How much should fast food workers make? (1 Viewer)

[Perotista]

I have had people tell me that they are pleased with the Hispanics they have hired to do outdoor work for them. They work hard, do a good job, are punctual, and are pleasant while they are there. Good recommendations for any worker! :thumbs:

That has been my experience all around. Even at the Golden Corral and Ryans.

 

[Perotista]

Well if you consider that the yardstick by which we should be judging the use of illegals, then is no problem in the US with the use of illegals...................

Like I said, I don't know if they are or aren't. All I know is they do a good job.

 

[Bonzai]

Occasionally, when I feel constipated, I will eat a Big Mac Meal Deal------------I like the taste and I avoid the use of laxatives..................

 

[polgara]

I never mentioned Spanish or Hispanic people, check my posts.....................

Most of the posts here mention Hispanics. I wrongly assumed you were doing the same, but I see that you were saying "illegals" as a general term. On that subject, I agree. It's unfair to those who follow the law. Sorry...my mistake....

 

[Bonzai]

Most of the posts here mention Hispanics. I wrongly assumed you were doing the same, but I see that you were saying "illegals" as a general term. On that subject, I agree. It's unfair to those who follow the law. Sorry...my mistake....

You don't have to apologize..............I think we need to remain aware of how many people are living here, legally even, and appear to be Americans, even, but are not....ie :Tamerlan Tsarnaev...............

 

[polgara]

Out. :2wave:

Be well.

 

[Bonzai]

Out. :2wave:

Be well.

Bye ...........

 

[Real Korimyr #9]

Never earned as much as $8.50 at a fast-food job-- most I ever pulled was $8.05, after two years at the same job, and just before I would have been promoted. (I took another job instead.) I'm less qualified now, doing even less skilled work, and I am happy for the minimum wage I'm earning now after four years of nothing.

 

[MoSurveyor]

I think that the reality of employment in presentday America has become so unrelated to the Right's meme about employment in presentday America , that something has to give...................

I think so, too. The only question is which way the wave will break.

 

[sawyerloggingon]

I am all for paying fast food workers 15 bucks an hour. America is fat and fast food is a leading contributor to our obesity epidemic so this wage would be a great way to put these merchants of death out of business.

 

[Cephus]

I really know nothing of the Northeast. But outside of the manager, there always seems to be a huge turn over down here.

And there should be. Minimum wage jobs were never intended to pay a living wage, they are a place for the young to gain valuable work experience and develop a work ethic. Some people will move up within the organization and take over a limited number of management positions, most will take that experience and any education they are getting outside of the company and apply it to a better, higher-paying position elsewhere. Those low-paying positions will therefore continually turn over and provide the company with low-wage, but low-skill temporary workers.

That's how it's supposed to work.

 

[Sparkles]

Businesses should pay whatever they're willing to pay

And they should be able to hire anyone they want to, including 5 year old children.

And they should be able to require people to work for as many hours as they need them.

And businesses shouldn't be required to pay their employees in cash. There's no reason they can't pay them in scrip which can only be used to purchase goods at the company store.

Anything else is tyranny and communism

Agreed.

 

[Sparkles]

Really. Striking? Well, I'd think they should start at minimum wage (unless they have prior experience), get a raise once they're trained and able to work on their own, and then top out at around $10.00 an hour after two years. $12.00/hour as crew chiefs or assistant management. (With benefits.)

I think it's unrealistic to think that one is going to support a family working on the line in a fast-food restaurant. One wouldn't even need a high school diploma to do well. *shrug*

The problem there is, the price of food at such a shop would be so high, that no customer would pay it. Resulting in the business closing, and all the employees earning zero.

There was recently a strike by miners in South Africa. The company reported they were now losing money on the mines after the strike. The result? They cut 3,000 jobs. And the proposal is that if they continue to demand higher wages, they'll cut 14,000 jobs.

The same thing happened at Nike Shoe factories. After the international complaints about Nike not paying enough, the wages were increased, and Nike laid off thousands of workers.

McDonalds is doing the same thing.

http://news.cnet.com/mcdonalds-hires-7000-touch-screen-cashiers/8301-17938_105-20063732-1.html

7,000 employees lost their jobs. Replaced by touch screen kiosks.

