Is this the engine from the Pentagon plane?

[RightinNYC]

Whose figures are those? NIST's findings:

"NIST estimated the elapsed times for the first exterior panels to strike the ground after the collapse initiated in each of the towers to be approximately 11 seconds for WTC 1 and approximately 9 seconds for WTC 2."

NIST's Investigation of the Sept. 11 World Trade Center Disaster - Frequently Asked Questions


:coffeepap Next...?

Stop lying and obfuscating. From your source:

NIST estimated the elapsed times for the first exterior panels to strike the ground after the collapse initiated in each of the towers to be approximately 11 seconds for WTC 1 and approximately 9 seconds for WTC 2. These elapsed times were based on: (1) precise timing of the initiation of collapse from video evidence, and (2) ground motion (seismic) signals recorded at Palisades, N.Y., that also were precisely time-calibrated for wave transmission times from lower Manhattan (see NCSTAR 1-5A).

As documented in Section 6.14.4 of NIST NCSTAR 1, these collapse times show that:

“… the structure below the level of collapse initiation offered minimal resistance to the falling building mass at and above the impact zone. The potential energy released by the downward movement of the large building mass far exceeded the capacity of the intact structure below to absorb that energy through energy of deformation.

Since the stories below the level of collapse initiation provided little resistance to the tremendous energy released by the falling building mass, the building section above came down essentially in free fall, as seen in videos. As the stories below sequentially failed, the falling mass increased, further increasing the demand on the floors below, which were unable to arrest the moving mass.”

In other words, the momentum (which equals mass times velocity) of the 12 to 28 stories (WTC 1 and WTC 2, respectively) falling on the supporting structure below (which was designed to support only the static weight of the floors above and not any dynamic effects due to the downward momentum) so greatly exceeded the strength capacity of the structure below that it (the structure below) was unable to stop or even to slow the falling mass. The downward momentum felt by each successive lower floor was even larger due to the increasing mass.

From video evidence, significant portions of the cores of both buildings (roughly 60 stories of WTC 1 and 40 stories of WTC 2) are known to have stood 15 to 25 seconds after collapse initiation before they, too, began to collapse. Neither the duration of the seismic records nor video evidence (due to obstruction of view caused by debris clouds) are reliable indicators of the total time it took for each building to collapse completely.

Unless you can't comprehend that "first exterior panel" is different from "building," you're being willfully ignorant.

 

[Chanda]

Unless you can't comprehend that "first exterior panel" is different from "building," you're being willfully ignorant.

NIST was answering a question about collapse time:

Question: 6. How could the WTC towers collapse in only 11 seconds (WTC 1) and 9 seconds (WTC 2)—speeds that approximate that of a ball dropped from similar height in a vacuum (with no air resistance)?

Answer: NIST estimated the elapsed times for the first exterior panels to strike the ground after the collapse initiated in each of the towers to be approximately 11 seconds for WTC 1 and approximately 9 seconds for WTC 2. These elapsed times were based on: (1) precise timing of the initiation of collapse from video evidence, and (2) ground motion (seismic) signals recorded at Palisades, N.Y., that also were precisely time-calibrated for wave transmission times from lower Manhattan (see NCSTAR 1-5A).

As documented in Section 6.14.4 of NIST NCSTAR 1, these collapse times show that:

Collapse times range anywhere from 8 seconds to 15 depending on the source. From 9/11myths.com:

How quickly did the towers fall, exactly? You’ll find different answers depending on where you look.

Around 8 seconds
The Twin Towers collapsed in about 8 & 10 seconds respectively
http://www.checktheevidence.com/911/TwinTowersandGravity.htm

8.4 - 12 seconds
The videos and seismic records show that the time of one structure's destruction was approximately 8.4 seconds though the complete settling of the building lasted slightly longer, perhaps as long as 12 seconds, but not long enough to account for anything but explosives.
http://reopen911.org/Contest.htm

10 seconds
This started the domino effect that caused the buildings to collapse within ten seconds, hitting bottom with an estimated speed of 200 km per hour. If it had been free fall, with no restraint, the collapse would have only taken eight seconds and would have impacted at 300 km/h
Why Did the World Trade Center Collapse? Science, Engineering, and Speculation

10 seconds

Each WTC building collapse occurred at virtually free-fall speed (approximately 10 seconds or less).
http://www.lewrockwell.com/reynolds/reynolds12.html

10 seconds
At 9:58:59, the South Tower collapsed in ten seconds...
Page 305, the 9/11 Commission Report

10 - <14 seconds
According to testimony provided to the 9-11 Commission, the tower fell in 10 seconds. Other data shows it took closer to 14 seconds. So the towers fell within 0.8-4.8 seconds of freefall in a vacuum. Just like WTC7, this speed seemed impossible if each of the 110 floors had to fail individually.
Physics911, by Scientific Panel Investigating Nine-Eleven, 9/11/2001

14 - 16 seconds
Each of the Twin Towers totally collapsed in an interval of approximately 14 to 16 seconds.
9-11 Review: ERROR: 'The Towers Collapsed in 10 Seconds'

