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How do conservatives keep their hands clean from Trump?

SDET

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I'm certainly not voting for Clinton, she's even worse than Trump. However Trump is wholly unfit to be president. It's just a matter of time before Trump's supporters have buyers remorse. How do conservatives position themselves to pick up the pieces?
 

FieldTheorist

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I'm certainly not voting for Clinton, she's even worse than Trump. However Trump is wholly unfit to be president. It's just a matter of time before Trump's supporters have buyers remorse. How do conservatives position themselves to pick up the pieces?

You accept that the future of America has nothing to do with conservatism. Honestly, there's nothing you can really do. Conservatism was never actually very popular with the country, the Republican party was largely held together with a mish-mosh of racism and identity politics of the South and mid-West (who are largely just authoritarians with no ideological foundation), the fact that your philosophy could be easily manipulated by the rich and powerful (who can fund candidates who agree with you to unreasonable degrees), and a smattering of single-issue special interests (creationists, anti-gay marriage, pro-lifers, etc). That's what bound the Republican party together and kept conservatives (rather than authoritarians, right-wing libertarians, etc) in control.

There's simply not enough people in the general public to support a Republican party with a traditional conservative ideology, let alone what's waiting for you over the next 30 years. The Republicans will now switch to authoritarians, but I suspect this is going to fail much sooner than the conservative (neoliberal capitalist and traditionalist) Republican party of the last 40 years.
 
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Riveroaks

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I'm certainly not voting for Clinton, she's even worse than Trump. However Trump is wholly unfit to be president. It's just a matter of time before Trump's supporters have buyers remorse. How do conservatives position themselves to pick up the pieces?

There is so much code language mixed in your question that it practically requires a CIA or NSA agent to decode it.

I think if you do NOT want Hillary in The White House (again) you need to vote for (rich) Mr. Trump and hope that he does half as good a job as Ike -- who was the last person who was elected POTUS and who was never a politician.

So just hold your nose and then kiss Trumps ugly azz and vote for him.

After all, Trump does have at least one conservative value -- he is really rich !!!
 

Riveroaks

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You accept that the future of America has nothing to do with conservatism. Honestly, there's nothing you can really do. Conservatism was never actually very popular with the country, the Republican party was largely held together with a mish-mosh of racism and identity politics of the South and mid-West (who are largely just authoritarians with no ideological foundation), the fact that your philosophy could be easily manipulated by the rich and powerful (who can fund candidates who agree with you to unreasonable degrees), and a smattering of single-issue special interests (creationists, anti-gay marriage, pro-lifers, etc). That's what bound the Republican party together and kept conservatives (rather than authoritarians, right-wing libertarians, etc) in control.

There's simply not enough people in the general public to support a Republican party with a traditional conservative ideology, let alone what's waiting for you over the next 30 years. The Republicans will now switch to authoritarians, but I suspect this is going to fail much sooner than the conservative (neoliberal capitalist and traditionalist) Republican party of the last 40 years.

Lately racism, yes. But in Lincoln's day even though they may have been racist like everybody else back then they were at least anti slavery.
 

Orly?

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More like Trump is going to keep conservatives and democrats hands clean of corruption.. Anyone doing any under the table crap better watch their backs..
 

FieldTheorist

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Lately racism, yes. But in Lincoln's day even though they may have been racist like everybody else back then they were at least anti slavery.

Republicans haven't voted or supported an ideology that was helpful or considerate of issues in the black community for at least 100 years.

More like Trump is going to keep conservatives and democrats hands clean of corruption.. Anyone doing any under the table crap better watch their backs..

LOL! Man, Trump supporters are about to get a real taste of what happens when you hand another rich white imbecile the keys to the White House.
 

Orly?

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LOL! Man, Trump supporters are about to get a real taste of what happens when you hand another rich white imbecile the keys to the White House.

Good..
 

FieldTheorist

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FieldTheorist said:
LOL! Man, Trump supporters are about to get a real taste of what happens when you hand another rich white imbecile the keys to the White House.
Good..

Spoken like a true Trump supporter.
 

coldjoint

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Republicans haven't voted or supported an ideology that was helpful or considerate of issues in the black community for at least 100 years.



