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Hundreds of dead people discovered to be voting in Southern California

cpwill

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But there's no voter fraud....

Hundreds of “dead voters” are casting ballots in Southern California, according to an investigation by KCBS-TV.
David Goldstein, an investigative reporter for KCBS, cross-referenced voting records from the California Secretary of State’s office with death records from the Social Security Administration and found that hundreds voters are casting ballots under the names of people who have died...

Of the “dead voters,” 86 were registered Republicans, and 146 were registered Democrats.

According to KCBS, one such deceased voter, John Cenkner, who passed away in 2003, “somehow voted from the grave” in elections in 2004, 2005, 2006, 2008 and 2010.

Cenkner’s daughter, Annette Givans, told KCBS that her father, a World War II veteran, “took a lot of time choosing his candidates.”

“He was a diehard Democrat, and I was thinking that if somebody else was voting under his name, he’s probably rolling in his grave if they’re voting Republican,” Givans said...
 

Winchester

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But there's no voter fraud....

Of course there will always be voter fraud, no way to completely eliminate it. The question is is 86 dead registered republicans and 146 dead registered democrats going to swing any elections in SoCal? Sounds like they have a solution to the problem at any rate cross-reference voting records with the state's death records. Should be easy enough for the state to send death certificates to the county on record so the names can be removed from the voting roles.
 

Southern Dad

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Voter Fraud won't be a serious issue until Republicans win somewhere like Illinois 4th. Then you will hear the left demanding Voter ID.
 

TurtleDude

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Voter Fraud won't be a serious issue until Republicans win somewhere like Illinois 4th. Then you will hear the left demanding Voter ID.

the Demographics of inner city Democrat voters strongly suggest that vote fraud is more likely a Democrat party proclivity
 

Winchester

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Nope. No voter fraud. And it's mean, racist and hateful to ask them to produce ID when they do vote.

I'm not against ID's to vote, but I'm not going to delude myself thinking reducing voter fraud is the real reason behind the push for IDs.
 

Winchester

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Voter Fraud won't be a serious issue until Republicans win somewhere like Illinois 4th. Then you will hear the left demanding Voter ID.

Have there been republican strongholds that have turned democrat due to voter fraud?
 

Southern Dad

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the Demographics of inner city Democrat voters strongly suggest that vote fraud is more likely a Democrat party proclivity

Democrats do not care about voter fraud until is starts costing them elections. It is their position that the Republicans requiring Voter ID are doing it to disenfranchise liberal voters. However, the first time the Republicans win a seat somewhere totally unexpected there will be demands for Voter ID.
 

jimbo

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Of course there will always be voter fraud, no way to completely eliminate it. The question is is 86 dead registered republicans and 146 dead registered democrats going to swing any elections in SoCal? Sounds like they have a solution to the problem at any rate cross-reference voting records with the state's death records. Should be easy enough for the state to send death certificates to the county on record so the names can be removed from the voting roles.

Incorrect. The question is are there ineligible people or former people voting in our elections? Obviously there are.

This is just one group, dead people, voting in one locality, Southern Cal, who got caught. It suggest a problem, but doesn't reflect the magnitude of the problem.
 

cpwill

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Of course there will always be voter fraud, no way to completely eliminate it. The question is is 86 dead registered republicans and 146 dead registered democrats going to swing any elections in SoCal?

1. Breaking the law isn't really dismissable by "oh, but it's rare, so no reason to enforce it".

2. Yeah, voter fraud can swing elections.

Sounds like they have a solution to the problem at any rate cross-reference voting records with the state's death records.

No, they have a post-facto option that the state does not pursue, but that in this case was searched by an interested third party. That isn't a solution that will stop a single incident of voter fraud as it happens, but can only identify it afterwards.
 

Winchester

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Democrats do not care about voter fraud until is starts costing them elections. It is their position that the Republicans requiring Voter ID are doing it to disenfranchise liberal voters. However, the first time the Republicans win a seat somewhere totally unexpected there will be demands for Voter ID.

I don't think that's true.
 

cpwill

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I'm not against ID's to vote, but I'm not going to delude myself thinking reducing voter fraud is the real reason behind the push for IDs.

Do you think that, when Democrats such as Barack Obama require ID to enter their conventions, events, etc., that they are doing it because they want to keep out black people?

Or is it only the targets of Democrat accusations that have ulterior motives.

Or, alternately, is it possible that people actually want to protect the voting process from fraud.


