John Oliver on Transgender Females in Women's Sports

[BrotherFease]

I just watched the entire 42 minute segment. I'll give you the cliff notes version. Please note: It is worth your time. My posts will not be as detailed as John Oliver.

Oliver's Main Points:
- Transgender females do not transition just so they can play on the female sports team. Most organizations permitting transgender females have hormonal requirements.

- All of the scientific studies of transgender females in sports have a small sample size and feature unreliable data.

- The opponents of transgender females in women's sports consistently exaggerate and mislead people.

- Riley Gaines tied Lia Thomas in a swimming competition for fifth place, and then got "embarrassed" because she wasn't allowed to stand on the 5th place podium for a photo op. After she tied for fifth, she decided to use Thomas as a means to get wealthy. If Gaines didn't tie Thomas, she would have gone to dental school.

- Lia Thomas placed 1st, 8th, and 5th in the national swimming competitions. Even she didn't dominate all of her events.

- Payton McNabb got a concussion after a transgender female spiked a volleyball in her face. But it turns out, her sporting career wasn't over and turned into a great athlete in college.

- Concussions and head injuries happen all the time in sports.

- There was a complaint filed against a transgender female San Jose State player for having an 80 mile per hour spike speed. It turns out it was only 50 miles per hour, which wasn't even near the record-holders or the fastest in the Mountain West Conference.

- No transgender females have won any scholarships to any university. In the case of the two Connecticut transgender runners, the complaint was that they stole scholarship opportunity from the other competitors, when the reverse was true.

- The number of transgender females in sports is very very small. Not every transgender female who competes, wins medals or races. States who tried to ban transgender females from women's sports fail to show any example of a transgender female dominating a single female sport within their state.

- The Right loves to use the "800 medals" stat in discussions and political debate. They claim it came from the U.N. It turns out it did not actually come from the UN, but a website which asked people submit competitions from across the world, where a transgender female beat a genetic female in an event. These events includes poker and Irish dancing. Plus, the metal counts feature duplication of events and counting a first place finish as three medals. Some of the examples submitted feature people who do not object to transgender females in women's sports.

- The debate isn't really about "fairness". Women's sports are extremely underfunded and feature poor quality fields. The Right's main objection is to deny transgender people their right to exist, and sports is their avenue for success. They do not care about women's sports or their safety.

- Youth sports are fine. They are about social development. Professional sports we need to look more into the impact.

 

[Loulit01]

I love John Oliver. I do, he's great.

This is a tiny, tiny problem. Not to say it isn't important. But it affects maybe 50 kids.

This issue should be addressed by the rules committee of the sport. Just make a rule.

If you have a penis and testicles you can't play women's sports. Otherwise why have women's sports? Do we need to check every athlete's testosterone level before the kid plays JV basketball? It's crazy.

That's not fair? Life ain't fair. Everyone has handicaps. I was great field/no hit, didn't make the team. Allergic to chlorine? No swim team for you. Have a **** and balls? No chick sports.

The whole thing's crazy.

 

[Sweden]

I just watched the entire 42 minute segment. I'll give you the cliff notes version. Please note: It is worth your time. My posts will not be as detailed as John Oliver.

Oliver's Main Points:
- Transgender females do not transition just so they can play on the female sports team. Most organizations permitting transgender females have hormonal requirements.

- All of the scientific studies of transgender females in sports have a small sample size and feature unreliable data.

- The opponents of transgender females in women's sports consistently exaggerate and mislead people.

- Riley Gaines tied Lia Thomas in a swimming competition for fifth place, and then got "embarrassed" because she wasn't allowed to stand on the 5th place podium for a photo op. After she tied for fifth, she decided to use Thomas as a means to get wealthy. If Gaines didn't tie Thomas, she would have gone to dental school.

- Lia Thomas played 1st, 8th, and 5th in the national swimming competitions. Even she didn't dominate all of her events.

- Payton McNabb got a concussion after a transgender female spiked a volleyball in her face. But it turns out, her sporting career wasn't over and turned into a great athlete in college.