LOL! Man, Trump supporters are about to get a real taste of what happens when you hand another rich white imbecile the keys to the White House.

You mean after they passed the Civil Rights Act?

1. More Republicans voted in favor of the Civil Rights Act than Democrats

5. A segregationist congressman's attempt to kill the bill backfired
Virginia's Democratic Rep. Howard W. Smith was a staunch segregationist and strongly opposed the Civil Rights Act.
Smith, who was chairman of the House Rules Committee, came up with many tactics to discourage the passage of the bill's Title VII, which would outlaw employment discrimination because of race, color, religion or national origin.
When Smith added the word "sex," the House reportedly laughed out loud. The ploy was Smith's attempt to quash support among the chamber's male chauvinists on the grounds that the bill would protect women's rights in the workplace, according to Clay Risen in his book "The Bill of the Century."
Despite resistance, and complex motives, the act eventually passed, laying the groundwork for legal battles to ensure equal employment opportunities for women.
And whether he intended to or not, Smith ended up helping to set the stage for modern feminism.
From CNN no less.

What you might not know about the 1964 Civil Rights Act - CNNPolitics.com
 

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It's kind of a fascinating thing to observe. The Trump supporters are sounding a whole lot like the Obama supporters of 8 years ago. The see nothing but a solution to all their problems in this guy and that certainly won't be the case.
 

shagg

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More like Trump is going to keep conservatives and democrats hands clean of corruption.. Anyone doing any under the table crap better watch their backs..

I would seriously love it if it turned out that way, but as the Magic 8 Ball says.....

Not Likely
 

FieldTheorist

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Yes, Republicans helped with that, and then less than three years later totally abandoned blacks to the Southern strategy, and those same congressmen endorsed Nixon and his strategy, then waged a 50+ year continued propaganda war on the "black lifestyle" to gain votes for their neoliberal agenda. That does somewhat attenuate the point you're trying to make here, but that is a historically relevant point regarding both how parties have shifted 50 years ago and how the Democrats certainly cannot claim sole (or, honestly, generally even partial) credit for the success of the Civil Rights movement.
 

polgara

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It's kind of a fascinating thing to observe. The Trump supporters are sounding a whole lot like the Obama supporters of 8 years ago. The see nothing but a solution to all their problems in this guy and that certainly won't be the case.

I see the same hopes in the Bernie supporters. It's too bad that promises can't always get fulfilled, and I really hope it doesn't discourage those who hoped they would.
 

Chomsky

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You accept that the future of America has nothing to do with conservatism. Honestly, there's nothing you can really do. Conservatism was never actually very popular with the country, the Republican party was largely held together with a mish-mosh of racism and identity politics of the South and mid-West (who are largely just authoritarians with no ideological foundation), the fact that your philosophy could be easily manipulated by the rich and powerful (who can fund candidates who agree with you to unreasonable degrees), and a smattering of single-issue special interests (creationists, anti-gay marriage, pro-lifers, etc). That's what bound the Republican party together and kept conservatives (rather than authoritarians, right-wing libertarians, etc) in control.

There's simply not enough people in the general public to support a Republican party with a traditional conservative ideology, let alone what's waiting for you over the next 30 years. The Republicans will now switch to authoritarians, but I suspect this is going to fail much sooner than the conservative (neoliberal capitalist and traditionalist) Republican party of the last 40 years.
I couldn't have said this better.

And just as importantly today, the GOP fostered and encouraged an environment where all these often fringe, aberrant, and even delusional ideas where accepted as normal everyday fact by their voters, spawning a fertile environment for a birther fast talker like Trump to come along and sway them away!

How can the GOP establishment claim Trump is crazy or B.S., when they fed their voters crazy & B.S. to the point that many can no longer discern crazy or B.S.? And viola: The establishment were defenseless against Trump!
 

Fearandloathing

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It's kind of a fascinating thing to observe. The Trump supporters are sounding a whole lot like the Obama supporters of 8 years ago. The see nothing but a solution to all their problems in this guy and that certainly won't be the case.



"It's in the net, he scores!"


