Let's Ban Pit Bulls

[KevinKohler]

Because they ARE pit bulls according to the legal definition of a pit bull.

I've posted it about 20 times for you......do you need it again?

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By that metric, all dogs are wolves.

 

[BillRM]

Pit bulls attack anybody but prefer attacking children.

Nobody is safe.

Yes the five or six pit bulls that are walk in my community every day had torn up at least five children in the last 6 months.

With any luck and thanks to them we will be an adult only community in another year.

 

[Vox]

I remember as clear as if it was yesterday that when I was growing up in the 50s that the devil breed of dogs at the time was the Doberman Pinscher.

Turning on their owners for no reason and killing them. 'Experts' warn of them in newspapers.

Sorry but you are going to have a very hard task of convincing the millions repeat millions of humans who had have ongoing contact with Pit Bulls that they are not the same as any other bred of large dogs.

That's simply not true in my experience. I grew up in the 50s and never saw anything like that with dobermans or any other dog.

Definitely nothing like the DAILY MAYHEM that's going on today as I have repeatedly shown in this thread.

The current situation where pit bulls are killing twenty to thirty people per year and maiming hundreds per year and killing about 35 thousand small pets each year is unprecedented in U.S. history.

Do you have any proof that there was ongoing and recurring mauling and killing by dobermans in the 50s in the numbers that we see with pit bulls in contemporary America???

If it happened there should be a lot of evidence available.

And.....the fact that pit bulls are "different" from all other dogs is abundantly proven by the numbers of people they kill and maim--numbers higher than all other dogs put together.

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[Vox]

By that metric, all dogs are wolves.

Wrong.

In point of fact, there IS a legal definition of pit bull......there is NO legal definition of wolf.

Your comparison is invalid.

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[Vox]

Yes the five or six pit bulls that are walk in my community every day had torn up at least five children in the last 6 months.

With any luck and thanks to them we will be an adult only community in another year.

The almost daily maiming of toddlers by pit bulls is nothing to joke about.

If it happened to your family you would be less amused.

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[BillRM]

That's simply not true in my experience. I grew up in the 50s and never saw anything like that with dobermans or any other dog.

Definitely nothing like the DAILY MAYHEM that's going on today as I have repeatedly shown in this thread.

The current situation where pit bulls are killing twenty to thirty people per year and maiming hundreds per year and killing about 35 thousand small pets each year is unprecedented in U.S. history.

Do you have any proof that there was ongoing and recurring mauling and killing by dobermans in the 50s in the numbers that we see with pit bulls in contemporary America???

If it happened there should be a lot of evidence available.

And.....the fact that pit bulls are "different" from all other dogs is abundantly proven by the numbers of people they kill and maim--numbers higher than all other dogs put together.

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Sorry that you was not paying attentions in the 50s but I can still recall a man in a wheel chair story of him being killed by his doberman while Pits was consider a harmless breed with one being a key note animal on the TV show "Our Gang".



As late as 1972 the poor dobermans was getting bad press from a movie by the name of "The Doberman Gang" concerning out of control killers dogs.



Of course any such movie now days would use Pitts instead of Dobermans.

 

[Vox]

Sorry that you was not paying attentions in the 50s but I can still recall a man in a wheel chair story of him being killed by his doberman while Pits was consider a harmless breed with one being a key note animal on the TV show "Our Gang".

As late as 1972 the poor dobermans was getting bad press from a movie by the name of "The Doberman Gang" concerning out of control killers dogs.

View attachment 67216872

That doesn't qualify as evidence of your initial claim.

Not even close. One undocumented anecdote and a very cheap movie?

I still call BS unless you have facts.

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[KevinKohler]

The almost daily maiming of toddlers by pit bulls is nothing to joke about.

If it happened to your family you would be less amused.

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Are you trolling...do you have an ulterior motive here, or do you genuinely think pit bulls need to be banned, due the potential for harming they can cause?

 

[Vox]

Are you trolling...do you have an ulterior motive here, or do you genuinely think pit bulls need to be banned, due the potential for harming they can cause?

Potential?

Read the thread. I've posted almost daily maimings for the past week at least--plus one brutal killing.
There is no consideration of "potential" needed.

The actual is reason enough to ban pit bulls nationally, as they have already been banned in many cities and entire Canadian provinces.

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[KevinKohler]

Potential?