- Concussions and head injuries happen all the time in sports.

- There was a complaint filed against a transgender female San Jose State player for having an 80 mile per hour spike speed. It turns out it was only 50 miles per hour, which wasn't even near the record-holders or the fastest in the Mountain West Conference.

- No transgender females have won any scholarships to any university. In the case of the two Connecticut transgender runners, the complaint was that they stole scholarship opportunity from the other competitors, when the reverse was true.

- The number of transgender females in sports is very very small. Not every transgender female who competes, wins medals or races. States who tried to ban transgender females from women's sports fail to show any example of a transgender female dominating a single female sport within their state.

- The Right loves to use the "800 medals" stat in discussions and political debate. They claim it came from the U.N. It turns out it did not actually come from the UN, but a website which asked people submit competitions from across the world, where a transgender female beat a genetic female in an event. These events includes poker and Irish dancing. Plus, the metal counts feature duplication of events and counting a first place finish as three medals. Some of the examples submitted feature people who do not object to transgender females in women's sports.

- The debate isn't really about "fairness". Women's sports are extremely underfunded and feature poor quality fields. The Right's main objection is to deny transgender people their right to exist, and sports is their avenue for success. They do not care about women's sports or their safety.

- Youth sports are fine. They are about social development. Professional sports we need to look more into the impact.

I won't be watching 42 minutes of trans cult propaganda.

 

[BrotherFease]

I won't be watching 42 minutes of trans cult propaganda.

It is important to listen to both sides of the argument. Oliver is essentially arguing we should have debate based on good faith and being respectful.

Misgendering people, lying to the public, and telling erroneous stats isn't the way to go.

Also, there are states which ban transgender males from men's competitions, even though there's no biological competitive advantages.

I love John Oliver. I do, he's great.

This is a tiny, tiny problem. Not to say it isn't important. But it affects maybe 50 kids.

This issue should be addressed by the rules committee of the sport. Just make a rule.

If you have a penis and testicles you can't play women's sports. Otherwise why have women's sports? Do we need to check every athlete's testosterone level before the kid plays JV basketball? It's crazy.

That's not fair? Life ain't fair. Everyone has handicaps. I was great field/no hit, didn't make the team. Allergic to chlorine? No swim team for you. Have a **** and balls? No chick sports.

The whole thing's crazy.

I agree. Broad bans without context are bad. There is no such thing as equality in sports. That is the point -- it is uneven. Nobody has ever complained about Michael Phelps in swimming. He was born with webbed feet, this gives him a major advantage in swimming.

 

[j brown's body]

I just watched the entire 42 minute segment. I'll give you the cliff notes version. Please note: It is worth your time. My posts will not be as detailed as John Oliver.

Oliver's Main Points:
- Transgender females do not transition just so they can play on the female sports team. Most organizations permitting transgender females have hormonal requirements.

- All of the scientific studies of transgender females in sports have a small sample size and feature unreliable data.

- The opponents of transgender females in women's sports consistently exaggerate and mislead people.

- Riley Gaines tied Lia Thomas in a swimming competition for fifth place, and then got "embarrassed" because she wasn't allowed to stand on the 5th place podium for a photo op. After she tied for fifth, she decided to use Thomas as a means to get wealthy. If Gaines didn't tie Thomas, she would have gone to dental school.

- Lia Thomas placed 1st, 8th, and 5th in the national swimming competitions. Even she didn't dominate all of her events.

- Payton McNabb got a concussion after a transgender female spiked a volleyball in her face. But it turns out, her sporting career wasn't over and turned into a great athlete in college.

- Concussions and head injuries happen all the time in sports.

- There was a complaint filed against a transgender female San Jose State player for having an 80 mile per hour spike speed. It turns out it was only 50 miles per hour, which wasn't even near the record-holders or the fastest in the Mountain West Conference.

