Media ignoring cynical Hamas tactics! [W:16, W:28]

[The German]

Israel has during the recent military campain adopted the messure of warning residents of an erea that there is a bombardment coming, but Hamas is deliberatly telling those people to remain in these ereas and ignore the warnings by the IDF.

Adding to that, everyone knows that Hamas is deliberatly setting up it`s rocket launching sites and tunnels in densly populated civilian residential ereas.


I have seen reports on the recent conflict by CNN, BBC, Reuters, AP, Der Spiegel and others, but only the British Channel 4 news have so far even botherd to mention these facts within their reports!

Why is the rest of the media ignoring these important facts!

 

[CalGun]

It's more popular to hate on Israel. It sales more advertising.

Israel has during the recent military campain adopted the messure of warning residents of an erea that there is a bombardment coming, but Hamas is deliberatly telling those people to remain in these ereas and ignore the warnings by the IDF.

Adding to that, everyone knows that Hamas is deliberatly setting up it`s rocket launching sites and tunnels in densly populated civilian residential ereas.


I have seen reports on the recent conflict by CNN, BBC, Reuters, AP, Der Spiegel and others, but only the British Channel 4 news have so far even botherd to mention these facts within their reports!

Why is the rest of the media ignoring these important facts!

 

[PeteEU]

Israel has during the recent military campain adopted the messure of warning residents of an erea that there is a bombardment coming, but Hamas is deliberatly telling those people to remain in these ereas and ignore the warnings by the IDF.

Adding to that, everyone knows that Hamas is deliberatly setting up it`s rocket launching sites and tunnels in densly populated civilian residential ereas.


I have seen reports on the recent conflict by CNN, BBC, Reuters, AP, Der Spiegel and others, but only the British Channel 4 news have so far even botherd to mention these facts within their reports!

Why is the rest of the media ignoring these important facts!

Depends on what you mean by "facts". For example, where have you heard that Hamas is telling people to stay put? Now I googled it, and I found the usual right wing pro Israeli sites, and a ton of Israeli sites claiming this. This claim is coming from the IDF. Now I would not be surprised that Hamas would so something like this, however that the only source is the IDF then I will file this under more propaganda rather than fact.

Plus lets put this into perspective. Gaza is one of the most densely populated places on earth. As far as I can find out, from ITV News is, we are talking about the city/area of Shuja'iyya in Gaza city. The IDF warned "days ago" that they would attack.. fine. However there are estimated to be 100k people in that area. You can not and do not evacuate 100k people in days, and where exactly do you put 100k people?

Israel claims Hamas 'told civilians to stay in Shejaia' - ITV News

Now if I was a battlefield commander of an overwhelming force, then I would also warn the residents of the area I was going to attack. Why? Because it would cause panic and total chaos in the enemies lines. Not only would the enemy have to deal with an upcoming attack, but they would also have to deal with 10s of thousands of fleeing civilians and the chaos that causes. So if I were the defending commander, then I too would try to prevent the chaos as much as possible and set up defenses against the attacking force.

No there is far more to this story that is for sure and we all are being played or at least attempted to be played.

 

[Sababa]

Depends on what you mean by "facts". For example, where have you heard that Hamas is telling people to stay put? Now I googled it, and I found the usual right wing pro Israeli sites, and a ton of Israeli sites claiming this. This claim is coming from the IDF. Now I would not be surprised that Hamas would so something like this, however that the only source is the IDF then I will file this under more propaganda rather than fact.

So you think all Jews are lying? BBC News - Gaza-Israel: Hamas using 'human shields' - Netanyahu BBC is no friend of Israel. So if you have evidence that they are lying........please show it. The world would love to see it.

Plus lets put this into perspective. Gaza is one of the most densely populated places on earth. As far as I can find out, from ITV News is, we are talking about the city/area of Shuja'iyya in Gaza city. The IDF warned "days ago" that they would attack.. fine. However there are estimated to be 100k people in that area. You can not and do not evacuate 100k people in days, and where exactly do you put 100k people?

They fit more than that in a football stadium in Ann Arbor Michigan about 7 Sundays a year. It is not hard to move them away from the rocket launchers.......or are you suggesting the launchers are in people's homes? Hmmmmmmm


Israel claims Hamas 'told civilians to stay in Shejaia' - ITV News

Now if I was a battlefield commander of an overwhelming force, then I would also warn the residents of the area I was going to attack. Why? Because it would cause panic and total chaos in the enemies lines. Not only would the enemy have to deal with an upcoming attack, but they would also have to deal with 10s of thousands of fleeing civilians and the chaos that causes. So if I were the defending commander, then I too would try to prevent the chaos as much as possible and set up defenses against the attacking force.