Read the thread. I've posted almost daily maimings for the past week at least--plus one brutal killing.
There is no consideration of "potential" needed.

The actual is reason enough to ban pit bulls nationally, as they have already been banned in many cities and entire Canadian provinces.

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VS daily deaths caused by second hand smoke, drunk driving, accidental (and intentional) shootings, etc?


Is your premise that if something is dangerous to others, it should be banned?

 

[BillRM]

LOL as the danger of Dobermans and Pitts over any other large breed of dogs is pure bull**** and in the mind of people who once wish to stroke the fear of the public to get readers for news print during one era and web page views now being document or undocument is beside the point.

I am surely not saying that Dobermans are any more or less dangerous then Pits
unlike you are in reverse just that at one time the public was being sold the idea that Dobermans are killers dogs and now it is Pit Bulls and next it very well might be rottweilers for example or even Chow Chows.

Hell I remember sitting down for a visit in the living room of a friend and her large Chow Chow came over and jump onto my lap.

There was a coffee table book on the breed and reading it around the dog the book stated they was family dogs but are not friendly to strangers and have a black tongue.

I open her mouth and saw that she did indeed have a black tongue so she was indeed a chow chow even if she was friendly to someone she had just met and even allow me to pry her mouth open to look at her tongue.

The vet my friend took her dog to however believe the nonsense of Chow chows not being friendly and had her put a damn muffle on the poor dog when she was being taken in for treatments at the vet.

As I stated it is all nonsense as you treat all dogs with respect but there is hardly any need or reason to fear any one breed of dog.

 

[Vox]

VS daily deaths caused by second hand smoke, drunk driving, accidental (and intentional) shootings, etc?


Is your premise that if something is dangerous to others, it should be banned?

Banned or at least harshly controlled.......as all the things you mention already are.

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[Vox]

LOL as the danger of Dobermans and Pitts over any other large breed of dogs is pure bull**** and in the mind of people who once wish to stroke the fear of the public to get readers for news print during one era and web page views now being document or undocument is beside the point.

I am surely not saying that Dobermans are any more or less dangerous then Pits
unlike you are in reverse just that at one time the public was being sold the idea that Dobermans are killers dogs and now it is Pit Bulls and next it very well might be rottweilers for example or even Chow Chows.

Hell I remember sitting down for a visit in the living room of a friend and her large Chow Chow came over and jump onto my lap.

There was a coffee table book on the breed and reading it around the dog the book stated they was family dogs but are not friendly to strangers and have a black tongue.

I open her mouth and saw that she did indeed have a black tongue so she was indeed a chow chow even if she was friendly to someone she had just met and even allow me to pry her mouth open to look at her tongue.

The vet my friend took her dog to however believe the nonsense of Chow chows not being friendly and had her put a damn muffle on the poor dog when she was being taken in for treatments at the vet.

As I stated it is all nonsense as you treat all dogs with respect but there is hardly any need or reason to fear any one breed of dog.

All that to say that you can't back up your comparison of dobermans and pit bulls?

You needn't have bothered with all the obfuscation.

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[BillRM]

Potential?

Read the thread. I've posted almost daily maimings for the past week at least--plus one brutal killing.
There is no consideration of "potential" needed.

The actual is reason enough to ban pit bulls nationally, as they have already been banned in many cities and entire Canadian provinces.

:2usflag:

An after Pits are ban and the dog fighters and others who just wish to have a mean dog for one reason or another then turn their attentions to the other large breeds then what then?

Our we then going to end up with only the toy breed of dogs?

 

[Vox]

An after Pits are ban and the dog fighters and others who just wish to have a mean dog for one reason or another then turn their attentions to the other large breeds then what then?

Our we then going to end up with only the toy breed of dogs?

No other dog has been carefully and selectively bred for killing for hundreds of years.......none.

That's the difference and that's why pit bulls kill and maim more than all other dogs put together.

That's why pit bulls are being banned in many places and will eventually, I'm sure, be eliminated.

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[BillRM]

All that to say that you can't back up your comparison of dobermans and pit bulls?

You needn't have bothered with all the obfuscation.

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LOL all I was comparing is how people two generations ago picked another breed of dog to declare as devil dogs that should be ban.

