Federal judge blocks mandates for healthcare workers

[Helix]

There are a lot of things I am against dragging on year after year but you know what I don't have control over those either.
As most liberals go, you don't care about what anyone thinks as long as fits into your idea of what every one else should be doing.

You still don't have the courage to support your position and say lets start with all of those that are receiving monthly government checks. Until you are able to push for that, don't expect me to get on board with a mandate that puts another burden on businesses. 75% of all deaths from Covid have been from people over the age of 65. What is common about the group above 65? Most are not in the work force to begin with.

Believe whatever you like.

 

[upsideguy]

There are a lot of things I am against dragging on year after year but you know what I don't have control over those either.
As most liberals go, you don't care about what anyone thinks as long as fits into your idea of what every one else should be doing.

You still don't have the courage to support your position and say lets start with all of those that are receiving monthly government checks. Until you are able to push for that, don't expect me to get on board with a mandate that puts another burden on businesses. 75% of all deaths from Covid have been from people over the age of 65. What is common about the group above 65? Most are not in the work force to begin with.

Ah, they are expendable, eh?

25% are in the workforce. 25% of 800,000 is 200,000. Anything that led to the deaths of 200,000 Americans in a year would be crisis of epic portions necessitating action. The absurdity, however, is how you dismiss the other 75% as if they are less than as if their lives do not matter. This is a segment of the population that helped build this country to what it is today. They have paid their taxes and rendered their due to our economy. They are a vulnerable segment of the population that are due and have earned protection. Forgive me for having trouble with the absurdity of your rather inhumane position. I am sure you were a delight to speak with at Thanksgiving.

That all said, the sheer absurdity of not requiring healthcare workers to adhere to basic healthcare protocol in the middle of the deadly pandemic (with yet another mutation of this hitting our shores, the lethality thereof we do not yet know).... well, anyone that thinks this is a reasonable decision by this judge .... well, I question your judgement.

 

[Relsdm]

Did "chemicals" kill nearly 800,000 Americans in the last 19 months? Are they being spread by workers to other workers? That right wing judge was spouting the propaganda that covid is not a threat to life and will be called on it.

Covid is not a work place specific issue. If this standard starts getting applied to everything, where does it stop?

 

[Relsdm]

Believe whatever you like.

I believe in the freedom to make choices. I chose to get vaccinated but I do not believe in forcing others to be if they do not wish to be.

 

[911Sparky]

Develop a vaccine that is 100% effective.

You mean develop an imaginary vaccine, since a 100% effective vaccine has never existed.

 

[Relsdm]

Ah, they are expendable, eh?

25% are in the workforce. 25% of 800,000 is 200,000. Anything that led to the deaths of 200,000 Americans in a year would be crisis of epic portions necessitating action. The absurdity, however, is how you dismiss the other 75% as if they are less than as if their lives do not matter. This is a segment of the population that helped build this country to what it is today. They have paid their taxes and rendered their due to our economy. They are a vulnerable segment of the population that are due and have earned protection. Forgive me for having trouble with the absurdity of your rather inhumane position. I am sure you were a delight to speak with at Thanksgiving.

That all said, the sheer absurdity of not requiring healthcare workers to adhere to basic healthcare protocol in the middle of the deadly pandemic (with yet another mutation of this hitting our shores, the lethality thereof we do not yet know).... well, anyone that thinks this is a reasonable decision by this judge .... well, I question your judgement.

Never said anyone is expendable.

However, this is not a work place issue that OSHA should be involved in to begin with.
Anyone that feels the need to get vaccinated has the option to go do that. Maybe if this is the cure all that everyone is claiming they should do a good enough sales job to convince everyone they should be vaccinated.

Are you for abortion? If the answer is yes, then don't come at me with any comment about inhumane position.

You bring up healthcare workers. What would have been your position if they said we don't have a vaccine for covid so we are not going to go to work until we do?
I have the utmost respect for what healthcare workers have been through and the service they provided. Now you want to tell them that since you don't want to get vaccinated now you are going to lose your job? How humane is that?

 

[Relsdm]

You mean develop an imaginary vaccine, since a 100% effective vaccine has never existed.

That is why I believe mandates should never be enacted. I am not against the vaccine, just the mandate.

 

[poweRob]

You didn't answer my question. Where in the Constitution does it specify the time limit on executive powers?

 

[iguanaman]

Sorry Iguana, but if you are going to lie about every single issue on every single topic, I can't justify responding to you any more. DM me if you think you can post differently.

When OSHA called covid a "grave threat" what did you think that meant?

Covid is not a work place specific issue. If this standard starts getting applied to everything, where does it stop?

It will stop when everyone gets vaccinated and covid will no longer be a disease that clogs our ICU's and morgues. How else? Like a fine Supreme Court Justice said over 100 years ago. when ruling on vaccine mandates for smallpox....

The liberty secured by the Constitution of the United States to every person within its jurisdiction does not import an absolute right in each person to be, at all times and in all circumstances, wholly freed from restraint. There are manifold restraints to which every person is necessarily subject for the common good. On any other basis organized society could not exist with safety to its members. Society based on the rule that each one is a law unto himself would soon be confronted with disorder and anarchy.

https://www.americanbar.org/groups/...n-has-been-constitutional-for-over-a-century/

 

[Helix]

I believe in the freedom to make choices. I chose to get vaccinated but I do not believe in forcing others to be if they do not wish to be.

Thanks for sharing. Peace.

 

[Rawley]

When OSHA called covid a "grave threat" what did you think that meant?

That's not OSHA, that is the statute.

