Is due process a human right? (from a moral perspective)

[ataraxia]

At least you didn't deny that the state is very much like the mob.

Now tell us some more about how everyone is empathetic if just left alone and free. That's always a good knee-slapper!

 

[ataraxia]

It's worse because it's a monopoly.

In this case it's OK, if we are the ones who have a say in it.

It doesn't work any other way. We have learned that through a lot of experience.

The Apparatus of the State and the Monopolization of Violence in Society: A Study on The Alternative of the Anarchical State

In political philosophy and sociology, the concepts of the structure of a state and the legitimate monopolization of violence, have always

moderndiplomacy.eu

 

[bomberfox]

The simple fact is rights are taken, never given. Every single human right we have now was taken through often times very bloody struggles but intense struggles nonetheless. We like to think rights are natural and were recognized at the beginning but even in this country rights had to be taken from those who held oppressive power over others.

 

[bomberfox]

Clan warfare. If you have the resources to hire mercenaries, they will enforce your 'claims.'

Private arbitration is a tool of the powerful to deny access to the courts by the small and weak.

Eventually one gets to a point where they realize “anarcho” capitalism is just reinvented feudalism. Herr Hoppe admitted as much.

Not to mention the whole original claimant provision of most property rights in America is null and void because of the imperialist project the founders started us off with which stole land so the state could give to settlers.

 

[Lursa]

Elephants mourn their dead and help injured members of the herd. Rats also demonstrate empathy:

Empathetic Rats Help Each Other Out

Rats are empathetic enough to help other rats in distress, say scientists who found the rodents freed their cage-mates from containers even if no reward was given.

www.livescience.com

Empathy is not based solely in morality. Hitler empathized with Aryans and dogs.

Empathy is a feeling, an emotion. Hate is also a feeling/emotion. Morality is more about how such feelings are applied in society.

You really are playing fast and loose with the semantics on this subject. IMO your grasp of them is based more on convenience than accuracy.

 

[Lursa]

No, they are simply too incompetent. You've got to be able to focus, evaluate arguments, weigh evidence, etc. Just look at some of the "debates" in this forum, and imagine someone's life depending on the same kind of people.

And yet you dont condone the certification of experts because there's no organized body you can trust to create certification standards and guidelines and then implement and enforce them.

 

[aociswundumho]

And yet you dont condone the certification of experts because there's no organized body you can trust to create certification standards and guidelines and then implement and enforce them.

Sorry, I don't understand what this garbled mess is suppose to mean. There are literally thousands of private certification organizations. Why would I have a problem with them?

 

[Lursa]

Sorry, I don't understand what this garbled mess is suppose to mean. There are literally thousands of private certification organizations. Why would I have a problem with them?

You kinda just made my point. Even the private ones, under a govt, must adhere to agreed-upon standards and guidelines...otherwise they're not "certified."

So...'in your world', who would be the one actually verifying the accuracy/safety/standards/criteria, etc for "certification?" Who would ever know if they were hiring someone with valid expertise?

 

[aociswundumho]

Even the private ones, under a govt, must adhere to agreed-upon standards and guidelines...otherwise they're not "certified."

It has nothing to do with the idiot government. Politicians generally don't know anything about anything. Just listen to them talk.

 

[Lursa]

You kinda just made my point. Even the private ones, under a govt, must adhere to agreed-upon standards and guidelines...otherwise they're not "certified."

So...'in your world', who would be the one actually verifying the accuracy/safety/standards/criteria, etc for "certification?" Who would ever know if they were hiring someone with valid expertise?

It has nothing to do with the idiot government. Politicians generally don't know anything about anything. Just listen to them talk.

Answer my questions specific to what I wrote please. Why didnt you? I didnt bring up politicians. I asked "who?" And "how."

And again you had to clip my post so you could hide the parts you dont want to answer. Is a little integrity too much to ask?

 

[Juin]

There's nothing from stopping me from putting up a house on your land.

Why do you refer to it as my land if I have no rights

Just you and your might. But if my might is better, I win and I get my house on your property.

The above is a consequence of rights

 

[Juin]

Outside of human society, there is no concept of "good vs evil." The lions are not evil when they seek out a gazelle to be their prey. They are simply seeking food to survive, as all 'predators' do.

Lions also protect their own

 

[Lursa]

Lions also protect their own

You seem to be confusing acting with rights.

People can kill and openly speak their minds and own firearms and protect property in the absence of government agents too.

When other animals kill, run, battle for dominance, breed, raid a farmer's field etc...are they exercising or violating any rights?

 

[aociswundumho]

Answer my questions specific to what I wrote please. Why didnt you?