Accusing Secret Hidden Agendas without proof is - like any conspiracy theory - easy to do, but difficult to demonstrate, and difficult to construct without significant logical holes.
 

Southern Dad

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Incorrect. The question is are there ineligible people or former people voting in our elections? Obviously there are.

This is just one group, dead people, voting in one locality, Southern Cal, who got caught. It suggest a problem, but doesn't reflect the magnitude of the problem.

Right, because one group voting dead people get caught, we shouldn't worry that there may be more. Tell me why voting an important enough right to protect? Why is it more important to check ID going to a Hillary Clinton speech but not to a polling place?
 

Winchester

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Do you think that, when Democrats such as Barack Obama require ID to enter their conventions, events, etc., that they are doing it because they want to keep out black people?

Or is it only the targets of Democrat accusations that have ulterior motives.

Or, alternately, is it possible that people actually want to protect the voting process from fraud.


Accusing Secret Hidden Agendas without proof is - like any conspiracy theory - easy to do, but difficult to demonstrate, and difficult to construct without significant logical holes.

Meh, read between the lines. It's couched reasonably (ie reduce voter fraud) but the effect is to disenfranchise poor who mostly vote democrat, again not that I disagree with IDs per se. It ain't a whole lot different from the laws passed to require admitting privileges for abortion providers, we're passing them because we're concerned about women's safety and well being, wink wink.
 

Winchester

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Right, because one group voting dead people get caught, we shouldn't worry that there may be more. Tell me why voting an important enough right to protect? Why is it more important to check ID going to a Hillary Clinton speech but not to a polling place?

Gee, you think she might have someone who wants to do her harm?
 

cpwill

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Meh, read between the lines. It's couched reasonably (ie reduce voter fraud) but the effect is to disenfranchise poor who mostly vote democrat, again not that I disagree with IDs per se. It ain't a whole lot different from the laws passed to require admitting privileges for abortion providers, we're passing them because we're concerned about women's safety and well being, wink wink.

Hm. If the intent is to disenfranchise the poor, why do voter ID laws - when passed - come with free ID's? Why does accessing the public safety net (provided for the poor) come with a requirement that you show ID?


If a strawberry picker with zero English and a 5th Grade education can illegally cross the border with nothing but what he's carrying and manage to get ID, I'm pretty sure that American Citizens can manage to receive free voter ID's.
 

Winchester

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Hm. If the intent is to disenfranchise the poor, why do voter ID laws - when passed - come with free ID's?

State's have always issued IDs and I'm assuming they've been done for free. The issue is how easy is it to get said IDs? I really don't know. I suppose if they put them in the welfare and SS offices people wouldn't have much of an excuse. I'm all for making getting IDs easy.
 

Abbazorkzog

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If they're voting for Clinton (considering every single state she's won since Arizona has been rife with accusations of voter fraud) this could be the final nail in the coffin for her (as far as her status of being the strongest candidate to beat Trump goes)...
 

jimbo

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Meh, read between the lines. It's couched reasonably (ie reduce voter fraud) but the effect is to disenfranchise poor who mostly vote democrat, again not that I disagree with IDs per se. It ain't a whole lot different from the laws passed to require admitting privileges for abortion providers, we're passing them because we're concerned about women's safety and well being, wink wink.

It's not disenfranchising if everybody is treated equally.
 

cpwill

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State's have always issued IDs and I'm assuming they've been done for free

:shrug: I think I've always had to pay for my Drivers' License.

The issue is how easy is it to get said IDs? I really don't know. I suppose if they put them in the welfare and SS offices people wouldn't have much of an excuse. I'm all for making getting IDs easy.

If people are in those offices, then they already have ID. When Alabama did it, for example, the ID's were available at the same office where you had to register to vote in the first place, which was also the DMV. Having (at most) to walk up to a different station in the same building that you are already in strikes me as a pretty low burden.
 

Southern Dad

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:shrug: I think I've always had to pay for my Drivers' License.



If people are in those offices, then they already have ID. When Alabama did it, for example, the ID's were available at the same office where you had to register to vote in the first place, which was also the DMV. Having (at most) to walk up to a different station in the same building that you are already in strikes me as a pretty low burden.

Georgia went a step further... You can get a Voter ID at any DDS (think DMV) as well as all 159 county seats. They are issued six days a week and are free.
 

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Voting ID laws stopping this is assuming people are going in to vote pretending to be dead people just to vote for them. I doubt that is how the majority of these dead votes are coming in as.
 
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