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Hospitals consider universal do-not-resuscitate orders for coronavirus patients

Rogue Valley

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Hospitals consider universal do-not-resuscitate orders for coronavirus patients

Worry that ‘all hands’ responses may expose doctors and nurses to infection prompts debate about prioritizing the survival of the many over the one.

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3/25/20
Hospitals on the front lines of the pandemic are engaged in a heated private debate over a calculation few have encountered in their lifetimes — how to weigh the “save at all costs” approach to resuscitating a dying patient against the real danger of exposing doctors and nurses to the contagion of coronavirus. The conversations are driven by the realization that the risk to staff amid dwindling stores of protective equipment — such as masks, gowns and gloves — may be too great to justify the conventional response when a patient “codes,” and their heart or breathing stops. Northwestern Memorial Hospital in Chicago has been discussing a do-not-resuscitate policy for infected patients, regardless of the wishes of the patient or their family members — a wrenching decision to prioritize the lives of the many over the one. Richard Wunderink, one of Northwestern’s intensive-care medical directors, said hospital administrators would have to ask Illinois Gov. J.B. Pritzker for help in clarifying state law and whether it permits the policy shift. “It’s a major concern for everyone,” he said. “This is something about which we have had lots of communication with families, and I think they are very aware of the grave circumstances.” Officials at George Washington University Hospital in the District say they have had similar conversations, but for now will continue to resuscitate covid-19 patients using modified procedures, such as putting plastic sheeting over the patient to create a barrier. The University of Washington Medical Center in Seattle, one of the country’s major hot spots for infections, is dealing with the problem by severely limiting the number of responders to a contagious patient in cardiac or respiratory arrest.

Health-care providers are bound by oath — and in some states, by law — to do everything they can within the bounds of modern technology to save a patient’s life, absent an order, such as a DNR, to do otherwise. But as cases mount amid a national shortage of personal protective equipment, or PPE, hospitals are beginning to implement emergency measures that will either minimize, modify or completely stop the use of certain procedures on patients with covid-19. The most extreme of these situations is when a patient, in hospital lingo, “codes.” When a code blue alarm is activated, it signals that a patient has gone into cardiopulmonary arrest and typically all available personnel — usually somewhere around eight but sometimes as many as 30 people — rush into the room to begin live-saving procedures without which the person would almost certainly perish. “It’s extremely dangerous in terms of infection risk because it involves multiple bodily fluids,” explained one ICU physician in the Midwest, who did not want her name used because she was not authorized to speak by her hospital. Bioethicist Scott Halpern at the University of Pennsylvania is the author of one widely circulated model guideline being considered by many hospitals. Halpern’s document calls for two physicians, the one directly taking care of a patient and one who is not, to sign off on do-not-resuscitate orders. They must document the reason for the decision, and the family must be informed but does not have to agree.

Physicians in New York are facing this conundrum and the situation is bound to get worse.
 
Awful times we are entering.
 
Right wingers will soon accuse these hospitals of being Libruls trying to increase death numbers so it looks bad for Trump...
 
Right wingers will soon accuse these hospitals of being Libruls trying to increase death numbers so it looks bad for Trump...

And yet, here you are THE FIRST ONE TO BRING TRUMP UP......in a STATE issue.....

Surprising.
 
And yet, here you are THE FIRST ONE TO BRING TRUMP UP......in a STATE issue.....

Surprising.

The reason hospitals are in this mess is BECAUSE of Trump inaction and counter-action on controlling the spread. But as usual, Trump cult will find a way to make it the opposite.

And yeah, according to Trump and you people everything is a State issue. That's why states are in a crazy bidding war against each other AND against the federal government for the PPE, ventilators and other critical supplies instead of Federal government properly distributing the resources to where they are needed.
 
The reason hospitals are in this mess is BECAUSE of Trump inaction and counter-action on controlling the spread. But as usual, Trump cult will find a way to make it the opposite.

And yeah, according to Trump and you people everything is a State issue. That's why states are in a crazy bidding war against each other AND against the federal government for the PPE, ventilators and other critical supplies instead of Federal government properly distributing the resources to where they are needed.

Wrong!
WHO chief praises Trump’s coronavirus ‘leadership’
 
Yeah, who knew leadership meant refusing to provide ventilators because he doesn’t believe doctors and nurses on the front lines.

He didn't refuse to provide anything nor does he refuse to believe front line workers.

Donald J. Trump
@realDonaldTrump
Thousand of Federal Government (delivered) Ventilators found in New York storage. N.Y. must distribute NOW!

https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/1243566007605755904

Donald J. Trump
@realDonaldTrump
·
2h
We have just purchased many Ventilators from some wonderful companies. Names and numbers will be announced later today!

Trump: Auto Manufacturers Given OK to Produce Much Needed Ventilators


Bzzz, buzzzz goes the left's echo chamber. :giggle:
 
Last edited:
He didn't refuse to provide anything nor does he refuse to believe front line workers.