- No transgender females have won any scholarships to any university. In the case of the two Connecticut transgender runners, the complaint was that they stole scholarship opportunity from the other competitors, when the reverse was true.

- The number of transgender females in sports is very very small. Not every transgender female who competes, wins medals or races. States who tried to ban transgender females from women's sports fail to show any example of a transgender female dominating a single female sport within their state.

- The Right loves to use the "800 medals" stat in discussions and political debate. They claim it came from the U.N. It turns out it did not actually come from the UN, but a website which asked people submit competitions from across the world, where a transgender female beat a genetic female in an event. These events includes poker and Irish dancing. Plus, the metal counts feature duplication of events and counting a first place finish as three medals. Some of the examples submitted feature people who do not object to transgender females in women's sports.

- The debate isn't really about "fairness". Women's sports are extremely underfunded and feature poor quality fields. The Right's main objection is to deny transgender people their right to exist, and sports is their avenue for success. They do not care about women's sports or their safety.

- Youth sports are fine. They are about social development. Professional sports we need to look more into the impact.

I've been fascinated by the right-wing demonizing of these poor people as they often portray them as monstrous brutes who are only playing women's sports because they want to dominate women, says those who take away a woman's right to control their own bodies, and are putting their very safety in danger.

The anti-trans movement is spearheaded by Christian nationalists with their narrow and rigid gender views of sexuality and others who imagine themselves as white knights riding to rescue of American womanhood from this national scourge.

 

[Lisa]

I won't be watching 42 minutes of trans cult propaganda.

What parts of what he said are propaganda, if you claim to know so much? The idea that you disagree with him doesn't make what he said propaganda.

 

[j brown's body]

Youth sports are fine. They are about social development. Professional sports we need to look more into the impact.


We don't look at sports as an important social and personal activity anymore. In our age of diminishing economic opportunities, only that which can advance you is valued. and thus, sports is seen as a chance to advance through college scholarships. Its more like a job than a healthy activity. I sure a lot of this when my own kid was participating in middle school sports.

 

[j brown's body]

I won't be watching 42 minutes of trans cult propaganda.

The op has thoughtfully summarized it for you.

 

[Argent]

The anti-trans movement is spearheaded by Christian nationalists with their narrow and rigid gender views of sexuality and others who imagine themselves as white knights riding to rescue of American womanhood from this national scourge.

The irony is that the Christian nationalists are the scourge. Anti-choice, restrictive abortion laws leading to physical harm and deaths of women, keep 'em pregnant and in the kitchen where they belong mentality, trying to dial women's progess back to the the 18th century. And yet it's trans issues and drag queen reading hours that get their knickers knotted.

 

[BrotherFease]

We don't look at sports as an important social and personal activity anymore. In our age of diminishing economic opportunities, only that which can advance you is valued. and thus, sports is seen as a chance to advance through college scholarships. Its more like a job than a healthy activity. I sure a lot of this when my own kid was participating in middle school sports.

It looks like sports have radically changed since the 90s. I did cross country running, skiing and track and field. The most valuable thing I gained was social skills and the value of hard work. Those were the most important things. Let kids be kids. Being an adult is terrible. So much responsibility and making life changing decisions. Moving into the realm of attacking children for their existence and making youth sports into political wars has completely destroyed the main tenets.

One of the main examples Oliver presented was a transgender girl playing on the girls softball team in Ohio. This girl never hit a home run before, and her own mother called her mediocre. It turns out that the Ohio legislative branch had a major problem with her playing on the softball team, and passed legislation, just to kick her off the team. Who actually wins here?

More over, we're getting into psycho territory, when winning an Irish Folk Dance competition becomes a problem.

 

[Scatty Kitty]

I love John Oliver. I do, he's great.

This is a tiny, tiny problem. Not to say it isn't important. But it affects maybe 50 kids.

This issue should be addressed by the rules committee of the sport. Just make a rule.

If you have a penis and testicles you can't play women's sports. Otherwise why have women's sports? Do we need to check every athlete's testosterone level before the kid plays JV basketball? It's crazy.

