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Have the teabaggers been duped?

Have the teabaggers been duped?

  • Yes.

    Votes: 9 75.0%
  • No.

    Votes: 3 25.0%

  • Total voters
    12

Onion Eater

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Stephen Zarlenga said:
Infrastructure repair would provide quality employment throughout the nation. There is a pretense that government must either borrow or tax to get the money for such projects. But it is a well enough known, that the government can directly create the money needed and spend it into circulation for such projects, without inflationary results.

First, incorporate the Federal Reserve System into the U.S. Treasury.

Second, halt the banks privilege to create money by ending the fractional reserve system.

Third, spend new money into circulation on infrastructure, including education and healthcare.
Richard C. Cook said:
I worked with Steve [Zarlenga] on his first draft of the American Monetary Act. The time came when Steve and I began to meet with Congressman Dennis Kucinich, briefing him and others in Washington on monetary ideas.

So much has happened since then. So many more people have become aware of the evils of the debt-based monetary system. We have seen Congressman Ron Paul ignite a national wave of revulsion against the Federal Reserve System. There is now even hope that the American Monetary Act might be introduced on the floor of Congress.
Ron Paul said:
While a gold standard would be a wonderful thing, we shouldn’t wait for one before we end the Fed… An end to the money-creating power and a transfer of remaining oversight authority from the Fed to the Treasury would be marvelous steps in the right direction.
So we see that Ron Paul’s proposal is essentially the same as that of Stephen Zarlenga and his man in Congress, Dennis Kucinich. Like Paul, Zarlenga also believes that a gold standard is a wonderful thing, provided that it does not have to actually be implemented. Since Paul has no concrete plans for implementing a gold standard, he and Zarlenga are united in their desire to incorporate the Federal Reserve System into the U.S. Treasury as quickly as possible.

Click here to read the rest of my critique.
 

phattonez

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Printing money is not inflationary, just as starting a fire does not create smoke.
 

Onion Eater

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Printing money is not inflationary, just as starting a fire does not create smoke.
Tea Party shills string their blue-collar followers along with child-like analogies. But, as the OP makes clear, the Tea Party is actually working in Congress to gain passage of Stephen Zarlenga's American Monetary Act.

And Zarlenga is a straight-out socialist, as this quotation should make clear:

Stephen Zarlenga said:
They [professional economists] are saying that one of the main causes that facilitated the problem – the notion of so called free market ideology – must still reign unchallenged. This while the only reason anything is still standing in their ridiculous financial world is because of our government...

There's that old destroyer again – "Free market principles." Its their heavy artillery in the class warfare those who these people represent are committed to. You see how desperate they are to bolster this ideology.
"Two-faced" is the kindest word that I can think of for such people.
 

phattonez

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If you can't face the argument of someone, just make them out to be someone that they're not and beat down that straw man. It never fails.
 

Onion Eater

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someone that they're not
It's a verbatim quotation.

Richard C. Cook said:
I worked with Steve [Zarlenga] on his first draft of the American Monetary Act. The time came when Steve and I began to meet with Congressman Dennis Kucinich, briefing him and others in Washington on monetary ideas.

So much has happened since then. So many more people have become aware of the evils of the debt-based monetary system. We have seen Congressman Ron Paul ignite a national wave of revulsion against the Federal Reserve System. There is now even hope that the American Monetary Act might be introduced on the floor of Congress.
Cook has no doubts about which side Paul is on. This is because he is paying attention to Paul's actions, not his words. The legislation that Ron Paul is promoting in Congress is very different than the two-faced reports that he is sending back to the teabaggers.
 

Onion Eater

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This guy mostly agrees with me.

Grupp said:
What I want to suggest is that the New World Order is deliberately false-flag-attacking the Fed in order to ultimately destroy it, leaving the perception of a void in the financial world, wherein they will fill that void with THEIR choice of a new banking and money system: global currency, global bank, global governance/government
For clarity, he should refer to his adversaries as "believers in the debt-virus theory." Invoking the New World Order just makes him look like a conspiracy theory nut.

