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Medicare For All is fasted way to fix healthcare.

markjs said:
Yes, You CONSTANTLY run from debates .
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if so why are you afraid to show us one I ran from? What did we learn from your liberal fear?
 
markjs said:
Oh my, reported for failing to indulge your fantasy rhetoric and nonsense, wow you think a lot of yourself don't you?:lamo
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embarrassing! totally substance free liberal
 
vesper said:
That seems the be the latest talking point from the leftist. They talk about it all the time. Problem is when you ask them how they are planning on paying for it they don't want to talk about that.
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Payment should NOT be an issue at all. After all, the middle men, the Insurance Industry, is eliminated. It's only logical, if funded correctly, there will be massive savings.
 
Media_Truth said:
Payment should NOT be an issue at all. After all, the middle men, the Insurance Industry, is eliminated. It's only logical, if funded correctly, there will be massive savings.
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All industries have middle men by necessity. They are not the problem at all. Does the silly liberal want to make insurance illegal? The problem is liberals made competition between health insurance companies illegal. That causes prices to be sky high. This is something a child can understand?

That said, we should just copy the Canadian system and enjoy a 65% drop in health care costs. From there we can easily switch it to capitalism with published prices and higher copays
 
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James972 said:
All industries have middle men by necessity. They are not the problem at all. Does the silly liberal want to make insurance illegal? The problem is liberals made competition between health insurance companies illegal. That causes prices to be sky high. This is something a child can understand?

That said, we should just copy the Canadian system and enjoy a 65% drop in health care costs. From there we can easily switch it to capitalism with published prices and higher copays
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NO - "All" industries do not have middle men - at least not middle men who offer no services, like insurance brokers. I have no dental insurance - I go directly to my dentist, and pay for services. I can go to a Farmer's Market and pay the farmer directly for his product.

Countries with Single Payer have much lower health care costs than the US. If people want to retain health insurance they can. That would be their choice. But it wouldn't be necessary for most folks, and that savings can be incorporated into the cost of the system. Your negativity is unwarranted.
 
James972 said:
Health care for all (Medicare for all) would be cheaper and better. It would replace the convoluted socialist system we have now with a simple more efficient socialist system. Then we could require published prices and higher copays until we had capitalistic price and quality controls.
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Cheaper for whom? The majority of Americans are covered through employment, as such if the burden is switched from employers to the taxpayer then for the majority of Americans they will be now responsible for the entirety of their healthcare which will assuredly be more expensive (for them) further hurting middle class workers. If you want European and Canadian styles social services then you will have to pay that level of taxes as there is no such thing as a free lunch.
 
James972 said:
All industries have middle men by necessity. They are not the problem at all. Does the silly liberal want to make insurance illegal? The problem is liberals made competition between health insurance companies illegal. That causes prices to be sky high. This is something a child can understand?

That said, we should just copy the Canadian system and enjoy a 65% drop in health care costs. From there we can easily switch it to capitalism with published prices and higher copays
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The Canadian system is done at the provincial level, there isn't anything I know of preventing states from doing so right now. California for instance has a larger economy than the entire country of Canada, they are more than capable of implementing that system tomorrow.
 
Media_Truth said:
Payment should NOT be an issue at all. After all, the middle men, the Insurance Industry, is eliminated. It's only logical, if funded correctly, there will be massive savings.
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You don't mean the middle man is removed, they are replaced. Replaced by a system that removes competition for better services in favor of a system the provide lesser services so they can meet the new payment system. Why bother to be good, you won't make more. Better to be cheaper and know you will get paid the same, no matter how poor the service.
 
James972 said:
in OP
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It isn't. Just saying we should switch doesn't address how to do it, and given something of this scope you need some kind of idea on what the steps are to get you there. Nap pointed out one of the immediate concerns regarding employers provided coverage and how placing the burden on tax payers affects them economically.
 
vesper said:
That seems the be the latest talking point from the leftist. They talk about it all the time. Problem is when you ask them how they are planning on paying for it they don't want to talk about that.
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It's easy, actually... Stop trying to take over the world, cut back your military significantly, and you'll have oodles of money. Worked for Canada... :)
 
ElChupacabra said:
Holy cow! We actually agree on something! Oh frabjous day Calloo! Callay!


