• Please read the Announcement concerning missing posts from 10/8/25-10/15/25.
  • This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

Fauci fears a COVID variant worse than Delta

Read the link I provided and pay close attention to the following:

“Alpha (B.1.1.7) – First identified in the United Kingdom in late 2020…”

“Beta (B.1.351) – This variant, which was first detected in October 2020…”

“Delta (B.1.617.2) – Initially identified in India in late 2020…”

And, of course, Lambda which was initially identified in Peru in 2020.
Late 2020...well after they started developing the vaccines. I didnt see any data discussing their quantification for prioritization.

We were distributing the vaccine in late 2020.
 
Late 2020...well after they started developing the vaccines. I didnt see any data discussing their quantification for prioritization.

We were distributing the vaccine in late 2020.
The first vaccination in the United States was on December 14, 2020. All of the variants I noted were identified before then. So, as I said, they didn’t account for the variants.
 
The first vaccination in the United States was on December 14, 2020. All of the variants I noted were identified before then.
And when did development of the vaccinations begin?

Hint: the vaccines were already under development when The Donald declared Operation Warp Speed ~May 15, 2020.
 
And when did development of the vaccinations begin? And when were the emergency approvals?
Emergency use authorization still hasn’t been granted for all age groups and none of them are fully approved yet. But if your standard is only some people then that would be December 11th 2020 for the Pfizer vaccine, December 18th 2020 for the Moderna vaccine, February 27th 2021 for the Johnson & Johnson vaccine, and never for the AstraZeneca vaccine. And, of course, it was a long time before doses were available for the large scale rollout.
 
Emergency use authorization still hasn’t been granted for all age groups and none of them are fully approved yet. But if your standard is only some people then that would be December 11th 2020 for the Pfizer vaccine, December 18th 2020 for the Moderna vaccine, February 27th 2021 for the Johnson & Johnson vaccine, and never for the AstraZeneca vaccine. And, of course, it was a long time before doses were available for the large scale rollout.
Look at you, scrambling way off topic. Re-read my post.
 
Look at you, scrambling way off topic. Re-read my post.
How is answering your questions off-topic? You asked me when the emergency use authorizations were issued and I told you.
 
How is answering your questions off-topic?
You're not. How could the pharma companies have included the Delta variant in their research and development before May 2020 when it was only recognized *according to you* in late 2020?
 
You're not. How can the pharma companies be including the Delta variant in their research and development before May 2020 when it was only recognized *according to you* in late 2020?
Not a single dose had been administered when the variants were discovered. But since everyone was so desperate for something - anything - it didn’t really matter that there were four other variants floating around that hadn’t been accounted for.
 
Not a single dose had been administered when the variants were discovered. But since everyone was so desperate for something - anything - it didn’t really matter that there were four other variants floating around that hadn’t been accounted for.
??? So...when were they supposed to research the Delta variant for the vaccine for Operation Warp Speed (promised by end of 2020)...when it was only discovered (according to you) late 2020?

What did you think they were working on all those months for the vaccine? Please be specific to let us know you actually understand what goes into vaccine research and development.
 
??? So...when were they supposed to research the Delta variant for the vaccine for Operation Warp Speed (promised by end of 2020)...when it was only discovered (according to you) late 2020?

What did you think they were working on all those months for the vaccine? Please be specific to let us know you actually understand what goes into vaccine research and development.
Clinical trials are one of the ways you determine that. And, unfortunately, those didn’t start happening with the variants until 2021. This was always going to be a problem with rushing and administering an experimental drug. Lots of unknowns because corners were cut for political reasons.
 
Clinical trials are one of the ways you determine that. And, unfortunately, those didn’t start happening with the variants until 2021. This was always going to be a problem with rushing and administering an experimental drug. Lots of unknowns because corners were cut for political reasons.

So then what failure where you referring to here, which is what prompted our conversation?

Just for clarity - both Delta and Lambda variants were discovered in December 2020. So these just represent a failure of the pharmaceutical companies to account for them in their development of vaccines.
 
So then what failure where you referring to here, which is what prompted our conversation?
The failure is that nobody studied the effectiveness of the vaccines on these variants until after they were authorized and administered. A vaccine with comprehensive effectiveness isn’t something you develop at “Warp Speed.”
 
The failure is that nobody studied the effectiveness of the vaccines on these variants until after they were authorized and administered. A vaccine with comprehensive effectiveness isn’t something you develop at “Warp Speed.”
How is that a failure? Please explain. You said Delta was discovered in Dec. 2020. The vaccine was already being distributed in Dec 2020. How could they have studied it before that?
 
How is that a failure? Please explain. You said Delta was discovered in Dec. 2020. The vaccine was already being distributed in Dec 2020. How could they have studied it before that?

Are you really trying to argue that not doing the clinical trials on all of the known variants was okay?
 
Are you really trying to argue that not doing the clinical trials on all of the known variants was okay?
They had emergency approval Dec. 11, 2020 and were distributing it in Dec 2020...which is when you said they discovered Delta.

Are you really trying to argue that they should have researched something they didnt know existed?
 
They had emergency approval and were distributing it in Dec 2020...which is when you said they discovered Delta.

Are you really trying to argue that they should have researched something they didnt know existed?
They knew it existed in December. They knew two others existed in August and October.
 
They knew it existed in December. They knew two others existed in August and October.
Are you really trying to argue that they should have researched something they didnt know existed?
 
Are you really trying to argue that they should have researched something they didnt know existed?
Stop being obtuse. They knew it existed in December and they knew two others existed in August and October. You’re grasping at straws.
 
Stop being obtuse. They knew it existed in December and they knew two others existed in August and October. You’re grasping at straws.

So then they should have NOT released the vaccines that have saved so many lives in Dec? They should have waiting until they researched the new variants? Taking more months? Yes or no?

And how about now? We know that there will be new variants. Should they STILL be waiting until we know ALL the variants that might crop up? Yes or no?
 
So then they should have NOT released the vaccines that have saved so many lives in Dec? They should have waiting until they researched the new variants? Taking more months? Yes or no?

And how about now? We know that there will be new variants. Should they STILL be waiting until we know ALL the variants that might crop up? Yes or no?
Yes, they should have done the due diligence in clinical trials instead of shrugging their shoulders at the entire continent of South America and sub-continent of India.
 
Yes, they should have done the due diligence in clinical trials instead of shrugging their shoulders at the entire continent of South America and sub-continent of India.
Thank you. Your stated position is that the vaccine developers failed (your word) in creating the vaccines and should have waited until we knew all the possible variants.

Meaning we'd still have no vaccines today and hundreds of thousands in the US, millions in the world, would have died.

OK, I think we're done here. I'm glad that you clarified your position.
 
Thank you. Your stated position is that the vaccine developers failed (your word) in creating the vaccines and should have waited until we knew all the possible variants.

Meaning we'd still have no vaccines today and hundreds of thousands in the US, millions in the world, would have died.

OK, I think we're done here. I'm glad that you clarified your position.
No, you’re just being deliberately obtuse because your ignorance of the facts was exposed. The Delta and Lambda variants were known in December and none of the developers bothered to study them in clinical trials. As a consequence, they’re ravaging India and South America. But I guess getting your white people shot is more important to you. You’re dismissed.
 
Back
Top Bottom