So now you are saying they told them not to leave to be human shields........as a tactic?

No there is far more to this story that is for sure and we all are being played or at least attempted to be played.

No just more apologizing for terrorists who hate Jews more than they love their own people.

 

[Sababa]

Depends on what you mean by "facts". For example, where have you heard that Hamas is telling people to stay put? Now I googled it, and I found the usual right wing pro Israeli sites, and a ton of Israeli sites claiming this. This claim is coming from the IDF. Now I would not be surprised that Hamas would so something like this, however that the only source is the IDF then I will file this under more propaganda rather than fact.

So you think all Jews are lying? BBC News - Gaza-Israel: Hamas using 'human shields' - Netanyahu BBC is no friend of Israel. So if you have evidence that they are lying........please show it. The world would love to see it.

Plus lets put this into perspective. Gaza is one of the most densely populated places on earth. As far as I can find out, from ITV News is, we are talking about the city/area of Shuja'iyya in Gaza city. The IDF warned "days ago" that they would attack.. fine. However there are estimated to be 100k people in that area. You can not and do not evacuate 100k people in days, and where exactly do you put 100k people?

They fit more than that in a football stadium in Ann Arbor Michigan about 7 Sundays a year. It is not hard to move them away from the rocket launchers.......or are you suggesting the launchers are in people's homes? Hmmmmmmm


Israel claims Hamas 'told civilians to stay in Shejaia' - ITV News

Now if I was a battlefield commander of an overwhelming force, then I would also warn the residents of the area I was going to attack. Why? Because it would cause panic and total chaos in the enemies lines. Not only would the enemy have to deal with an upcoming attack, but they would also have to deal with 10s of thousands of fleeing civilians and the chaos that causes. So if I were the defending commander, then I too would try to prevent the chaos as much as possible and set up defenses against the attacking force.

So now you are saying they told them not to leave to be human shields........as a tactic?

No there is far more to this story that is for sure and we all are being played or at least attempted to be played.

No just more apologizing for terrorists who hate Jews more than they love their own people.

 

[PeteEU]

So you think all Jews are lying? BBC News - Gaza-Israel: Hamas using 'human shields' - Netanyahu BBC is no friend of Israel. So if you have evidence that they are lying........please show it. The world would love to see it.

Where did I say "all jews" were lying? And why the hell bring religion into this debate? I have consistently said I do not trust the IDF who have a history of lying.

They fit more than that in a football stadium in Ann Arbor Michigan about 7 Sundays a year. It is not hard to move them away from the rocket launchers.......or are you suggesting the launchers are in people's homes? Hmmmmmmm

Horse**** from start to finish. First off those going to a stadium want to go there, have planed and know where to go. There is a hell of a difference in moving 100k people from their homes, women, children, elderly to some where else.. when there is no room elsewhere... and doing that under the constant threat of Israeli strikes.

So now you are saying they told them not to leave to be human shields........as a tactic?

If they said it in the first place, then yes it is a clear military tactic. Not only does it up the "pity count", but it also keeps their logistics lines clear so they can move around without having to get boxed in by fleeing civilians.. which is what they did when they ambushed it seems IDF troops killing 13.

On the flip side, the IDF is using the same tactic.. not to save lives, because we have seen time and time again the IDF does not care about Palestinian lives, but to create enough chaos behind the Hamas lines to limit the Hams fighters movement and tactical advantage.

No just more apologizing for terrorists who hate Jews more than they love their own people.

You mean people who have lived under the jack boot of the Israeli state for 40 years? And again, why bring "Jews" into this.. playing the anti-Semitic card again? When will the holocaust card be played?

BTW your internet connection made a double post for some reason.

 

[Gardener]

Where did I say "all jews" were lying? And why the hell bring religion into this debate? .

He didn't. Jewish people are Jewish by ethnicity, as has been pointed out to you and others time and time again.

 

[Gardener]

Why is the rest of the media ignoring these important facts!

The European media is more biased than the American in this regard, but the selection and/or withholding of facts is perpetrated so as to further the agendas of those in the media. In this case, the agenda is obviously against the Jewish state.

My own theory has to do with the fallacy of the appeal to popularity. There are so precious few pro-Jewish voices in Europe compared to the anti-Jewish, and the influx of especially hateful people in recent years has tipped the balance against them, so much so that the very act of defending Jewish people against the onslaught has become so politically incorrect as to represent a phobia.

