Greece promise more cuts; wants €120 Billion!

[mbig]

Down to last minute on Yes or no for aid and the Number has reached a Staggering €120 Billion.
Whatever happened to 20-30 Billion? 45 billion?
Can Greece deliver THAT amount of austerity on it's already balking citizens?

Greece to announce more spending cuts to get aid - Yahoo! Finance
Greece to announce new round of deep spending cuts in return for EU-IMF aid package
Demetris Nellas, Sunday May 2, 2010, 12:05 am

ATHENS, Greece (AP) -- Greece will announce a new round of sweeping spending cuts through 2012, just hours before an emergency meeting of euro-zone finance ministers Sunday that is expected to approve the EU's contribution to an international loan package worth about euro120 billion ($159 billion) over the next three years.

The socialist government's negotiations with representatives from the European Union and the International Monetary Fund, which had begun on April 21, went down to the wire and were not finalized until shortly after 9 p.m. (1800 GMT, 2 p.m. EDT) Saturday.

Prime Minister George Papandreou's Cabinet will meet 9:30 a.m. (0630 GMT, 2:30 a.m. EDT) Sunday to approve the measures. Finance Minister George Papaconstantinou will announce the measures immediately afterward and then depart for Brussels where the 16 euro-zone finance ministers will meet at 4 p.m. (1400 GMT, 10:00 a.m. EDT).

The measures are expected to include further hikes in consumer taxes, and deeper cuts in pensions and public service pay. The EU and especially the IMF also demand a significant overhaul of the civil service.

The government will submit special emergency legislation to Parliament that was agreed upon with the EU and the IMF at Saturday's negotiating session. The Parliament is expected to approve the measures by Friday.

Furious unions Oppose the measures which they have called Disastrous and a serious rollback of employee rights. Tens of thousands of demonstrators, including an estimated 17,000 in Athens, protested during annual May Day demonstrations Saturday against what they portrayed as Greece's capitulation to the IMF.....

 

[Djoop]

Ah, only 120 billion. Maybe we (the dutch) can give em ABN-AMRO. According to our government that's at least 50 billion worth, considering they invested that amount to save it.

 

[mbig]

I think Mykonos, Santorini, and the Cycladic islands... could probably bring 30-40 mil in the foreclosure sale.
Add in garnishing the revenues historic sites like the Acropolis.. we could cut the needed amount in half.

Seriously tho, this just means reversing the Greek lifestyle/public-jobs/pensions money that was never really paid or accounted for.
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[Djoop]

I think Mykonos, Santorini, and the Cycladic islands... could probably bring 30-40 mil in the foreclosure sale.
Add in garnishing the revenues historic sites like the Acropolis.. we could cut the needed amount in half.

Seriously tho, this just means reversing the Greek lifestyle/public-jobs/pensions money that was never really paid or accounted for.
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They can spend less or tax more, or both. I would certainly not increase sales tax atm.

 

[Ahlevah]

Can Greece deliver THAT amount of austerity on it's already balking citizens?

No. They'll keep coming back for more restructuring and loans until the IMF finally throws in the towel and cuts off the spigot. Then Greece will really default. And what about the 500 pound gorilla in the room? Spain?

 

[Lord Tammerlain]

No. They'll keep coming back for more restructuring and loans until the IMF finally throws in the towel and cuts off the spigot. Then Greece will really default. And what about the 500 pound gorilla in the room? Spain?

The IMF though does not have much money left to lend out.

So the Greeks will have no choice but to go along with the austerity program.

If the dont, they wont get next years funding. The IMF is doing the same thing to Pakistan right now, it is withholding an amount of money because it did not follow through on some issues it was supposed to

I expect the concern of IMF imposed austerity drove the Ukraine into the gas/naval base deal with Russia

 

[mikhail]

apprantly they have lifted retirement age from 53 to 67

 

[Ahlevah]

The IMF though does not have much money left to lend out.

That's why I expect to see IMF bankers making the rounds again to various capitals, hats in hand. Washington will be the first stop.

So the Greeks will have no choice but to go along with the austerity program.

Sure they have a choice. They can do what Argentina did and tell the IMF to go screw itself after they max out their MasterCard. Argentina had a currency board tied to the U.S. dollar, but it defaulted six months after it chucked it. At some point Greece will chuck the Euro when it figures out it can't afford it, both in monetary terms and riots.

Greece and the Fatal Flaw in an IMF Rescue

If the dont, they wont get next years funding.

Yup, you're right: Just like the guy who stiffs MasterCard, they won't get any more loans. But at least there are no more payments. And Greece will probably not default immediately. This could go on for years.

This Time Is Different: A Panoramic View of Eight Centuries of Financial Crises

 

[1984]

apprantly they have lifted retirement age from 53 to 67

They plan to raise the retirement age by two years (61 to 63) by the year 2015.

Greece Raises Retirement Age by Two Years | Global Insolvency

 

[C. Gerstle]

The retirement age should be 67 at least.

The euro will be saved, and after this whole thing is over, either a European Monetary Fund or a European Treasury will be created. That is, either the Union will create a fund to help EU members in financial trouble, life the IMF, or the Union will create a joint European fiscal policy, making the EU government responsible for fiscal decisions made in Europe. That means the tax-and-spend policies will be made in Brussels/Strasbourg, not Paris, Berlin, Madrid, Rome, and certainly not Athens.

To me, EU fiscal integration seems like the best option. Nations in the EU today have gone past the point of no return as far as European unification (which is the only thing the EU can be called) is concerned, so simply dropping the euro is nat an option, and the idea of an EMF will only encourage more fiscal irresponsibility in the Mediterranean states. That leaves the European Treasury, which may sound politically distastful, but seems to be the best option.

 

[PeteEU]

Retirement age in Greece is 65 like it is in most of Europe. What was different was retirement age of civil servants, which was low as hell. That is being pushed up to the standard retirement age now.

 

[whoknows]

Look, look, Russians are discussing who is guilty and what to do with Greeks!
As always.