But the false-flag operation that he speaks of is very real. The believers in the debt-virus theory are conducting a false-flag operation when they call themselves "Austrian" and rally the Austrian's teenage followers around the slogan "End the Fed."

Classical Austrians never endorsed incorporating the Federal Reserve System into the U.S. Treasury. Two years ago I critiqued Stephen Zarlenga's debt virus theory here and Montagne's bizarre variation here. There is no reason to repeat that material now just because Ron Paul has joined Zarlenga and his man in Congress, Dennis Kucinich.
 

Helvidius

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It's a verbatim quotation.



Cook has no doubts about which side Paul is on. This is because he is paying attention to Paul's actions, not his words. The legislation that Ron Paul is promoting in Congress is very different than the two-faced reports that he is sending back to the teabaggers.
Paul is being a realist. He can never get the corrupt members of Congress to agree to abolish the fed. HR1207 is meant to audit the federal reserve. Personally, I would like to see the Fed abolished completely. The audit the fed bill failed to pass when a number of members of Congress who claimed to support the bill ultimately voted against it.
 

Onion Eater

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HR1207 is meant to audit the federal reserve.
I am more concerned about Paul's support for the American Monetary Act.

Richard C. Cook said:
I worked with Steve [Zarlenga] on his first draft of the American Monetary Act. The time came when Steve and I began to meet with Congressman Dennis Kucinich, briefing him and others in Washington on monetary ideas.

So much has happened since then. So many more people have become aware of the evils of the debt-based monetary system. We have seen Congressman Ron Paul ignite a national wave of revulsion against the Federal Reserve System. There is now even hope that the American Monetary Act might be introduced on the floor of Congress.
 

ARealConservative

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6 votes in a month.

5 are probably sock puppets, but even not, it shows the relative worth the dp market puts on this op.
 

Missed AB

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S Like Paul, Zarlenga also believes that a gold standard is a wonderful thing, provided that it does not have to actually be implemented...
The gold standard is wonderful when gold is rising in actual value. The gold standard is horrible when gold is deflating in value. As people have pointed out the problems in fractional banking, how does one resolve the problem of your bank account being worth 2 ounces of gold, when gold just went down in value?

The government will either have to decrease the amount in your bank account to reflect the accurate money supply, or buy more gold.

Just a thought, but what is the advantage of a gold standard? Consider our currency is already worth non-precious metals. Every dollar you have is backed by your ability to easily exchange the paper for coins. An ounce of nickel is worth about 60 cents if raw, or 2 dollars in the coin form.
 

rathi

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The gold standard is wonderful when gold is rising in actual value. The gold standard is horrible when gold is deflating in value. As people have pointed out the problems in fractional banking, how does one resolve the problem of your bank account being worth 2 ounces of gold, when gold just went down in value?
Actually the opposite is true. In our consumer credit economy, deflation is the real killer. If gold had been our currency in 1980 when it increased its value by 50% in one year, the economy would have imploded.
 

Onion Eater

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I personally do not support a return to the gold standard and have outlined some of my reasoning in Gold Does Not Have Intrinsic Value, a summary of a debate I had in 2008.

However, the point of this thread is not to promote my personal beliefs but to investigate whether or not the teabaggers have been duped.

And, clearly, they have been. The typical blue-collar, high-school-educated teabagger believes that he is promoting a return to the gold standard while his leaders, like Ron Paul, are actually working to push Zarlenga's American Monetary Act through Congress.

Sen. Jim DeMint said:
If there's anything worse than a secret Federal Reserve, it's Congress controlling it.
I agree. And I believe that everybody on Debate Politics, regardless of their views on the relative merits of a gold standard or the Federal Reserve, can agree that the teabagger's actual plan, having the Treasury print whatever money Congress asks for, is far worse than either a gold standard or the Federal Reserve.