When everybody is congratulating the Emperor on his clothing, who is willing to stand up and say he is naked?

 

[shavingcollywob]

Plus lets put this into perspective. Gaza is one of the most densely populated places on earth. As far as I can find out, from ITV News is, we are talking about the city/area of Shuja'iyya in Gaza city. The IDF warned "days ago" that they would attack.. fine. However there are estimated to be 100k people in that area. You can not and do not evacuate 100k people in days, and where exactly do you put 100k people?

I don't want innocent people to die but is Israel really supposed to just accept getting bombed because the city is so densely packed that any retaliation on their part will kill innocent people? It sucks that innocents are dying but that's really the fault of Gaza, not Israel.

 

[PeteEU]

He didn't. Jewish people are Jewish by ethnicity, as has been pointed out to you and others time and time again.

Jewish people are jewish based on religion, just as Christians are Christians because of religion. To claim anything else in the 21st century is like claiming there is a master race... totally idiotic.

 

[PeteEU]

I don't want innocent people to die but is Israel really supposed to just accept getting bombed because the city is so densely packed that any retaliation on their part will kill innocent people? It sucks that innocents are dying but that's really the fault of Gaza, not Israel.

Hell no they should not accept it. They should demand that their politicians solve this problem permanently and there is only ONE way to do that without resorting to genocide. That is peace talks with everything on the table, stopping the settlements, stopping the oppression in the west bank and stopping the blockade of Gaza in exchange for stopping the violence by the Palestinians.

Sadly everyone knows, that there are people on both sides that will do anything to prevent these talks. Radicals have killed an Israeli PM because of it, and every time there seems to be a breakthrough then there is an attack of some sort by both sides. A few radical settlers or radical Palestinian's have time and time again ruined any talks. And if the radicals dont do it, then the Israeli government will by continuing the freaking settlements.

Both sides are at fault for this conflict.

 

[Gardener]

Jewish people are jewish based on religion, just as Christians are Christians because of religion. To claim anything else in the 21st century is like claiming there is a master race... totally idiotic.

I find it odd how you protest so if somebody mentions antisemitism, yet resort to the sort of speech denying people's ethnic identity that only antisemites indulge in.

If there is anything idiotic here, it would be the connotastion that something so simple as acknowleding as person's ethnicy implied a "master race".

 

[Sababa]

Where did I say "all jews" were lying? And why the hell bring religion into this debate? I have consistently said I do not trust the IDF who have a history of lying.
.

Where did I bring religion in?

Horse**** from start to finish. First off those going to a stadium want to go there, have planed and know where to go. There is a hell of a difference in moving 100k people from their homes, women, children, elderly to some where else.. when there is no room elsewhere... and doing that under the constant threat of Israeli strikes.

So you are suggesting that 100K people cannot leave a war zone? Really? I think you need to learn about the exact amount of space they would take up. Maybe many can stay at one of the many resorts on the coast........

If they said it in the first place, then yes it is a clear military tactic. Not only does it up the "pity count", but it also keeps their logistics lines clear so they can move around without having to get boxed in by fleeing civilians.. which is what they did when they ambushed it seems IDF troops killing 13.

that sentence makes no sense. Israel has a long history of warning civilians to flee areas they want to attack to take out weapons. Hamas has a long history of using their people as human shields.

On the flip side, the IDF is using the same tactic.. not to save lives, because we have seen time and time again the IDF does not care about Palestinian lives, but to create enough chaos behind the Hamas lines to limit the Hams fighters movement and tactical advantage.

First that is bull****. The IDF goes out of its way to save civilian lives, in fact during Cast Lead many Gazians were treated in...............wait for it...................Israeli hospitals. They also allow tons of humanitarian aid to flow into Gaza every single day even as rockets get fired into Israel. So spare me your ignorant nonsense............

You mean people who have lived under the jack boot of the Israeli state for 40 years? And again, why bring "Jews" into this.. playing the anti-Semitic card again? When will the holocaust card be played?

Ummmmmm the people fighting the terror organization you love are Jews...culturally as well as religiously.........You are the one who can't see that. I am not playing the anti-Semitic card....you are lying about Jews.