Donald J. Trump
@realDonaldTrump
Thousand of Federal Government (delivered) Ventilators found in New York storage. N.Y. must distribute NOW!

https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/1243566007605755904

Donald J. Trump
@realDonaldTrump
·
2h
We have just purchased many Ventilators from some wonderful companies. Names and numbers will be announced later today!

Trump: Auto Manufacturers Given OK to Produce Much Needed Ventilators


Bzzz, buzzzz goes the left's echo chamber. :giggle:

Is this true? If it is then the news should be reporting it, now....
 
He didn't refuse to provide anything nor does he refuse to believe front line workers.

Donald J. Trump
@realDonaldTrump
Thousand of Federal Government (delivered) Ventilators found in New York storage. N.Y. must distribute NOW!

https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/1243566007605755904

Donald J. Trump
@realDonaldTrump
·
2h
We have just purchased many Ventilators from some wonderful companies. Names and numbers will be announced later today!

Trump: Auto Manufacturers Given OK to Produce Much Needed Ventilators


Bzzz, buzzzz goes the left's echo chamber. :giggle:

"I don't believe you need 40,000 or 30,000 ventilators.”

- Donald J Trump

And by the way, somebody better tell him that thousands of ventilators weren’t mysteriously discovered in storage. They’re being stored until needed. And the federal government only provided New York with 4000 of them.
 
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"I don't believe you need 40,000 or 30,000 ventilators.”

- Donald J Trump

That number was used by Cuomo the new darling of the media not front line medical workers. As bad as it is in New York that projection is currently B.S.
 
That number was used by Cuomo the new darling of the media not front line medical workers. As bad as it is in New York that projection is currently B.S.

That number was provided to Cuomo by medical experts. But hey, keep going down the path of a State bidding war for a limited supply of ventilators. Blue States will beat out Red States every time and it’s Trump’s supporters who will perish.
 
"I don't believe you need 40,000 or 30,000 ventilators.”

- Donald J Trump

And by the way, somebody better tell him that thousands of ventilators weren’t mysteriously discovered in storage. They’re being stored until needed. And the federal government only provided New York with 4000 of them.

See post #13.
Context is very important.
Plus Cuomo appears to being under reporting the true numbers of ventilators on hand in storage.
 
See post #13.
Context is very important.
Plus Cuomo appears to being under reporting the true numbers of ventilators on hand in storage.

Cuomo isn’t underreporting anything. Trump is refusing to invoke the Defense Production Act and provide the necessary medical supplies and equipment. So New York is tens of thousands of ventilators short of anticipated need and it’s nurses are forced to wear garbage bags instead of gowns.
 
Last edited:
He didn't refuse to provide anything nor does he refuse to believe front line workers.

Donald J. Trump
@realDonaldTrump
Thousand of Federal Government (delivered) Ventilators found in New York storage. N.Y. must distribute NOW!

https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/1243566007605755904

Donald J. Trump
@realDonaldTrump
·
2h
We have just purchased many Ventilators from some wonderful companies. Names and numbers will be announced later today!

Trump: Auto Manufacturers Given OK to Produce Much Needed Ventilators


Bzzz, buzzzz goes the left's echo chamber. :giggle:

You still have not figured out that just because he tweets something it does not mean it's true, have you......
 
Cuomo isn’t underreporting anything. Trump is refusing to invoke the Defense Production Act and provide the necessary medical supplies and equipment. So New York is tens of thousands of ventilators short of anticipated need and it’s nurses are forced to wear garbage bags instead of gowns.

That's cause super genius Jared was convinced by corporations not to.....
After he posted his question on facebook of course :lamo:lamo
 
That number was provided to Cuomo by medical experts. But hey, keep going down the path of a State bidding war for a limited supply of ventilators. Blue States will beat out Red States every time and it’s Trump’s supporters who will perish.

I guess that is good news for me since I live in a "blue state". I find it sick and disgusting that someone would find glee in anyone perishing. You call yourself a moderate, I call your post really sad. Anyone hoping people with whom they do not agree should perish I do not believe should be on a debate site. After all it is to bring together folks who disagree!
 
Yeah, who knew leadership meant refusing to provide ventilators because he doesn’t believe doctors and nurses on the front lines.

Why didn't those hospitals start stocking months ago?
 
Cuomo isn’t underreporting anything. Trump is refusing to invoke the Defense Production Act and provide the necessary medical supplies and equipment. So New York is tens of thousands of ventilators short of anticipated need and it’s nurses are forced to wear garbage bags instead of gowns.

I provided links above which show you are making it up as you go along...Underneath the plastic bags they are wearing scrubs.

I'm done here until you stop with the embellishments.
 
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Why didn't those hospitals start stocking months ago?

Everyone's an expert.
Demand increases during times like these, esp when everyone wants what you want.
 
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