Again... The value of labor is not determined by employees, or employers. It's determined by customers. How much *YOU* the customers are willing to pay for a service or product, determines how much the labor is worth.

If you are not willing to pay $15 for a cheap fast food burger, it doesn't matter how much the employees, or the employers think the labor is worth. It's not worth $15 an hour because we the customers are not willing to pay that much for it.

Thus you end up with job loss, or employees being replaced by automation.

These employees are not going to get $15 an hour, no matter what they do. They will either earn how much the job is worth, or they'll be unemployed.

 

[Henrin]

Whatever the going rate of the work is which is usually higher than the set minimum wage.

 

[molten_dragon]

In St. Louis, many fast food employees are striking because they're unhappy with making $8.50 an hour. They are demanding $15 an hour.

What say you?

I'd say $8.50 an hour is probably okay. Maybe a little more than that. I certainly wouldn't consider the work that someone at a fast food restaurant does worth $15/hour. It's unskilled labor that can be done by anyone with a middle school education. It's not all that valuable.

 

[mak2]

I ran many resturants in my prior life. I ran one resturant in the late 80s in the Philly area that would allow me to give a raise for pretty much anything I deemed worthy, up to a .25 per hour per quarter. My criteria included attendence, puncuality (6mos no absences), performance and attitude. I had employees making pretty good money, I dont remember exact numbers but for sure they were some of the highest payed employees in the area. The place was clean, service was always good, they always showed up, I even had to send them home sometimes because I did not want them spreading germs. I did not have to look for employees I could pretty much pick and choose from other employee reccomendation and my labor costs were alwasy in line. Not to mention they rarely stold stuff. My replacement did not see it that way and in a year it was just another resturant.

I'd say $8.50 an hour is probably okay. Maybe a little more than that. I certainly wouldn't consider the work that someone at a fast food restaurant does worth $15/hour. It's unskilled labor that can be done by anyone with a middle school education. It's not all that valuable.

 

[Sparkles]

I ran many resturants in my prior life. I ran one resturant in the late 80s in the Philly area that would allow me to give a raise for pretty much anything I deemed worthy, up to a .25 per hour per quarter. My criteria included attendence, puncuality (6mos no absences), performance and attitude. I had employees making pretty good money, I dont remember exact numbers but for sure they were some of the highest payed employees in the area. The place was clean, service was always good, they always showed up, I even had to send them home sometimes because I did not want them spreading germs. I did not have to look for employees I could pretty much pick and choose from other employee reccomendation and my labor costs were alwasy in line. Not to mention they rarely stold stuff. My replacement did not see it that way and in a year it was just another resturant.

The key here is that minimum wage being low, allowed you that flexibility. I also worked a number of fast food joints, and I can tell you the margins of profits, simply didn't allow you to give out tons of raises.

Of course the minimum wage was much higher for me, than for you. It also sounded like you worked higher wage restaurants. The problem is, when the minimum wage is raised, now even the crap employees are making the same wage as those employees who worked to earn a better wage.

When good employees see that they are not paid more (even if by federal law) than those lazy bad attitude employees, the results are that morale is lowered, and service declines.

The primary reason that minimum-wage workers are horrible, is because they are minimum wage workers. They all know that if they are fired, and get a new job, it can't possibly pay less than what they are already getting. So effectively they have nothing to lose. They also know that you are not likely to fire them, because you will only end up with yet another uncaring minimum wage worker.

The same thing was documented in the Soviet Union. Waiters at restaurants in the Soviet Union were notoriously horrible. And of course, the reason should be obvious. They couldn't get paid less no matter where they worked.

Raising the minimum wage also spreads the problem over a larger group of people. While it clearly reduces the number of low-wage jobs, at the same time it increase the number of minimum wage jobs. Jobs that were formerly $7 an hour jobs, when minimum wage was $4.25, are now minimum wage jobs. Thus now a larger group of people is earning minimum wage before, and that larger group of people, now doesn't care about their jobs, because they can't earn less anywhere else. They have nothing to lose.

 

[Oftencold]

In St. Louis, many fast food employees are striking because they're unhappy with making $8.50 an hour. They are demanding $15 an hour.

What say you?

In general,b I'd say that they're wages should determined by the value of the services they provide their employers and market conditions. Generally, a low wage worker has a low value to the enterprise, the owners of which should be free to determine that value for themselves without outside interference.

