Late Clash on Abortion Shows Conservatives’ Sway (1 Viewer)

[majora$$hole]

Ok, that would be conception....We agree then.

j-mac

no that would not be conception that would be point when there is a brain present to function. somewhere around the end of the first trimester if i'm reading the medical info correctly. so j-mac you seem to think the human cells formed at conception are a living human?

 

[j-mac]

that may be true but don't you think it should be made available to those who that isn't the reason?

Depends on the reason. Those that will die from the pregnancy, or are victims of violent crime, although I am mixed about the latter, could be allowed. However, in this country that is so small a percentage of the total it would be insignificant.

j-mac

 

[majora$$hole]

Depends on the reason. Those that will die from the pregnancy, or are victims of violent crime, although I am mixed about the latter, could be allowed. However, in this country that is so small a percentage of the total it would be insignificant.

j-mac

but that is how it is now so what do you want to change?

 

[j-mac]

no that would not be conception that would be point when there is a brain present to function. somewhere around the end of the first trimester if i'm reading the medical info correctly.

If left alone, the brains creation is unavoidable.

so j-mac you seem to think the human cells formed at conception are a living human?

Yes. They aren't a Tiger are they? They aren't a Fish are they? They are human.

j-mac

 

[j-mac]

but that is how it is now so what do you want to change?

On demand. that is how it really is now. Abortion as contraception is wrong.

j-mac

 

[majora$$hole]

If left alone, the brains creation is unavoidable.




Yes. They aren't a Tiger are they? They aren't a Fish are they? They are human.

j-mac

okay so then do you think it is still a living human when the brain no longer functions? ie: "brain death" which is the definition for death in 48 states. or do you think someone isn't dead until all living human cells have fully decomposed?

 

[majora$$hole]

On demand. that is how it really is now. Abortion as contraception is wrong.

j-mac

i think r.v.w. states that until the end of the first trimester yes pretty much anything goes. after that it's pretty much you need a "good" excuse. am i wrong here?

 

[majora$$hole]

okay if we can't adequately measure brain activity in the utero as you say then i say at the point which all the conditions/components are met for brain activity to happen should be that point. as tothe brain starting up and shutting down not being the "same" thing i agree they are the opposite and being the opposite would agree with oneanother according to the law that is the whole point. about the "about to happen" vs. "never will happen again" again those are the opposite of one another and the point of my whole arguement. so i just don't see how what you said is shooting holes in it maybe you could explain how these opposites don't relate to oneanother again without them just being opposite for that is MY whole point. life and death ARE the polar opposites of one another you do agree with that don't you mac?

or do you mac think that polar opposites in the law can't support oneanother? do i need to come up with examples of that?

 

[mac]

okay if we can't adequately measure brain activity in the utero as you say then i say at the point which all the conditions/components are met for brain activity to happen should be that point. as tothe brain starting up and shutting down not being the "same" thing i agree they are the opposite and being the opposite would agree with oneanother according to the law that is the whole point. about the "about to happen" vs. "never will happen again" again those are the opposite of one another and the point of my whole arguement. so i just don't see how what you said is shooting holes in it maybe you could explain how these opposites don't relate to oneanother again without them just being opposite for that is MY whole point. life and death ARE the polar opposites of one another you do agree with that don't you mac?

the brain doesn't start up "the opposite" of how it shuts down. thw reasons behind it starting up are not the same as shutting down the human brain is not a light bulb attached to a switch.

 

[majora$$hole]

On demand. that is how it really is now. Abortion as contraception is wrong.

j-mac

i think if abortion is being used as a contraception then the taxpayers should not pay for it. i say the taxpayer should cover 3 abortions for any woman who NEEDS them if she has had 5 abortions and is going in for her sixth then she should pay for it. she will find out really fast that there are cheaper less painfull forms of contraception out there that she should be using.

 

[majora$$hole]

the brain doesn't start up "the opposite" of how it shuts down. thw reasons behind it starting up are not the same as shutting down the human brain is not a light bulb attached to a switch.

what "reasons" are those again? there are no "reasons" for either it just happens it starts it stops whats the BIG difference again?

 

[mac]

what "reasons" are those again? there are no "reasons" for either it just happens it starts it stops whats the BIG difference again?

the brain "fires up" as the cells form. this occurs at slightly different rates per individual. the brain "shuts down" due to myriad reasons to complex to list. its not just on and off....its not that simple.

 

[j-mac]

okay so then do you think it is still a living human when the brain no longer functions? ie: "brain death" which is the definition for death in 48 states. or do you think someone isn't dead until all living human cells have fully decomposed?

that is a different question.

i think r.v.w. states that until the end of the first trimester yes pretty much anything goes. after that it's pretty much you need a "good" excuse. am i wrong here?

So who says that the court is infallible?

i think if abortion is being used as a contraception then the taxpayers should not pay for it.

Then you should be pretty mad right now.

i say the taxpayer should cover 3 abortions for any woman who NEEDS them if she has had 5 abortions and is going in for her sixth then she should pay for it.

