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i am pissed

talloulou

talloulou

Banned
DP Veteran
Joined
Feb 12, 2006
Messages
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Location
Tiamat's better half
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Political Leaning
Conservative
Ok so I had a discussion with my son tonight. 4th grade. Apparently they were talking about the waterboarding and Obama apologizing for it in school. OK fine. However the teacher apparently wanted to make the point that this is not the first time American arrogance has led to us doing things that we later regretted out of fear. Ok.

So to bring her point home she introduces them to World War 2 and Japanese Internment camps.

Jeeeezus.

Through the course of the conversation I realized my son did not know about Hitler, the holocaust, Jewish camps, European nations falling like dominoes, or Pearl Harbor. He just learned about the US failure of Japanese Internment camps.

Am I wrong for going ape****?
 
talloulou said:
Ok so I had a discussion with my son tonight. 4th grade. Apparently they were talking about the waterboarding and Obama apologizing for it in school. OK fine. However the teacher apparently wanted to make the point that this is not the first time American arrogance has led to us doing things that we later regretted out of fear. Ok.

So to bring her point home she introduces them to World War 2 and Japanese Internment camps.

Jeeeezus.

Through the course of the conversation I realized my son did not know about Hitler, the holocaust, Jewish camps, European nations falling like dominoes, or Pearl Harbor. He just learned about the US failure of Japanese Internment camps.

Am I wrong for going ape****?
Click to expand...
Not at all.

Seriously, and I know it's a huge burden, have you considered home schooling?

Last year I came across a local home schooled boy, I think he was 7 at the time, playing in the snow. I asked him what he was doing.

He said "I'm recreating the Battle of Iwo Jima." I swear I'm not making this up.
 
I do not think I could do homeschooling. Socialization is such a huge part of going to school. But I do find myself supplementing more and more. Tomorrow we're off to Barnes and Noble first thing to pick up some decent books for younger kids on World War II.
 
I plan to do my absolute best to turn my kid into an arrogant American!
 
talloulou said:
Ok so I had a discussion with my son tonight. 4th grade. Apparently they were talking about the waterboarding and Obama apologizing for it in school. OK fine. However the teacher apparently wanted to make the point that this is not the first time American arrogance has led to us doing things that we later regretted out of fear. Ok.

So to bring her point home she introduces them to World War 2 and Japanese Internment camps.

Jeeeezus.

Through the course of the conversation I realized my son did not know about Hitler, the holocaust, Jewish camps, European nations falling like dominoes, or Pearl Harbor. He just learned about the US failure of Japanese Internment camps.

Am I wrong for going ape****?
Click to expand...

You need to send your kids to private school. But I would also have a little sit down with that teacher and clarify some things in the meantime while you look for a decent school.
 
jallman said:
You need to send your kids to private school. But I would also have a little sit down with that teacher and clarify some things in the meantime while you look for a decent school.
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I'm torn. I'm so tired of arguing with the school and the district and I just finished up the whole complaining about a high school play thing. I don't want to be the only bee in their bonnet, you know? And school is over in a month. I'm just so tired of it all. I think I will send her a quick little email letting her know I don't think it's appropriate to introduce 4th graders to world war II starting with the footnote that is Japanese Internment Camps no matter what point she is trying to make! My grandfather is a World War II vet and we have lots of pride in him and are incredibly proud of our countries efforts and successes in that war. It has no business being used with zero context to explain America's failures to 4th graders.

Good Lordy.
 
talloulou said:
I'm torn. I'm so tired of arguing with the school and the district and I just finished up the whole complaining about a high school play thing. I don't want to be the only bee in their bonnet, you know? And school is over in a month. I'm just so tired of it all. I think I will send her a quick little email letting her know I don't think it's appropriate to introduce 4th graders to world war II starting with the footnote that is Japanese Internment Camps no matter what point she is trying to make! My grandfather is a World War II vet and we have lots of pride in him and are incredibly proud of our countries efforts and successes in that war. It has no business being used with zero context to explain America's failures to 4th graders.

Good Lordy.
Click to expand...

Sounds to me like the problem has been that the school district has been left unchecked. Someone getting on their case is a good thing.
 
talloulou said:
I do not think I could do homeschooling. Socialization is such a huge part of going to school. But I do find myself supplementing more and more. Tomorrow we're off to Barnes and Noble first thing to pick up some decent books for younger kids on World War II.
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Tallou, I'm not being an ass when I say this but that is complete bunk.