That's not fair? Life ain't fair. Everyone has handicaps. I was great field/no hit, didn't make the team. Allergic to chlorine? No swim team for you. Have a **** and balls? No chick sports.

The whole thing's crazy.

If you're asking why we have woman's sports they're for a simple reason.

It's because women were beating men and they had to be reminded of their place. No seriously, why do you think woman's sports doesn't get equal funding to men's sports?

 

[Loulit01]

If you're asking why we have woman's sports they're for a simple reason.

It's because women were beating men and they had to be reminded of their place. No seriously, why do you think woman's sports doesn't get equal funding to men's sports?

Title IX.

 

[Lycanthrope]

Won't stop MAGAs from believing misinformation and running around with their hair on fire over it.

 

[Scatty Kitty]

Title IX.

Title IX says everyone needs to have equal access to sports. But that doesn't mean they will end up having equal access. One of the favorite parts of John Oliver's video is talking about how the softball team can't play because they're not allowed on the 3 baseball fields for the boys and the fields floods. When we look at a national level, there are about a million less girl athletes in high school than there are boy athletes.

 

[Loulit01]

Title IX says everyone needs to have equal access to sports. But that doesn't mean they will end up having equal access. One of the favorite parts of John Oliver's video is talking about how the softball team can't play because they're not allowed on the 3 baseball fields for the boys and the fields floods. When we look at a national level, there are about a million less girl athletes in high school than there are boy athletes.

Maybe fewer girls want to play organized sports? Gymnastics is big for girls but it's almost all private gyms. The sport with the most injuries per participant is cheerleading. The USWNT turned soccer into a big deal for boys and girls. I watched a series on how the amazingly successful women's team was paid far less than the God-awful men's team. They went on strike. It was a huge deal.

 

[OrphanSlug]

This issue of biological males transitioning to female in order to play sorts against biological females is just not happening enough to generate this level of discussion. No matter how well John Oliver calls out the facts and fiction on this subject, at the end of the day identity politics is a loser. The calls to align the plight of transgender athletes as some comparative value to other civil rights issues is starting to backfire.

I've said it dozens of times, the politics from the far-left and far-right on transgenders has failed to actually help transgenders. It has become far more about branding people, far more about intentional divisiveness over helping the first person struggling with gender identity.

Adding in who should be able to play who else in sports intentionally made the issue worse.

John Oliver, well spoke on this or not, is beating a political dead horse to no good conclusion for anyone.

(BTW, everyone from the IOC to the NCAA has altered their rules for this a few times over suggesting they are struggling with the line. Example, Lia Thomas today would not be able to do what happened back then under older rules. In that respect spare us the bullshit on settled science or settled approach to dealing with "hormonal requirements" as if that is the only thing mentioned in the rules.)

 

[BrotherFease]

Title IX says everyone needs to have equal access to sports. But that doesn't mean they will end up having equal access. One of the favorite parts of John Oliver's video is talking about how the softball team can't play because they're not allowed on the 3 baseball fields for the boys and the fields floods. When we look at a national level, there are about a million less girl athletes in high school than there are boy athletes.

Bingo. There's a big problem with fairness with women's sports. It's not genetic males beating genetic females. It's about how much society doesn't really care about girls sports in general. The Ohio state legislative branch voted to ban transgender females solely to kick out a softball player who cannot hit home runs. She is playing because it's fun and gets to socialize with the other girls. Their main priority wasn't about the quality of the fields or equipment, but that a genetic male was playing softball. That pretty much sums up the problem with the debate.

 

[Sweden]

It is important to listen to both sides of the argument. Oliver is essentially arguing we should have debate based on good faith and being respectful.

Misgendering people, lying to the public, and telling erroneous stats isn't the way to go.

Also, there are states which ban transgender males from men's competitions, even though there's no biological competitive advantages.


I agree. Broad bans without context are bad. There is no such thing as equality in sports. That is the point -- it is uneven. Nobody has ever complained about Michael Phelps in swimming. He was born with webbed feet, this gives him a major advantage in swimming.