Good call. It's like they all have blindfolds and earplugs but keep howling at issues. Is it just me, or is Obama beginning to look good?
 

Lutherf

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"It's in the net, he scores!"


Good call. It's like they all have blindfolds and earplugs but keep howling at issues. Is it just me, or is Obama beginning to look good?

Must be just you.:lol:
 

Fearandloathing

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You accept that the future of America has nothing to do with conservatism. Honestly, there's nothing you can really do. Conservatism was never actually very popular with the country, the Republican party was largely held together with a mish-mosh of racism and identity politics of the South and mid-West (who are largely just authoritarians with no ideological foundation), the fact that your philosophy could be easily manipulated by the rich and powerful (who can fund candidates who agree with you to unreasonable degrees), and a smattering of single-issue special interests (creationists, anti-gay marriage, pro-lifers, etc). That's what bound the Republican party together and kept conservatives (rather than authoritarians, right-wing libertarians, etc) in control.

There's simply not enough people in the general public to support a Republican party with a traditional conservative ideology, let alone what's waiting for you over the next 30 years. The Republicans will now switch to authoritarians, but I suspect this is going to fail much sooner than the conservative (neoliberal capitalist and traditionalist) Republican party of the last 40 years.



We seem to be witnessing an erosion of the right in North America. First, Canada's Harper made a hard tack to the right, and got creamed by left-wing spending through the Liberals, the supposed "middle party".

Now we see the American right take a hard turn into weirdness, where promises aren't really promises, just elect Trump and let him run things 'cause he's rich. The question becomes what will the conservatives in the party do now? To get to the White House, it is noted, Trump will have to get every vote Romney did, and more. It thus becomes a matter of who is the least threatening to the status quo until the GOP figures out what it is.
 

clownboy

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I'm certainly not voting for Clinton, she's even worse than Trump. However Trump is wholly unfit to be president. It's just a matter of time before Trump's supporters have buyers remorse. How do conservatives position themselves to pick up the pieces?

Well, I think the vast majority of the disaffected will go through the stages of grief and reach acceptance. What the hell, they wanted an SSDD candidate anyway. The ones that are Trump supporters have no such burden. Face it, your image of the party isn't what most of the people in the party want this election. Even if it was, the candidates the anti-Trumpeteers want never give it to them anyway. It just words and slogans, and nothing positive gets done.
 

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"It's in the net, he scores!"


Good call. It's like they all have blindfolds and earplugs but keep howling at issues. Is it just me, or is Obama beginning to look good?
I never thought such words could leave your fingertips! :lamo

But you know, that may be true.

After 8 years of pissing about Obama and his Executive Orders, the GOP establishment and Congress Critters haven't seen Trump in action yet! Just this morning on Morning Joe, Trump claimed he was looking for a VP that could work with Congress so he could "legislate rather than rely on Executive Orders"!

Not sure if I got the quote exact, but the meaning is pretty accurate as I typed it above, I think.

He made it clear he wants to pass legislation! (which of course is the purview of Congress).

If he gets in, this might get Hella' interesting for the GOP. And do you doubt he won't work with the Dems and eschew the GOP, if the Dems can help him get his stuff across?
 

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Yes, Republicans helped with that, and then less than three years later totally abandoned blacks to the Southern strategy, and those same congressmen endorsed Nixon and his strategy, then waged a 50+ year continued propaganda war on the "black lifestyle" to gain votes for their neoliberal agenda. That does somewhat attenuate the point you're trying to make here, but that is a historically relevant point regarding both how parties have shifted 50 years ago and how the Democrats certainly cannot claim sole (or, honestly, generally even partial) credit for the success of the Civil Rights movement.

It is indeed astounding that Nixon's campaign was so short-sighted that he couldn't see the opportunity to hang the entire Democratic party on the racism of their "Solid South". As I've pointed out many times on DP, one of our neighbors in the MS Delta was U.S. Senator John O. Eastland, who was twice president pro tem, and was for a generation the most powerful racist in America...and he was a lifelong Democrat.

But then, hindsight is 20/20. Coulda/woulda/shoulda and all that.
 

Glen Contrarian

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I couldn't have said this better.