School systems like the one we have have not been common in the past and in fact children were often taught at home having limited contact with other kids except siblings of course.

Schools, in my opinion, are similar to jails because of hierarchies (clicks, grouping, etc.) that develop with in the population of children.

The grouping is detrimental to educating children.
 
jallman said:
Sounds to me like the problem has been that the school district has been left unchecked. Someone getting on their case is a good thing.
Click to expand...

Yeah but why does it always have to be me????? Do you remember back when they decided to cancel homework? I think I complained about it here. Anywayz I set up a district/parent town hall meeting so parents could voice their concerns and less than 20 parents showed up. The schools are not being held accountable for their wanton ways because lazy parents could give a crap. It's a sad state of affairs. We do however have lots of military around here with Fort Lewis being so close by. Let's hope I'm not the only parent who gets angry over this bit.
 
Harry Guerrilla said:
Tallou, I'm not being an ass when I say this but that is complete bunk.

School systems like the one we have have not been common in the past and in fact children were often taught at home having limited contact with other kids except siblings of course.

Schools, in my opinion, are similar to jails because of hierarchies (clicks, grouping, etc.) that develop with in the population of children.

The grouping is detrimental to educating children.
Click to expand...

Even if I thought I was equipped to home school -which I don't think I am - my kids would never go for it, they would NEVER forgive me. They love school.
 
talloulou said:
Even if I thought I was equipped to home school -which I don't think I am - my kids would never go for it, they would NEVER forgive me. They love school.
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Its all good. That thing about socialization is a myth I've been trying to dispel.
:2wave:

I suggest, if you can afford it, a private school. Even christian schools are pretty good and generally affordable.
 
Wait a minute...Your school was trying to teach about Japanese internment camps in WW2 in the fourth grade? That is a problem right there. That young is too young to understand the justifications used, and to make an informed decision on right or wrong for themselves.

Did the teacher actually use the term arrogance? That would be pretty bad too. High school maybe, when kids are better able to question their teachers, but in the fourth grade?

Just based on this, now I am pissed for you. That is unreal. The fact that it seems like from what you say that the parents in your district are pretty apathetic makes me sad too. I am at least glad for the sake of your kids that from the sounds of it, apathetic is one word I could not use to describe you. Remember that you are going to be one of, if not the largest influence on your children. Your care for their wellbeing and education is going to pay major dividends for your children as they grow up.
 
Redress said:
Wait a minute...Your school was trying to teach about Japanese internment camps in WW2 in the fourth grade? That is a problem right there. That young is too young to understand the justifications used, and to make an informed decision on right or wrong for themselves.

Did the teacher actually use the term arrogance? That would be pretty bad too. High school maybe, when kids are better able to question their teachers, but in the fourth grade?

Just based on this, now I am pissed for you. That is unreal. The fact that it seems like from what you say that the parents in your district are pretty apathetic makes me sad too. I am at least glad for the sake of your kids that from the sounds of it, apathetic is one word I could not use to describe you. Remember that you are going to be one of, if not the largest influence on your children. Your care for their wellbeing and education is going to pay major dividends for your children as they grow up.
Click to expand...

Thank you. To be fair I have not spoken at all to this teacher yet. I just know what my son told me tonight. And yes the phrase "American Arrogance" was absolutely used as that is what he told me and it's not normal language for him. He was trying to explain to me how arrogant we are and he was quite upset about it. From my conversation with him it does not seem that they are learning about World War II right now. It was just used to make a point. They were discussing Obama and the apologies for waterboarding. The teacher was using the world war II internment camps to show that this is not the first time American arrogance has caused us to do something we later regret.

I can only hope that my son somehow got it wrong, or only parts of the discussion stuck with him. I just can't fathom a teacher introducing world war II to students in such a way; as an example of America's failures. It boggles the mind.

It is a gifted class and they do go off on weird tangents occasionally depending on what's happening in the world and what the kids want to discuss but still.... My son knows next to nothing about World War II and this was not a proper introduction. By the end of this 3 day weekend I plan on having him beaming with pride over our involvement in World War II.
 
talloulou said:
Ok so I had a discussion with my son tonight. 4th grade. Apparently they were talking about the waterboarding and Obama apologizing for it in school. OK fine. However the teacher apparently wanted to make the point that this is not the first time American arrogance has led to us doing things that we later regretted out of fear. Ok.