Ok, I will:

So...'in your world', who would be the one actually verifying the accuracy/safety/standards/criteria, etc for "certification?" Who would ever know if they were hiring someone with valid expertise?

Consider PMI certifications:

Project Management Institute - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

It's the gold standard for project managers. Highly reputable, globally recognized, and often demanded by employers. They have all kinds of certifications you can find here:

https://www.pmi.org/

Has nothing to do with the idiot government.

 

[Lursa]

Ok, I will:



Consider PMI certifications:

Project Management Institute - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

It's the gold standard for project managers. Highly reputable, globally recognized, and often demanded by employers. They have all kinds of certifications you can find here:

https://www.pmi.org/

Has nothing to do with the idiot government.

Great...so an organization creates standards and certifies individuals. Who oversees the organization who has only self-interest in mind? They create the standards and certify individuals...who verifies the criteria?

Such a group can of course be privately run but still must be able to be held accountable...otherwise they're no different from any other mob that generates business for itself and creates standards that everyone else must adhere to. see: waste management in NJ.

 

[dairyair]

Why do you refer to it as my land if I have no rights





The above is a consequence of rights

K, you have to have land 1st.

But if you have land you call yours, I can just put my house on it. And claim it for myself. Unless you are capable of stopping me yourself.
If I have more might than you, then I get your land for my house.

Might makes right. That is the consequences. The thing I've repeated over and over.

 

[rickc]

Been around a long time.



Habeas corpus, meaning "you have the body," originates from English common law, predating the Magna Carta. While some scholars suggest Roman law influences, its core development is linked to the English legal tradition. The writ, initially a means to bring cases from inferior courts to the king's court, evolved to protect personal liberty against governmental authority. The Habeas Corpus Act of 1679 solidified its role in English constitutional law, and it was later adopted into the U.S. legal system.

 

[TheDoctorWasIn]

No, you're thinking of government-run courts, where the more money you have the more "justice" you get.

There is no denying that "private arbitration" pretty universally favors the party who put the private arbitration clause into the contract. The "big" side.

That's why they put it there. Without forced arbitration clauses, there would be no private arbitration.

 

[aociswundumho]

There is no denying that "private arbitration" pretty universally favors the party who put the private arbitration clause into the contract. The "big" side.

That's why they put it there. Without forced arbitration clauses, there would be no private arbitration.

Wrong. Businesses voluntarily use private arbitration to handle disputes ahead of time, and no business will hire a private arbitration firm that doesn't have an excellent reputation for fairness.

 

[aociswundumho]

Great...so an organization creates standards and certifies individuals. Who oversees the organization who has only self-interest in mind? They create the standards and certify individuals...who verifies the criteria?

The consumer does via their buying decisions.

 

[rickc]

Who decides what the consumer gets to pick.from?

Sort of like our political system. The wealthy pick who we get to chose from no matter what you may believe.

 

[TheDoctorWasIn]

Wrong. Businesses voluntarily use private arbitration to handle disputes ahead of time, and no business will hire a private arbitration firm that doesn't have an excellent reputation for fairness.

Sure. And some billionaires take the NYC Subway to work every day.

But of the fares collected by the MTA each day, billionaires account for 0.0000001%.

 

[Lursa]

The consumer does via their buying decisions.

That doesnt protect the consumer...they have to start somewhere and so they make a choice...and there's no prior information. So it's a crapshoot...sure they can leave bad feedback but there's no legal recourse.

 

[aociswundumho]

That doesnt protect the consumer...they have to start somewhere and so they make a choice...and there's no prior information. So it's a crapshoot...sure they can leave bad feedback but there's no legal recourse.

Yes there is prior information, there's the company's reputation. The company I gave you earlier as an example, has an excellent reputation.

This is your creed, written by another leftist: "Everything within the state, nothing outside the state, nothing against the state."

You simply cannot think outside of the state.

 

[Lursa]

Yes there is prior information, there's the company's reputation. The company I gave you earlier as an example, has an excellent reputation.

Where did the reputation come from? What oversite is there? Who holds them accountable? There is still legal recourse against that company if the make mistakes. What is the recourse for the consumer?

If an organization is corrupt...like the example "I" gave...NJ waste management. It's a huge organization, totally corrupt....what stops that in your world?

This is your creed, written by another leftist: "Everything within the state, nothing outside the state, nothing against the state."

You simply cannot think outside of the state.

That's a BS lie. Complete and utter BS. You use it to hide behind and avoid debate.

Your post is one giant pile of hyper-biased subjective Like imagining where rights come from...you have no idea but are SURE they exist.