Now the question is how it's paid for, and that's where it gets trickier. Controlling cost will be a critical component.
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Controlling cost will involve actually standing up to your health industry, and stop the gouging. Get your medication costs under control. Get your doctor salaries under control. Subsidize malpractice insurance, but put people that have to use it go through the ringer, instead of protecting the old boys club. Stop making people's health be the subject of market speculation, and prioritize it over the profits it drives.

Many many other countries have figured it out. You're the richest, most powerful country in the world, I'm sure you can too...
 
OlNate said:
Controlling cost will involve actually standing up to your health industry, and stop the gouging. Get your medication costs under control. Get your doctor salaries under control. Subsidize malpractice insurance, but put people that have to use it go through the ringer, instead of protecting the old boys club. Stop making people's health be the subject of market speculation, and prioritize it over the profits it drives.

Many many other countries have figured it out. You're the richest, most powerful country in the world, I'm sure you can too...
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It would be a sea change, and with the will to do it I'm sure it can be accomplished. Right off the bat though, you have to deal with the ideological aspect of it since some people don't think they should work collectively for the benefit of all and prefer each person be responsible for themselves. I think that alone will be the biggest hurdle.
 
James972 said:
Eon 101! with capitalism wherein there is price competition. Do you understand?
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Why rely on "price competition" when government can simply dictate? Capitalism can work well in many sectors, but it has been proven detrimental in the health sector. Why trust your health to people who's only priority is to make money? I'd rather trust people who's priority is my health...
 
ElChupacabra said:
It would be a sea change, and with the will to do it I'm sure it can be accomplished. Right off the bat though, you have to deal with the ideological aspect of it since some people don't think they should work collectively for the benefit of all and prefer each person be responsible for themselves. I think that alone will be the biggest hurdle.
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You know...all of you "Lefties" (lol) should just move to another country for a generation or two, take your generosity and care for mankind somewhere else, and see how many of these "Me First / Me Only" folks are left standing. No doubt you'd come back to a nastier place, but one that has well begun the process of cleaning itself up...if by population count alone. Despite the fact that they have no helping hands to offer, they have no problems standing on your shoulders. Come on up here for a couple generations...the beer's better, the pot is legal, and the hospitals are free... ;)
 
vesper said:
That seems the be the latest talking point from the leftist. They talk about it all the time. Problem is when you ask them how they are planning on paying for it they don't want to talk about that.
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Oh they talk about it, some on the rabid right just don't want to listen.... :roll:

BigPharma and CorproMedicine don't want to hear it... massive profits are at stake....

BigInsurance can't stand the thought- it strikes at the heart of their industry...

But talked about it is.... :peace
 
James972 said:
Health care for all (Medicare for all) would be cheaper and better. It would replace the convoluted socialist system we have now with a simple more efficient socialist system. Then we could require published prices and higher copays until we had capitalistic price and quality controls.
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Soooooo... the fastest way to "fix" healthcare is to fire, layoff or slash the salaries of most people currently working in the medical industry? Yeah, ok. :roll:

Socialism is just institutionalized vulture capitalism.
 
James972 said:
Health care for all (Medicare for all) would be cheaper and better. It would replace the convoluted socialist system we have now with a simple more efficient socialist system. Then we could require published prices and higher copays until we had capitalistic price and quality controls.
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James972 aka EdwardBaiamonte,
Supposn said:
Obamacare (which is also Romneycare), is free enterprise.

EdwardBaiamonte, Medical insurance costs have to reflect Medical procedures and goods costs and prices for medical procedures and products. Medical care is not a product that people can generally shop for as they would shop for a car or washing machine.

USA Medical insurance would be less expensive if we had single (federal) payer basic medical insurance as an entitlement similar to Medicare. Basic Medicare can, and often is augmented by individuals' commercial insurance policies.

Medicare was created because commercial entities didn't and I suppose couldn't properly service our elderly population.

Respectfully, Supposn
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OlNate said:
It's easy, actually... Stop trying to take over the world, cut back your military significantly, and you'll have oodles of money. Worked for Canada... :)
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The United States isn't Canada... Nor should it be...
 
notquiteright said:
Oh they talk about it, some on the rabid right just don't want to listen.... :roll:

BigPharma and CorproMedicine don't want to hear it... massive profits are at stake....
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What? You mean people who make a living creating life saving drugs want a reason to keep making life saving drugs?

You don't say...
 
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