BTW your internet connection made a double post for some reason

Well yes and I tried to delete it........maybe it was an Israeli plot

 

[Sababa]

Jewish people are jewish based on religion, just as Christians are Christians because of religion. To claim anything else in the 21st century is like claiming there is a master race... totally idiotic.

no that is a stupid ****ing position and you frankly appear to be too full of hate or ignorance to have a valid opinion on the topic.

 

[Sababa]

Hell no they should not accept it. They should demand that their politicians solve this problem permanently and there is only ONE way to do that without resorting to genocide.

Your ignorance continues.......genocide????????????????????? Please.

That is peace talks with everything on the table, stopping the settlements, stopping the oppression in the west bank and stopping the blockade of Gaza in exchange for stopping the violence by the Palestinians.

Wow you understand Israel fully withdrew from Gaza and then rockets started falling, no one in the world community paid attention. The blockade (which by the way is also done by Egypt and supported by many in the world community) was only in place after a terror organization seized power in Gaza, (in part by killing the opposition). But you realize that amid the blockade Gaza manages to build resorts and continue to build rockets. Funny the people are suffering, the wealthy Islamists have a place to lay on the beach and they have people who continue to fire rockets and it is Israel's fault?

Sadly everyone knows, that there are people on both sides that will do anything to prevent these talks. Radicals have killed an Israeli PM because of it, and every time there seems to be a breakthrough then there is an attack of some sort by both sides. A few radical settlers or radical Palestinian's have time and time again ruined any talks. And if the radicals dont do it, then the Israeli government will by continuing the freaking settlements.

The settlements are not the issue. In a two state solution they will be under PA control.

Both sides are at fault for this conflict.

sure but you support the terrorists.

 

[digsbe]

Moderator's Warning:

Thread moved to the Middle East Forum. Please note form this point on that the Middle East Forum Marial Law will now apply: http://www.debatepolitics.com/middle-east/99774-me-forum-martial-law-concordance.html

 

[PeteEU]

Your ignorance continues.......genocide????????????????????? Please.

Learn to read.

Wow you understand Israel fully withdrew from Gaza and then rockets started falling, no one in the world community paid attention. The blockade (which by the way is also done by Egypt and supported by many in the world community) was only in place after a terror organization seized power in Gaza, (in part by killing the opposition). But you realize that amid the blockade Gaza manages to build resorts and continue to build rockets. Funny the people are suffering, the wealthy Islamists have a place to lay on the beach and they have people who continue to fire rockets and it is Israel's fault?

The blockade by Israel was in place before Hamas took over. It has gotten worse since of course.

The settlements are not the issue. In a two state solution they will be under PA control.

Then your dear leader disagrees with you..

sure but you support the terrorists.

No I dont. I dont support anyone in this conflict.

 

[PeteEU]

I find it odd how you protest so if somebody mentions antisemitism, yet resort to the sort of speech denying people's ethnic identity that only antisemites indulge in.

Because it is a religious identity, not an ethnic. At best it is an "ethnic-religious" group and even that is stretching it these days.

If there is anything idiotic here, it would be the connotastion that something so simple as acknowleding as person's ethnicy implied a "master race".

No there are plenty of real ethnicity´s around the world. Jews, Muslims, Christians and other religious groups cant claim that anymore since their gene pool, location, skin color, language and so on has been diluted over the centuries with external influences. There are black jews, white jews and asian jews. They might have some genes in common, but there are also plenty of people who have those same genes in common because at one time or another in their families past, they mated with someone who had that gene.. considering my family has links to Poland in the 1700-1800s then I could have the genes that some claim proves "Jewish ethnicity". It is bullcrap nationalism that is similar to the master race claims.

 

[ido_]

Depends on what you mean by "facts". For example, where have you heard that Hamas is telling people to stay put? Now I googled it, and I found the usual right wing pro Israeli sites, and a ton of Israeli sites claiming this. This claim is coming from the IDF. Now I would not be surprised that Hamas would so something like this, however that the only source is the IDF then I will file this under more propaganda rather than fact.

Hamas spokesman said it on their own TV :shock:

 

[CJ 2.0]

It is bullcrap nationalism that is similar to the master race claims.

Pete, without a question this sort of post demonstrates your ignorance (sorry, but that's what it is) about Jews, Jewish identity, Jewish history and Jewish culture. There is no more that can be said about it but I would encourage you to suspend your judgments (which are beyond wrong) and read more. I would start with one of those comprehensive "History of the Jewish People" books that focuses primarily on the time from the destruction of the second temple to the early 20th century.