So to bring her point home she introduces them to World War 2 and Japanese Internment camps.

Jeeeezus.

Through the course of the conversation I realized my son did not know about Hitler, the holocaust, Jewish camps, European nations falling like dominoes, or Pearl Harbor. He just learned about the US failure of Japanese Internment camps.

Am I wrong for going ape****?
Click to expand...

Why am I supposed to trust the public education system with sex-ed when they can't even handle basic history?
 
Jerry said:
Why am I supposed to trust the public education system with sex-ed when they can't even handle basic history?
Click to expand...

Well she's not altogether wrong about the internment camps. But still, horrible introduction and example of why the US should be ashamed of themselves.
 
talloulou said:
Thank you. To be fair I have not spoken at all to this teacher yet. I just know what my son told me tonight. And yes the phrase "American Arrogance" was absolutely used as that is what he told me and it's not normal language for him. He was trying to explain to me how arrogant we are and he was quite upset about it. From my conversation with him it does not seem that they are learning about World War II right now. It was just used to make a point. They were discussing Obama and the apologies for waterboarding. The teacher was using the world war II internment camps to show that this is not the first time American arrogance has caused us to do something we later regret.

I can only hope that my son somehow got it wrong, or only parts of the discussion stuck with him. I just can't fathom a teacher introducing world war II to students in such a way; as an example of America's failures. It boggles the mind.

It is a gifted class and they do go off on weird tangents occasionally depending on what's happening in the world and what the kids want to discuss but still.... My son knows next to nothing about World War II and this was not a proper introduction. By the end of this 3 day weekend I plan on having him beaming with pride over our involvement in World War II.
Click to expand...

I firmly believe the internment camps where a national embarrassment, but still...you got to, got to have context. it's important to know why decisions are made that you disagree with, so you can learn the important lessons. Besides, I can think of much better and more recent cases that could fall under the category of "arrogance".

Did your teacher talk about how people and countries can do bad things, make mistakes, and not be bad themselves. That perfection is impossible to attain, and it is easy sometimes to second guess from hindsight? In the context of what your teacher is trying to teach, those would be key ideas to get across.

I like the idea that the teacher is talking with students about current events, even controversial ones. But to do that, you have to exercise care.

I am going to hope that the teacher was caught off guard by a question, and in trying to explain, spoke before(s)he thought. The idea of not condescending to fourth graders I do approve of...they always know when you are.
 
Redress said:
I firmly believe the internment camps where a national embarrassment, but still...you got to, got to have context. it's important to know why decisions are made that you disagree with, so you can learn the important lessons. Besides, I can think of much better and more recent cases that could fall under the category of "arrogance".

Did your teacher talk about how people and countries can do bad things, make mistakes, and not be bad themselves. That perfection is impossible to attain, and it is easy sometimes to second guess from hindsight? In the context of what your teacher is trying to teach, those would be key ideas to get across.

I like the idea that the teacher is talking with students about current events, even controversial ones. But to do that, you have to exercise care.

I am going to hope that the teacher was caught off guard by a question, and in trying to explain, spoke before(s)he thought. The idea of not condescending to fourth graders I do approve of...they always know when you are.
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Yes. I'm planning on holding off ripping her head off till I get the gist of what was discussed from her perspective.

To me is sounds like she's trying to make the students ashamed of their country.

But I will give her the benefit of the doubt and wait to hear her side of the story as my son is prone to watching a two hour movie and completely getting obsessed with the huh, why, where, who, when, how of a 10 second part of the overall film. He often comes away from stuff with the weirdest freaking questions about the strangest stuff. So we shall see.
 
talloulou said:
He often comes away from stuff with the weirdest freaking questions about the strangest stuff. So we shall see.
Click to expand...

I bet that part gets worse. Hope you are not embarrassed easily.
 
talloulou said:
Ok so I had a discussion with my son tonight. 4th grade. Apparently they were talking about the waterboarding and Obama apologizing for it in school. OK fine. However the teacher apparently wanted to make the point that this is not the first time American arrogance has led to us doing things that we later regretted out of fear. Ok.

So to bring her point home she introduces them to World War 2 and Japanese Internment camps.

Jeeeezus.

Through the course of the conversation I realized my son did not know about Hitler, the holocaust, Jewish camps, European nations falling like dominoes, or Pearl Harbor. He just learned about the US failure of Japanese Internment camps.

Am I wrong for going ape****?
Click to expand...

I don't blame you a bit! :censored
 
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