 

[iguanaman]

That's not OSHA, that is the statute.

And a disease that will likely kill 800,000 Americans in 24 months is not a "grave threat" I suppose. That is the most desensitized death cult opinion I have ever heard. It is more dead than we suffered in all the wars of the 20th century FYI.

 

[Relsdm]

It will stop when everyone gets vaccinated and covid will no longer be a disease that clogs our ICU's and morgues. How else? Like a fine Supreme Court Justice said over 100 years ago. when ruling on vaccine mandates for smallpox....

Same way the flu is no longer a threat?

Also, my question about where it will stop had nothing to do with covid. That was all about government overreach.

 

[Rawley]

And a disease that will likely kill 800,000 Americans in 24 months is not a "grave threat" I suppose.

close to twice as many die from heart disease every year.

 

[iguanaman]

close to twice as many die from heart disease every year.

That is a lie 800,000 is 50% more than die from heart disease. But that makes the added covid deaths OK to you? What are you? The grim reaper?

Heart disease is the leading cause of death for men, women, and people of most racial and ethnic groups in the United States. One person dies every 36 seconds in the United States from cardiovascular disease. About 659,000 people in the United States die from heart disease each year—that's 1 in every 4 deaths.

https://www.cdc.gov/heartdisease/fa...out 659,000 people in the,1 in every 4 deaths.

 

[Relsdm]

And a disease that will likely kill 800,000 Americans in 24 months is not a "grave threat" I suppose. That is the most desensitized death cult opinion I have ever heard. It is more dead than we suffered in all the wars of the 20th century FYI.

That is about the same number as the number of abortions each year. Guess that is a desensitized death cult?

 

[Rawley]

And that makes the added covid deaths OK to you? What are you? The grim reaper?

You want people to die of heart attacks? Takes a special kind of heartless monster to want that.

 

[OpportunityCost]

Yeah, I don't think so. You've offered lots of excuses to oppose mandates that have nothing to do with the intricacies of the balance of powers.

More to the point, your read on the issue is incorrect. To wit...


The Executive can issue orders as broad as they want -- as long as Congress already delegated those powers via legislation to the Executive, and the rules are followed. And guess what? They did.


The law is clear: The Secretary of Health can declare a 90-day emergency, and renew them as long as the emergency is ongoing. Since Congress passed those laws, HHS is merely exercising those powers. The same goes for the OSHA regs.

Congress can change that at any time.

Nah, bullshit. Just because the legislature does not pass laws a party wants doesn't mean the President gets to issue EOs. He has delegated powers, no more, no less. Since when are Democrats for unlimited Presidential power?

OSHA was NEVER intended to be able to make a vaccine mandate. OSHA was never intended to make orders that dictated the health care choices of the entire nation. Its beyond their scope and intent. HHS you could make the case for with renewals occurring through Congress.

The problem is that it took 2 months to draft something as an emergency measure that could have passed through Congress in that same time frame---making a mockery of the emergency nature of the order, which is what the judge pointed out.

 

[iguanaman]

Same way the flu is no longer a threat?

Also, my question about where it will stop had nothing to do with covid. That was all about government overreach.

Covid is not the flu. It is 10 times as deadly and 10 times as contagious as the flu. Mandatory vaccinations for deadly contagious diseases in America started with George Washington. You are in the wrong country,

 

[SCrider]

Develop a vaccine that is 100% effective.

No vaccine is 100% this one is better than most.

 

[iguanaman]

Nah, bullshit. Just because the legislature does not pass laws a party wants doesn't mean the President gets to issue EOs. He has delegated powers, no more, no less. Since when are Democrats for unlimited Presidential power?

OSHA was NEVER intended to be able to make a vaccine mandate. OSHA was never intended to make orders that dictated the health care choices of the entire nation. Its beyond their scope and intent. HHS you could make the case for with renewals occurring through Congress.

The problem is that it took 2 months to draft something as an emergency measure that could have passed through Congress in that same time frame---making a mockery of the emergency nature of the order, which is what the judge pointed out.

OSHA was passed by Congress to protect the health and safety of American workers. Mandating vaccines when required is most certainly part of that protection. Had the insurrection party not made covid a political football all the States would have taken care of mandating the vaccine as they all have in past epidemics and the OSHA mandate would not have been required. Someone has to be the adult in the room and take action to protect this country from further bloodshed from a preventable disease.

 

[iguanaman]

That is about the same number as the number of abortions each year. Guess that is a desensitized death cult?

Abortions are not killing anyone. Covid is and the deaths are preventable.

 

[Relsdm]

Abortions are not killing anyone. Covid is and the deaths are preventable.

So if an abortion is not performed the fetus does not become a person? Abortion is 100% certain death and are completely preventable, covid has mortality rate under 2% in the US and even if vaccinated is not 100% preventable.
Maybe you should rethink what you believe to be inhumane and what is not.

 

[iguanaman]

So if an abortion is not performed the fetus does not become a person? Abortion is 100% certain death and are completely preventable, covid has mortality rate under 2% in the US and even if vaccinated is not 100% preventable.
Maybe you should rethink what you believe to be inhumane and what is not.

Human beings are not parasites and a woman can make the choice to remove the clump of cells from her body. You have no right to stop her either. Maybe you should start caring about living breathing human beings instead of being obsessed with something you have no control over. Adopt one the the 1000's of unwanted children that already exist instead of trying to get more of them born. It's sick.

 

[Hamish Howl]

Covid is not a work place specific issue. If this standard starts getting applied to everything, where does it stop?

Ideally, with everyone being vaccinated.