Which is it? Should the taxpayer pay for contraceptive abortions or not?

she will find out really fast that there are cheaper less painfull forms of contraception out there that she should be using.

Great, so a couple of murders and we will know that its wrong?

j-mac

 

[majora$$hole]

that is a different question.



So who says that the court is infallible?



Then you should be pretty mad right now.



Which is it? Should the taxpayer pay for contraceptive abortions or not?



Great, so a couple of murders and we will know that its wrong?

j-mac

1. not a different question it is "the question" imo.
2. i never said it was infallible in fact i'm trying to simplify the whole thing so there is less of a chance for error.
3. i don't get "mad".
4. can you not read?
5. it's not murder according to the law.
you got any thing else?

 

[j-mac]

1. not a different question it is "the question" imo.

Sure it is. The 'brain dead' decision many families of brain stem patients make is about quality of life issues. The decision made by the pregnant woman that couldn't be bothered to make the right contraceptive decision in the heat of the moment.

2. i never said it was infallible in fact i'm trying to simplify the whole thing so there is less of a chance for error.

So, do you think that the SC made an error in their decision then?

3. i don't get "mad".

I think you know what I meant.

4. can you not read?

What'd I miss? In one sentence you said that you don't think that the taxpayer should fund abortions, in the very next you said that they should up to 3 times...Which is it?

5. it's not murder according to the law.
you got any thing else?

The laws conflict.

j-mac

 

[majora$$hole]

Sure it is. The 'brain dead' decision many families of brain stem patients make is about quality of life issues. The decision made by the pregnant woman that couldn't be bothered to make the right contraceptive decision in the heat of the moment.



So, do you think that the SC made an error in their decision then?



I think you know what I meant.



What'd I miss? In one sentence you said that you don't think that the taxpayer should fund abortions, in the very next you said that they should up to 3 times...Which is it?



The laws conflict.

j-mac

1.) you are mixing "brain dead" and "vegitative state" two different things the law is CLEAR about when someone is dead.
2.) i think the law should pretty much stay the way it is now with MY clarification/cooperation of the laws conserning when someone is LEGALLY alive and dead.
3.) no, i didn't get mad that the current law helps my arguement.
4.) i said tax payers should cover the bill when a women gets a "needed" (which you agree that there are conditions in which they are appropriate)abortion 3 times seems like plenty to me after that it is clear she is using it for contriception at which point i think the tax payer is no longer liable.
5.) change the law. good luck with that.

 

[majora$$hole]

the brain "fires up" as the cells form. this occurs at slightly different rates per individual. the brain "shuts down" due to myriad reasons to complex to list. its not just on and off....its not that simple.

no the brain can only "fire up" when there is a brain to fire up. the brain "shuts down" when it dies. it is just on and off that simple. i still fail to see this complexity you speak of.

 

[ReverendHellh0und]

The most radical social conservative elements, really terrorists amongst us, have tried to bring America to its knees. They failed but they were far too close to succeeding.

yes, anyone who does not agree with you is a terrorist... :doh

 

[ReverendHellh0und]

What makes you think every woman who receives abortion services from Planned Parenthood are "deadbeats" - code word for poor minorities (Blacks and Histpanics)? Is it possible that many of these women come from decent, hard working families who just made poor choices? Why does every woman who has an abortion have to be moochers off the goverment's doles?

What's with your prejudice against blacks and hispanics?

 

[mac]

no the brain can only "fire up" when there is a brain to fire up. the brain "shuts down" when it dies. it is just on and off that simple. i still fail to see this complexity you speak of.

you fail to see it because you are intent on oversimplifieng the most complex organ in the human body. not to mention the least understood.

 

[Chappy]

yes, anyone who does not agree with you is a terrorist... :doh

Once again you not only get it wrong but you're not even the first to get it wrong.

http://www.debatepolitics.com/break...hows-conservatives-sway-9.html#post1059407876

 

[majora$$hole]

you fail to see it because you are intent on oversimplifieng the most complex organ in the human body. not to mention the least understood.

i am failing to see it because there is nothing to see. can we agree the law needs something to make it not so complex an issue? i agree it is the least understood part of the body but answer me this. which organization more than any other has tried to prevent the study of said organ throughout history and why?

 

[majora$$hole]

how about this mac do you agree that the two extrems of this arguement are the "life begins outside the womb" & "life begins at conception" (which i'm guessing you are in this camp) crowds? and that any real meaningful legislation is going to come from somewhere in the middle of the two? and that my arguement does not support either extreme but lies somewhere in the middle of the two extremes?

 

[mac]

i am failing to see it because there is nothing to see. can we agree the law needs something to make it not so complex an issue? i agree it is the least understood part of the body but answer me this. which organization more than any other has tried to prevent the study of said organ throughout history and why?

do tell: which organization has blocked study of the human brain?

 

[majora$$hole]

do tell: which organization has blocked study of the human brain?

in leonardo's day he had to do anatomy in the back alleys and basements to not be prosicuted by the church and to this day the church continues the squelching of information which may be detrimintal to its existance.