Having been around large breeds of dogs all my now fairly long life I see zero reason to see any one breed being more dangerous then any other assuming they have not become popular with the human dark side and some of them turn into fighting dogs by the manner some of them are raised and train.

Hell read how many Pits that Michael Vick needed to kill due to them not being able to turn them into fighting dogs.

Also even after the training some of those poor dogs was given a fair percent of them was able to be turn back into normal dogs.

It is not dogs who are dangerous it is human that are the dangerous ones on this earth.

 

[BillRM]

no other dog has been carefully and selectively bred for killing for hundreds of years.......none.

That's the difference and that's why pit bulls kill and maim more than all other dogs put together.

That's why pit bulls are being banned in many places and will eventually, i'm sure, be eliminated.

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bull****.............



Breed for hundreds of years what nonsense breed to do what by the way attack humans????

Fighting dogs are not train or breed to attack humans but other dogs.

I had forgot the breed name of the Roman dogs of war that was train to attack humans but it surely was not the Pit bull.

 

[Vox]

No other dog has been carefully and selectively bred for killing for hundreds of years.......none.

That's the difference and that's why pit bulls kill and maim more than all other dogs put together.

Those are the facts and they are well documented.

If you can refute them.......do so.

Others have tried and failed for 110 pages.

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[BillRM]

A Fascinating History of Military Dog Breeds - Photo Gallery


Here is how the Roman dogs of war would had likely had look being Mastiff progenitors types of dogs.

Dogs that was train and breed to fight in combat with the roman legions so we should ban all Mastiffs I guess and leave the poor Pits only at worst having been breed to fight other dogs.

Oh even greyhounds was used as dogs of war by the Spanish in the new world!!!!!!

But not Pits repeat not Pits.

 

[Vox]

bull****.............



Breed for hundreds of years what nonsense breed to do what by the way attack humans????

Fighting dogs are not train or breed to attack humans but other dogs.

I had forgot the breed name of the Roman dogs of war that was train to attack humans but it surely was not the Pit bull.

Pitbulls were carefully and selectively bred to kill living things......and their instincts do not distinguish between those living things.

Twenty to thirty homicides per year. Hundreds of maimings per year. About 35,000 dogs and cats per year.

Their horrific contemporary record of killing and maiming humans and pets is ample evidence--it cannot be denied.

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[Vox]

A Fascinating History of Military Dog Breeds - Photo Gallery


Here is how the Roman dogs of war would had likely had look being Mastiff progenitors types of dogs.

Dogs that was train and breed to fight in combat with the roman legions so we should ban all Mastiffs I guess and leave the poor Pits only at worst having been breed to fight other dogs.

Oh even greyhounds was used as dogs of war by the Spanish in the new world!!!!!!

But not Pits repeat not Pits.

Dogs of war. Fascinating.

But it has nothing to do with the current pit bull problem.

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[Vox]

Let me address your latest myth.

Q: Why do people say, "Pit bulls are dog-aggressive not human-aggressive?"

Due to selective breeding for the purposes of dogfighting, pit bulls are highly dog-aggressive. This aggression is not limited to dogs; pit bulls frequently kill other companion pets and domesticated animals. Leading pit bull education websites warn pit bull owners to, "Never trust your pit bull not to fight." These same websites also state that pit bulls should never be left alone with another dog or animal.20 The practical and moral question is: Why is "pit bull dog aggression" tolerated at all?

Pit bull dog aggression is unacceptable for two reasons. In many instances it leads to human aggression. A common scenario is the following: A loose pit bull attacks a leashed dog being walked by its owner. The owner gets seriously injured trying to stop the attack. Every year, one or more Americans suffers death due to pit bull dog aggression, including pit bull rescuers like Rita Woodard and Mary Jo Hunt who died while attempting to break up a fight between their pit bulls.

Secondly, far too many beloved companion pets and domesticated animals suffer a violent death by the powerful jaws of pit bull terriers each year. In some instances, these attacks involve pit bulls charging through screen doors of private homes -- in a home invasion attack -- to kill the pet living inside.21 Owners of the pet are then forced to watch as their dog or cat is disemboweled by the pit bull and pray that the animal does not turn its attention on an innocent family member next.