That is how the Continental Congress operated and the expression "not worth a Continental" is still used over two centuries later to denote things that are worthless.

A lesson we should never forget!
 
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ARealConservative

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the tea party is a bottom up movement, not top down.

when people talk about it's leaders, it shows they don't actually get the tea party.
 

Missed AB

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Actually the opposite is true. In our consumer credit economy,deflation is the real killer.
What is it called when assets such as gold go down in value? That's right, deflation. So how ist he opposite true when the example I described the problems when gold deflates in value :/

Maybe you are under the mis-impression that if our money is worth more, and consumers are able to buy things at cheaper prices, somehow that decreases their ability to pay back debts???
 
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Onion Eater

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the tea party is a bottom up movement, not top down.

when people talk about it's leaders, it shows they don't actually get the tea party.
If you have a seat in Congress, as Ron Paul does, then you are a leader.

If you have a spot on the sidewalk to stand at the demonstration, then you are a follower.
 

Missed AB

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... The legislation that Ron Paul is promoting in Congress is very different than the two-faced reports that he is sending back to the teabaggers.
Is there a reason you need to name call to help make your point? Is it possible you are not an objective voice in this discussion and you will never see any point presented contrary to your opinion as a viable alternative?
 

FederalRepublic

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If you have a seat in Congress, as Ron Paul does, then you are a leader.

If you have a spot on the sidewalk to stand at the demonstration, then you are a follower.
Ron Paul is not a leader of the tea parties. In fact, I think he's just a little on the crazy side. I don't believe I've heard more than a couple of people even mention the gold standard. We have other more pressing things to worry about at the moment...
 

ReverendHellh0und

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Is there a reason you need to name call to help make your point? Is it possible you are not an objective voice in this discussion and you will never see any point presented contrary to your opinion as a viable alternative?



Dont worry about it. It just makes them look foolish to use a vulgar name for us. They are not interested in discussion and they purposefully and dishonestly misrepresrnt who we are becaused. They are scared ****less and know they already lost.
 

friday

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So we see that Ron Paul’s proposal is essentially the same as that of Stephen Zarlenga and his man in Congress, Dennis Kucinich. Like Paul, Zarlenga also believes that a gold standard is a wonderful thing, provided that it does not have to actually be implemented. Since Paul has no concrete plans for implementing a gold standard, he and Zarlenga are united in their desire to incorporate the Federal Reserve System into the U.S. Treasury as quickly as possible.

Click here to read the rest of my critique.
Considering you call them the derogatory term "teabaggers", I can't take this post seriously or vote on it. Try cleaning it up and trying again.

As far as the Fed and the gold standard, we need to audit the Fed. It is the most profitable bank in the US and half of its balance sheet is TARP. As far the gold standard, gold is a commodity. Tying the dollar to it will only momentarily increase the illusion of our currency's value.
 

Missed AB

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As far the gold standard, gold is a commodity. Tying the dollar to it will only momentarily increase the illusion of our currency's value.
Gold is just as much a fiat currency as the US note. The only reason gold has value is because we give it value... just like the USD.
 

ARealConservative

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Gold is just as much a fiat currency as the US note. The only reason gold has value is because we give it value... just like the USD.
I'm speechless. never considered the possibility anyone could be this ignorant. congrats
 

Missed AB

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I'm speechless. never considered the possibility anyone could be this ignorant. congrats
a quick google search...

But what about gold as a store of value. It is difficult to mine so it can't be created out of thin air, as being the case with paper fiat currencies. It is durable. It can't be debased, as the actual gold content can be determined. Even with all that going for it, there really isn't much in the way of intrinsic value, other than the small amount used in industry and for jewelry. The value of gold is really set by supply and demand. Traders riding trends have a big say in how high or low gold can go.

Is Gold Another Fiat Currency?
 
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