 

[donsutherland1]

From The Jerusalem Post:

As Israeli security forces thwarted the latest attempt by terrorists to infiltrate Israel via tunnels from Gaza on Monday, The Jerusalem Post has learned that Israel may be underestimating the extent of tunnel penetration on its southern border...

“It is believed that the construction of the more advanced Palestinian tunnels began right after the 2012 cease-fire agreement, when Israel agreed to lift restrictions for humanitarian aid, including large quantities of steel and concrete,” he said, adding that the agreement to lift the blockade was overseen by Hillary Clinton. Egyptian tunnels are easier to build and are dug by using traditional excavation equipment and are meant mainly for commerce. These are easier to see, he said, adding that the ones crossing into Israel are for military purposes and “are of a totally different magnitude.”

Exclusive: US intelligence source claims Hamas has many more tunnels than Israel says | JPost | Israel News

This outcome explains why restrictions on the Gaza Strip might actually have to be toughened e.g., greater restrictions on steel and concrete imports, and not eased until Hamas lacks significant influence and military capabilities or an effective enforcement mechanism can be devised to prevent the use of steel and concrete for non-civilian purposes.

 

[CJ 2.0]

From The Jerusalem Post:

As Israeli security forces thwarted the latest attempt by terrorists to infiltrate Israel via tunnels from Gaza on Monday, The Jerusalem Post has learned that Israel may be underestimating the extent of tunnel penetration on its southern border...

“It is believed that the construction of the more advanced Palestinian tunnels began right after the 2012 cease-fire agreement, when Israel agreed to lift restrictions for humanitarian aid, including large quantities of steel and concrete,” he said, adding that the agreement to lift the blockade was overseen by Hillary Clinton. Egyptian tunnels are easier to build and are dug by using traditional excavation equipment and are meant mainly for commerce. These are easier to see, he said, adding that the ones crossing into Israel are for military purposes and “are of a totally different magnitude.”

Exclusive: US intelligence source claims Hamas has many more tunnels than Israel says | JPost | Israel News

This outcome explains why restrictions on the Gaza Strip might actually have to be toughened e.g., greater restrictions on steel and concrete imports, and not eased until Hamas lacks significant influence and military capabilities or an effective enforcement mechanism can be devised to prevent the use of steel and concrete for non-civilian purposes.

Sounds like another Clinton foregin policy success...

And I remember all the clothes rending going on here about how eeevil the Israelis were for denying Gaza the ability to import cement to "rebuild".

Maybe some of those folks want to acknowledge, however belatedly, that Israel was right and they were wrong?

 

[CJ 2.0]

From Caroline Glick, an Israekli reporter at the Jerusalem Post (on her Facebook page):

Wounded soldiers in the hospital have given a clearer picture of what Hamas's battlefield looks like. When our forces came to Sejeiyah, Hamas sent children into the street wearing suicide vest and with rifles and orders to shoot at our soldiers. One soldier told his parents that a terrorist carrying a baby in one hand and a rifle in the other hand charged and him and his comrades.

 

[Kristin18]

I don't want innocent people to die but is Israel really supposed to just accept getting bombed because the city is so densely packed that any retaliation on their part will kill innocent people? It sucks that innocents are dying but that's really the fault of Gaza, not Israel.

The Palestinian casualty number is 7 times more than Israel's since the year 2000. I'd say that Palestinians are not a threat therefore there is no retaliation on Israel's part. If someone was trying to kick you out of your own country and you fire a missile to fight back does that make you a terrorist? Israel has high precision weapons.. There is no mistake when they are killing civilians and innocent children. They killed a child playing football and then dropped a bomb on the funeral service. Is that justified as self defense?

 

[CJ 2.0]

The Palestinian casualty number is 7 times more than Israel's since the year 2000. I'd say that Palestinians are not a threat therefore there is no retaliation on Israel's part. If someone was trying to kick you out of your own country and you fire a missile to fight back does that make you a terrorist? Israel has high precision weapons.. There is no mistake when they are killing civilians and innocent children. They killed a child playing football and then dropped a bomb on the funeral service. Is that justified as self defense?

Um, seriously, WTF guys. So this has happened:

For second time, rockets found at UN school in Gaza | The Times of Israel

Yet more rockets found in a UN school, and this school just so happens to be sandwiched by refugee accomodations for displaced civilians.

Seriosuly *uck these Hamas ***holes.

Look forward to the UNRWA giving these rockets back to Hamas. I wonder if these are the same rockets UNRWA gave back to Hamas a few days ago...

Oh, as for Kristin's nonsense, whatever.