This is one of several reasons why I think the concept of a compulsory minimum wage is an abomination.

 

[sangha]

When good employees see that they are not paid more (even if by federal law) than those lazy bad attitude employees, the results are that morale is lowered, and service declines.

If lazy employees with bad attitude are allowed to keep their job, then the problem is with mgmt., not the higher minimum wage.

 

[Sparkles]

If lazy employees with bad attitude are allowed to keep their job, then the problem is with mgmt., not the higher minimum wage.

You are proving to me that you have never worked at a fast food joint in management.

If you fired every individual you got with a bad attitude..... you would never be able to open the store.

The most of the time you get employees with good attitudes, is when they are immigrants, or retired people. It's rare to find people with a good work ethic, and good attitude at a fast food joint.

Ironically I just had this experience today. I was doing some volunteer work, and a class of students showed up. Out of 20+ kids, only 3... and I mean three individuals did any real work. Two of them were Mexicans, and the third was an Muslim immigrant. They seem to work the entire time. The rest were kicking a ball around, molesting the girls, some found chairs and sat around for an hour talking about sports. Very few did much at all. I couldn't even get them to pick up trash and throw it in the trash can.

Now when you have a quality to useless ratio of 1 in 7, how exactly do you think a fast food joint is going to fire all the useless worthless employees?

 

[sangha]

You are proving to me that you have never worked at a fast food joint in management.

If you fired every individual you got with a bad attitude..... you would never be able to open the store.

Having decades of involvement in the food industry, including family owned restaurants, all you have proven to me is that you do not know how to motivate workers.

 

[Hard Truth]

Above minimum wage, employers will pay as little as they can get away with. The workers should organize for the highest wages they can get.

 

[Sparkles]

Having decades of involvement in the food industry, including family owned restaurants, all you have proven to me is that you do not know how to motivate workers.

I'll take that as, 'yes you are right Sparkles' and move on.

 

[Sparkles]

Above minimum wage, employers will pay as little as they can get away with. The workers should organize for the highest wages they can get.

Assuming you mean unionize when you say 'organize', that will only result in job loss. Most of the loss of low and mid range jobs is due exclusively to unions. Toyota and Honda did not declare bankruptcy, sell off a dozen plants, and lay off thousands of workers.

No it was GM and Chrysler. Union shops, with unrealistic union compensation, which caused them to be uncompetitive, and thus when the down times hit, they go bankrupt.

Unions have routinely and consistently destroyed the sectors they are in.

The reason for this is very simple. By forcing management to agree to a contract, they are unable to make the changes required to face a constantly changing market.

Everything in any economy, changes over time. Every company must change and adapt to those conditions. But workers, oblivious to those changing factors, only demand more and more money.

There is only one reason Ford was able to avoid bankruptcy in 2008. That's because Ford won large concessions from the Unions back in 2005-2006. Ford was able to convince the Unions that without concessions, they would undoubtedly face large lay offs.

When GM and Chrysler came to the Unions in 2008 requesting the same concessions, they refused, and the company filed for bankruptcy.

Toyota and Honda, alternatively were able to make the cuts required, and changes needed, to roll with the economic down turn. Far fewer people were laid off, far fewer plants were closed, and no bankruptcy was required.

Throughout history, Unions have caused nothing but problems. Far from benefiting the employees, the long term result is thousands lose their jobs.

Instead, workers should negotiate their wages individually. If the employer is not willing to pay what you think you should earn, then you should go someplace else and work. If no one is willing to pay you want you think your labor is worth.... it could be that your labor isn't worth that much, and you need to change what you do, or learn something new, that has more value in the market.

 

[MoSurveyor]

Throughout history, Unions have caused nothing but problems. Far from benefiting the employees, the long term result is thousands lose their jobs.

It's better than thousands loosing their health or lives. Of course, I can understand where you wouldn't want to look at that side of the coin. It would actually give credence to the unions.


I will also add I've always found it quite funny when capitalists think they can tell others what to do about association. Salary surveys are conducted often over almost every job class in the country and companies use those surveys as a basis for the salary they'll offer. So it seems to be OK for businesses to collect together and use a common foundation for their side of the negotiations but not OK for labor to do the same. Talk about a double-standard - and what else is new?!?