15 seconds
..video evidence of the North Tower collapse suggests that it took close to 15 seconds for the destruction to reach the ground.
9-11 Research: Speed of Fall

15 seconds
Each of the Twin Towers totally collapsed in an interval of approximately 14 to 16 seconds.
9-11 Review: ERROR: 'The Towers Collapsed in 10 Seconds'

15 seconds
Both demolitions took place in about 15 seconds, which is about the time it would take for a free-fall from that height.Twin Towers - 9/11 Review

Notice the last source estimates free-fall time at 15 seconds. Estimated times vary by a few seconds, but any of those estimates are near free fall time. The collapses were consistent with controlled demolition collapses. They are definitely not, in any way, consistent with collapse by fire. Anyone who says the collapses were not "near free fall" speed is being "willfully ignorant."

 

[RightinNYC]

NIST was answering a question about collapse time:

Collapse times range anywhere from 8 seconds to 15 depending on the source. From 9/11myths.com:

Notice the last source estimates free-fall time at 15 seconds. Estimated times vary by a few seconds, but any of those estimates are near free fall time. The collapses were consistent with controlled demolition collapses. They are definitely not, in any way, consistent with collapse by fire. Anyone who says the collapses were not "near free fall" speed is being "willfully ignorant."

To clarify:

You claim the building collapsed at free fall, and in support of that, you cite a sentence from the NIST report.

I point out how that's not what the NIST report says at all, and the report in fact says EXPLICITLY that the buildings took 15-25 seconds to collapse.

You respond by providing links to "911review" and "checktheevidence.com" that contradict your original source.

You are desperately trying to shield yourself from the reality of the situation. Sorry.

 

[Chanda]

To clarify:

You have a convenient way of "clarifying."

You claim the building collapsed at free fall, and in support of that, you cite a sentence from the NIST report.

I didn't claim the buildings fell at free fall. I said they fell at near free fall speed. Numerous engineers, architects, and other experts have said the buildings fell at near free fall speed. Does even NIST deny they fell at near free fall speed? I don't think so.

I point out how that's not what the NIST report says at all, and the report in fact says EXPLICITLY that the buildings took 15-25 seconds to collapse.

Well, not exactly. It says "portions" stood for 15-25 seconds after collapse initiation. What "portions" are those, and what is that supposed to mean? Look at any video. You won't find a single one that takes either tower 25 seconds to collapse, 15--maybe. Another source I found claims that according to video evidence, the "first exterior panels" struck the ground at least one second, and possibly 3-4 seconds before complete collapse, which would make NIST's claim within range of the others. And while there might be one or two above or below, most estimates on both sides fall between 10-15 seconds.

You respond by providing links to "911review" and "checktheevidence.com" that contradict your original source.

That is an egregious misrepresentation of my post. I posted a list of sources on both sides of issue from 911myths.com, to show there is a wide range of estimates. However, independent physicists and engineers, or for that matter, most people in general would say that "near free fall" is a reasonable description of the collapse.

You are desperately trying to shield yourself from the reality of the situation. Sorry.

You are the one in denial if you think the buildings didn't fall at near free fall speed. Your post was completely dishonest, distorting and misrepresenting mine. You are the one that is desperate.

 

[Kernel Sanders]

Whose figures are those? NIST's findings:

"NIST estimated the elapsed times for the first exterior panels to strike the ground after the collapse initiated in each of the towers to be approximately 11 seconds for WTC 1 and approximately 9 seconds for WTC 2."

NIST's Investigation of the Sept. 11 World Trade Center Disaster - Frequently Asked Questions


:coffeepap Next...?

Errr....the video at the end of the post?

YouTube - 9/11 Debunked: World Trade Center - No Free-Fall Speed

 

[RightinNYC]

Errr....the video at the end of the post?

YouTube - 9/11 Debunked: World Trade Center - No Free-Fall Speed

Oh my god, rosie o'donnell is such a fat worthless bitch.

 

[creativedreams]

Oh my god, rosie o'donnell is such a fat worthless bitch.

She's not the only one...

there are many actors and entertainers who believe 9/11 was an inside job...just sayin'

 

[RightinNYC]

She's not the only one...

there are many actors and entertainers who believe 9/11 was an inside job...just sayin'

How does this affect the fact that Rosie O'Donnel is a fat worthless bitch?

 

[creativedreams]

How does this affect the fact that Rosie O'Donnel is a fat worthless bitch?

Actually it doesn't and to be perfectly honest I agree that she is a fat worthless bitch

 

[Tucker Case]

She's not the only one...

there are many actors and entertainers who believe 9/11 was an inside job...just sayin'

Which actually tells me I must be correct that it wasn't an inside job.

 

[Vader]

How would you keep the demolition explosives in place, unexploded, and functioning properly after a freaking jumbo jet slammed into the building at an inprecise point?

The short answer is --- unless they are nuclear and unarmed --- it cannot be done.