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Has Hamas Helped or Benefited Palestinians in any way?

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If so, how?

Obviously I don’t think so. In fact, I think they’ve made things far worse for Palestinians and that’s been true even well before they provoked this war with Israel.
 
Is this becoming the new standard to side-step Israel wholesale killing plenty of Palestinians in an effort to hit Hamas?
 
They kept Palestine relevant and in the news. But not in a good way.
 
Is this becoming the new standard to side-step Israel wholesale killing plenty of Palestinians in an effort to hit Hamas?
Things would be far better for everyone if Israel wasn’t under constant threat of terrorism.
 
Of course not. They're openly dedicated to exterminating all Jews and destroying Israel. They can't so they settle for simply killing them to provoke a response, knowing that rather naive idealists sitting at a distance will ignore what Hamas did and its mission to focus solely on the fact that because Hamas bases itself around the densest civilian areas, responding to terrorist attacks will kill Palestinians.

They have always diverted aid of all kinds, whether it's fuel, food, cash, anything away from the Palestinians who chose them as their government.

They indoctrinate Gazan children from the moment they learn to read with the most virulently anti-semitic swill, knowing that a combination of that and the first thing I mentioned guarantees that they can actually recruit more Palestinians by intentionally getting the Palestinians killed.

You can't meaningfully negotiate with them because they do not recognize Israel as a state with a right to exist. You can't simply give Palestinians a state and say "there, now play nice", because there is no reason to think they wouldn't just elect Hamas again and continue the cycle.




Hamas does nothing but bring misery to the region. And Israel has to fight Hamas no matter what a 'morally superior' left-lean westerner thinks because if a Jew knows anything it's that nobody ever comes to save us unless it's by pure accident and way too late for it to accomplish much of anything anyway (ie, WWII, which we wouldn't have fought if Japan hadn't bombed us and Germany declared, and the Holocaust).

Israel doesn't have the luxury of the Westerner-at-a-distance; the person who takes the position that Israel should just accept that Hamas is going to kill Israeli Jews.

Is this becoming the new standard to side-step Israel wholesale killing plenty of Palestinians in an effort to hit Hamas?

Are you under the impression that by saying that and only that in context of this thread, you are somehow *now* side-stepping wholesale Hamas's mission, Hamas's constant terror attacks ever since its foundation, the 10/7 massacre, and its promises of future massacres?

Because that's exactly what every single person whose only analysis is "omg, look at all the dead civilians and Hamas terrorists, Israel shouldn't fight"; who only ever say "Israel is going too far" ...


...without ever - not once on this board, at least - attempting to formulate a detailed plan of action in which Israel does get to use deadly force against Hamas and articulate why it would actually work.



Those who have tried to morally brow-beat me on issue side-step all that to the end. Their view is apparently that the Israeli Jews should just accept their lot and let Hamas do what it will. In the name of "fighting apartheid" of course. In fact, they don't even talk about Hamas.
 
Given their ideology, and the history of their governance of Gaza over the last two decades? No.

Hamas is a militant Islamist terrorist organization that violently resists the existence of Israel and (prior to 2017) called for the murder of Jews in its charter. That is a nonstarter, and ultimately harms the Palestinians who bear the brunt of Israel's retaliations in response to Hamas attacks.
 
Things would be far better for everyone if Israel wasn’t under constant threat of terrorism.
You obviously don't understand that the aggressor is rogue state Israel (Much worse than Hamas), a fanatic colonialist group. Your argument is like saying Native Americans would have been better off if they didn't attack invading cavalry, because 'everyone would be better off if the US wasn't under constant threat'. The region would be better off if IT wasn't under constant threat from the colonialists.
 
Hamas is a militant Islamist terrorist organization that violently resists the existence of Israel and (prior to 2017) called for the murder of Jews in its charter. That is a nonstarter, and ultimately harms the Palestinians who bear the brunt of Israel's retaliations in response to Hamas attacks.

It's sad that the pro-genocide people are so bad, that you deserve a compliment for getting one thing right, that Hamas is not trying to 'kill Jews' the update to the charter in 2017. Now, how about you note as I understand Likud has never changed ITS charter which calls for ethnic cleansing - control - of the entire region with no land for Palestinians, or get right who is the attacker and who is retaliating.
 
You can't meaningfully negotiate with them because they do not recognize Israel as a state with a right to exist. You can't simply give Palestinians a state and say "there, now play nice", because there is no reason to think they wouldn't just elect Hamas again and continue the cycle.

The problem with this argument is that Fatah, who control the West Bank, does recognise Israel's right to exist and doesn't launch rockets at Israel, but Israel continues to build settlements in the West Bank, continues to steal land, continues to restrict freedom of movement, continues to restrict access to water.

So even if Hamas did turn round and recognise Israel's right to exist, I doubt it would change much judging by Israel's attitude to Fatah.

You also ignore the fact that Israel doesn't recognise Palestine's right to exist either.
 
It's sad that the pro-genocide people are so bad, that you deserve a compliment for getting one thing right, that Hamas is not trying to 'kill Jews' the update to the charter in 2017. Now, how about you note as I understand Likud has never changed ITS charter which calls for ethnic cleansing - control - of the entire region with no land for Palestinians, or get right who is the attacker and who is retaliating.
The thread was explicitly about whether Hamas has helped the Palenstinians, so that's what I responded to.
 
The thread was explicitly about whether Hamas has helped the Palenstinians, so that's what I responded to.

That was clear already. I responded to your comments.
 
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