Imo there is sex but not 'gender', therefore the term 'misgendering' has no meaning.

The evidence suggest that biological males do have competitive advantage in many sports. It may be significant that few biological women seek to take part in men 's events.

 

[BrotherFease]

Imo there is sex but not 'gender', therefore the term 'misgendering' has no meaning.

The evidence suggest that biological males do have competitive advantage in many sports. It may be significant that few biological women seek to take part in men 's events.

Do you care to clarify that statement? Which evidence?

We're talking about transgender females who either gone through hormone replacement therapy or preteens in female sports.

 

[Lisa]

Imo there is sex but not 'gender', therefore the term 'misgendering' has no meaning.

The evidence suggest that biological males do have competitive advantage in many sports. It may be significant that few biological women seek to take part in men 's events.

Not only does gender identity exist, it can be imagined in our brains via an MRI scan.

Brain Scanning Shows That Gender and Sex Are Different

<div><p paraid="722623838" paraeid="{bfc5b879-a5a3-4700-8210-a2a6072480c4}{170}">Even though as a society, we debate how to treat a person’s sex and gender, research suggests the two use distinct communication networks in the brain. Sex divides us into male and female groups based on our biology...

www.utmb.edu

 

[Bodi]

It is important to listen to both sides of the argument. Oliver is essentially arguing we should have debate based on good faith and being respectful.

Misgendering people, lying to the public, and telling erroneous stats isn't the way to go.

Also, there are states which ban transgender males from men's competitions, even though there's no biological competitive advantages.

Doesn't sound like good faith by bashing the other sides points just because they are different than yours...

 

[BrotherFease]

Doesn't sound like good faith by bashing the other sides points just because they are different than yours...

As noted in the video, if your arguments are based on false and misleading information, it's not a productive debate or conversation.

 

[Bodi]

As noted in the video, if your arguments are based on false and misleading information, it's not a productive debate or conversation.

And both sides... but the Left more, just dismiss anything that they don't already agree with therefore there can't be a productive debate in the first place.

 

[Sweden]

Doesn't sound like good faith by bashing the other sides points just because they are different than yours...

Where does the British public stand on transgender rights in 2024/25? | YouGov

Scepticism towards transgender rights has grown across the board since 2022

yougov.co.uk

I share the increasingly sceptical opinions of my British compatriots a detailed in the extensive Yougov survey.

Trans surgery for under 16s is opposed by 87% and approved by only 3%. Hormone 'treatment' for under 16s are opposed by 78% and approved by 4%.

/4% are against trans women competing against female athletes and 12% for.

There has been a marked shift away from the trans position in the last three years particularly in relation to legal recognition of claimed sex change.

 

[Felis Leo]

Where does the British public stand on transgender rights in 2024/25? | YouGov

Scepticism towards transgender rights has grown across the board since 2022

yougov.co.uk

I share the increasingly sceptical opinions of my British compatriots a detailed in the extensive Yougov survey.

Trans surgery for under 16s is opposed by 87% and approved by only 3%. Hormone 'treatment' for under 16s are opposed by 78% and approved by 4%.

/4% are against trans women competing against female athletes and 12% for.

There has been a marked shift away from the trans position in the last three years particularly in relation to legal recognition of claimed sex change.

Sweden, you make it a point to point out you remember being of an age that gay men were being put in striped pajamas with pink triangles and fed to the ovens of Nazi Death Camps.

After World War 2, did homosexuals enjoy a great of social acceptance and popularity in Europe? I highly doubt it. No, they had to fight for their right to be recognized then, just like trans people do now. Because before that, they were forcing war heroes in places like Great Britain who were found to be gay into being chemically castrated.

And as a so-called "Libertarian" where do you stand on the issue? If a <18 kid identifies as trans, they want HRT, their doctor recommends HRT, and their parents are both on board, do you think they should be denied such treatment? And if so, on what basis?