Pit Bull FAQ - Dangerous Dogs - DogsBite.org

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[Vox]

MORE:

Historically, it is believed that dogfighters removed human-aggressive pit bulls from the gene pool. "Man biters," as dogmen referred them, were "culled" to prevent dog handlers from suffering vicious bites. However, dogmen themselves and pedigrees show a different story. As far back as 1909, George Armitage shares a story in, "Thirty Years with Fighting Dogs." He describes Caire's Rowdy as not a mere man-biter, but as a "man-eater," the most dangerous biter of all.6

In more modern years, a substantial number of champion (CH), grand champion (GR CH) and register of merit (ROM) fighting dogs carry the title of a man-biter or a man-eater. These pit bulls were championship-breeding stock, whose famed owners never for a moment considered culling the dogs. Some of the most well known dogs include: Adams' GR CH Zebo, Indian Bolio ROM, Garner's CH Chinaman ROM, Gambler's GR CH Virgil and West's CH Spade (man-eater).7

In 1974, after a series of high profile news articles written by Wayne King and published by the New York Times, the image of the ferocious fighting pit bull moved from the shadowy world of dogmen into the mainstream. This period, between 1975 and 1979, is known as the "leakage period" when the breeding of pit bulls drastically increased through gang members and drug dealers, who wanted the "toughest dog" on the block, as well as by pet pit bull breeders.8

While some dogmen of the past may have culled human-aggressive dogs to keep their stock free of man-biters, once the leakage period began, there is no evidence that similar selective pressures were maintained.9 As early as 1980, pit bull attacks begin headlining newspapers, "Another Pit Bull Attack Reported; Boy, 8 Slashed (1980)," as well as reports of pit bull owners trying to bolster the breed's "deteriorating" public image, "Pit Bull Attacks As Owners Fight Image (1980)."

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[Vox]

MORE:

The blood sport of "bull baiting" began over 1,000 years ago in England (various sources dispute this date). What is undisputed is that by 1500, bull baiting had progressed to Britain's national pastime. Bulldogs were reportedly first mentioned by name in 1631, referring to their function rather than a distinct dog breed. By 1800, and through further selective breeding, the bulldog developed into a compact muscular dog characterized by tremendous jaw strength.4

Due to public outrage, bull baiting was banned in England in 1835. Bulldog breeders and owners then moved to the sport of "ratting," where a number of rats were placed into a pit and wagers were made on how many rats the dog could kill in a certain time period. To increase agility, quickness and prey-drive in the bulldog, ratters crossed the breed with terriers. Essentially, it was the sport of ratting that combined the bulldog and terrier into the modern day pit bull terrier.

On the heels of ratting, dogfighting developed. Pit bulls and dogfighting were exported to America as settlers made their way to the New World. In 1884, the American Kennel Club was formed but rejected pit bulls due to their use in dogfighting. In response, Chauncey Z. Bennett formed the United Kennel Club in 1898 to bring formal recognition to the pit bull breed. At that time, Bennett also drew up rules and regulations for dogfighting to bring "organization" to the blood sport.5

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[BillRM]

The Lies, Damn Lies and Statistics Behind Dog Bites | The Huffington Post


It is all nonsense and once more you are far safer having a number of Pit Bulls as part of your household then one other human being. Hell you are more likely to choke while eating a hot dog then died from a dog attack of any breed. Then your risk of dying of a bee sting is double that from a dog attack of any breed and so on.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pit_bull

In a 2014 literature review of dog bite studies, the American Veterinary Medical Association (AVMA) states that breed is a poor sole predictor of dog bites.[29] Controlled studies do not show pit bulls to be disproportionately dangerous. While pit bull-type dogs are more frequently identified with cases involving very severe injuries or fatalities than other breeds, the review suggests this may relate to the popularity of the breed, noting that sled dogs and Siberian Huskies compose a majority of fatal dog attacks in some areas of Canada.[24]
In a 2000 review by the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, which examines data from both media reports and from The Humane Society of the United States, pit bull-type dogs were identified in approximately one-third of dog bite-related fatalities in the United States between 1981 and 1992. However, the review notes that studies on dog bite-related fatalities which collect information by surveying news reports are subject to potential errors, as some fatal attacks may not have been reported, a study might not find all relevant news reports, and the dog breed might be misidentified.[30] The AVMA has also noted fundamental problems with tracking breed in dog bite-related fatalities.[31] In a 2013 study of 256 fatalities in the United States from 2000–2009, the AVMA determined that valid breed determination was possible for only 17.6% of cases.[32]