And just as importantly today, the GOP fostered and encouraged an environment where all these often fringe, aberrant, and even delusional ideas where accepted as normal everyday fact by their voters, spawning a fertile environment for a birther fast talker like Trump to come along and sway them away!

How can the GOP establishment claim Trump is crazy or B.S., when they fed their voters crazy & B.S. to the point that many can no longer discern crazy or B.S.? And viola: The establishment were defenseless against Trump!

Precisely! Well said!
 

FieldTheorist

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It is indeed astounding that Nixon's campaign was so short-sighted that he couldn't see the opportunity to hang the entire Democratic party on the racism of their "Solid South". As I've pointed out many times on DP, one of our neighbors in the MS Delta was U.S. Senator John O. Eastland, who was twice president pro tem, and was for a generation the most powerful racist in America...and he was a lifelong Democrat.

But then, hindsight is 20/20. Coulda/woulda/shoulda and all that.

I mean, the real nail in the coffin on this particular issue is when you point out that Earl Warren of the Warren court was a lifelong Republican, and was nominated to the SCOTUS by Eisenhower.
 

Fiddytree

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On the surface it's really simple: just act like he's not there. Run a campaign devoid of Trump, fixate on Hillary and Obama and how Guy or Gal Democrat is somehow connected to either of them.
 

Fiddytree

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It's kind of a fascinating thing to observe. The Trump supporters are sounding a whole lot like the Obama supporters of 8 years ago. The see nothing but a solution to all their problems in this guy and that certainly won't be the case.

I was rolling my eyes with the Obama campaign and his supporters, much like everyone else, but I think it's safe to say that Obama's supporters weren't nearly as scary or gullible. There's at least some reason to feel some measure of confidence in a former state Senator and a current Senator having some grasp on this whole politics, create bills, pass bills, vote on bills thing. ****, he practically said what I just said today about what he wants in his VP choice: I'd like someone who does this whole politics and leading stuff....and these whole draft bills and pass them thing. With a bar that low, it might be an upgrade to pick Michele Bachmann of all people, and she's busy trying to become the next Pat Robertson.

Did I feel this worried way 8 years ago? Nope. Have I found new depths for how even a one term Senator inspires confidence in the last 10 months? Oh, you are damn right I have.

This morning, I got my coffee and saw yet another athletics-connected white man endorse Trump and Jesus Christ was it tragic. The former Notre Dame football coach, in his old age, wants the whole world to know he supports Trump because he stayed at one of "his" hotels and played golf there once and it was really nice.

On one hand, you have to feel like slapping CNN's wrists for putting on a guy like that for some sort of endorsement, but you can't really do that either. For one thing, that's the quality of his supporters to begin with--that's his base. Secondly, Trump himself just last night was bragging about having Bobby Knight at his side. This is quintessential Trump. Eschew anything dealing with experience and knowing how to do something, because it's now a liability. Get the guy who coached people to throw a ball in the air for a couple hours every weekend...or maybe the one who threw chairs at kids on the court.
 
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Chomsky

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Well, I think the vast majority of the disaffected will go through the stages of grief and reach acceptance. What the hell, they wanted an SSDD candidate anyway. The ones that are Trump supporters have no such burden. Face it, your image of the party isn't what most of the people in the party want this election. Even if it was, the candidates the anti-Trumpeteers want never give it to them anyway. It just words and slogans, and nothing positive gets done.
Harsh, but True.

Since the Bush tax breaks for the wealthy (unfunded, at that!), I really can't think of anything substantial promised, that the establishment GOP have actually subsequently delivered to their voters. It seems to be a never ending cycle of whining, crying, and excuses, punctuated by symbolic votes that never go anywhere. I really don't see what anyone sees in the current incarnation of this party, except as you said: "words & lip-service".

Their consistent mantra seems to be "Stop, stop, stop" to everything, and now it even applies to their legit nominee! :lamo

I mean, think of it: The guy's on track to win in excess of the majority of the nomination delegates as reflective of the votes of their members, beating-out 16 other establishment preferred candidates; and their establishment response: "He's no Republican"! ""Stop, stop, stop" :lamo
 
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