with these people that they are poor, but that doesn't give them the right to illegally enter a country and parasite off its citizens for benefits. We are importing poverty and ignorance which is never good. We have 14-18 million Americans without jobs, the illegals are not needed. It is just the greed of employers hiring them for lower wages. We have our government outsourcing our jobs overseas and at the same time allowing these illegals to enter the country and take our jobs at home. It's not right to American citizens. It's time to stop subsidizing Mexico's poverty and tell them to get their own matters straightened. We need more border security now, to protect us not only from illegals but terrorists. Congress passed a bill for the creation of 2,000 new border patrol agents for the next 5 years that was recommended in the 9/11 Security report. President Bush signed it but refused to fund it. He funded only 210 more agents, which is woefully short of what we need. Just talk to citizens on the border who are vandalized by these illegals on a regular basis. We could be doing more to protect the border and its high time it gets done. God bless these Minutemen for bringing attention to the issue. Hopefully they will raise public awareness to the point where our government has to do something about this. A nation can not thrive without protecting its borders. It can't thrive with an open borders policy. You need orderly immigration.
 
Doesn't matter if Bush likes them being there or not. The citizens of the United States have a constitutional right under the second amendment to form a militia. The minuteman project is a militia being used to raise awareness of the problem on the border.
 
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