Examples of cultural appropriation - should all this - and more - be prohibited? (1 Viewer)

[Rumpel]

Here are some examples:

The necktie or cravat was derived from a scarf worn by Croatian mercenaries fighting for Louis XIII,[65] and the brightly colored silk waistcoats popularised by Charles II of England were inspired by Turkish, Indian and Persian attire acquired by wealthy English travellers.[66]

During the Victorian era, the British aristocracy appropriated traditional Highland dress after the forced removal of the indigenous population during the Highland clearances. Tartan was given spurious association with specific Highland clans after publications such as James Logan's romanticised work The Scottish Gael (1831) led the Scottish tartan industry to invent clan tartans[67] and tartan became a desirable material for dresses, waistcoats and cravats. In America, plaid flannel had become workwear by the time of Westward expansion, and was widely worn by Old West pioneers and cowboys who were not of Scottish descent.[68] In the 21st century, tartan remains ubiquitous in mainstream fashion.

More:

Cultural appropriation - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

What do you think about cultural appropriation?

 

[Mycroft]

Here are some examples:



More:

Cultural appropriation - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

What do you think about cultural appropriation?

shrug...

I see nothing wrong with it.

 

[spud_meister]

You got any examples of people calling for waistcoats to be "prohibited"?

 

[Rumpel]

2 out of 2 now say:

the prohibition of cultural appropriation does not make this world a better place​

 

[TheParser]

It is a non-issue.

Activists, who are unable to get a real job, constantly need to manufacture problems to keep the pot boiling.

Then they can continue to have a nice office, receive "donations," and appear on TV.

 

[Rumpel]

I see nothing wrong with it.

Neither do I.

 

[spud_meister]

Neither do I.

You would also like to see the EU's Protected designation of origin legislation done away with?

 

[btthegreat]

Never understood this cultural appropriation as a problem to resolve. Most of the time, it results is a clash of culture, some rather tacky or off-putting fake that benefits no one; but then again its also how culture historically travels across the artificial and arbitrary borders of society, feeding creativity and reinvents and imagines old ideas.

 

[ttwtt78640]

Imitation is the most sincere form of flattery.

 

[j brown's body]

A pretty good article about what's good and bad about it.

The Dos and Don'ts of Cultural Appropriation

Borrowing from other cultures isn’t just inevitable; it’s potentially positive.

www.theatlantic.com

 

[Rumpel]

but then again its also how culture historically travels across the artificial and arbitrary borders of society, feeding creativity and reinvents and imagines old ideas.

Exactly!
Ever since there have been different cultures, there have been mutual exchanges between these cultures.
And now all of a sudden this should be a bad thing and prohibited?

 

[Rumpel]

You would also like to see the EU's Protected designation of origin legislation done away with?

That is an altogether different matter, as you probably know.

 

[btthegreat]

Exactly!
Ever since there have been different cultures, there have been mutual exchanges between these cultures.
And now all of a sudden this should be a bad thing and prohibited?

But there is this distinction
Cultural appropriation[1][2] is the inappropriate or unacknowledged adoption of an element or elements of one culture or identity by members of another culture or identity.[3][4][5] This can be especially controversial when members of a dominant culture appropriate from minority cultures.[1][6][7] According to critics of the practice, cultural appropriation differs from acculturation, assimilation, or equal cultural exchange in that this appropriation is a form of colonialism. When cultural elements are copied from a minority culture by members of a dominant culture, and these elements are used outside of their original cultural context – sometimes even against the expressly stated wishes of members of the originating culture – the practice is often received negatively.[8][9][10][11][12]

Cultural appropriation is considered harmful by various groups and individuals,[13] including Indigenous people working for cultural preservation,[14][15] those who advocate for collective intellectual property rights of the originating, minority cultures,[16][17][18][19] and those who have lived or are living under colonial rule.[1][20][21][19] Cultural appropriation can include exploitation of another culture's religious and cultural traditions, dance steps, fashion, symbols, language, and music

 

[Rumpel]

Imitation is the most sincere form of flattery.

I agree!

 

[Rumpel]

You got any examples of people calling for waistcoats to be "prohibited"?

Good question!
If you set PC people on that track, they will be grateful to find a new field where to work.

The sombrero has already been prohibited at some university:

In Mexico, the sombrero associated with the mestizo peasant class was adapted from an earlier hat introduced by the Spanish colonials during the 18th century.[74] This, in turn, was adapted into the cowboy hat worn by American cowboys after the US Civil War.[74] In 2016, the University of East Anglia prohibited the wearing of sombreros to parties on campus, in the belief that these could offend Mexican students,[37] a move that was widely criticized.

Cultural appropriation - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[Rumpel]

One example:

Student union bans 'racist' sombreros​

Student union officials at the University of East Anglia have banned a Mexican restaurant from handing out sombreros to students, branding the marketing stunt racist.

The high-crowned straw hats had been given to students at a freshers’ fair in Norwich by staff from Pedro’s Tex Mex Cantina, a Mexican-themed restaurant in the city.

Union officials took them away from new students, according to reports, and told restaurant workers the hats breached a policy forbidding stallholders from handing out materials including “discriminatory or stereotypical imagery”.

Student union bans 'racist' sombreros

University of East Anglia student union officials accused of hypocrisy after taking Mexican hats away from new students

www.theguardian.com

"racist ....."

Who would have thought that this could be called "racist"?

 

[Rumpel]

There is debate about non-black people wearing dreadlocks – a hairstyle many associate with African and African diaspora cultures such as Jamaican Rastafari – and whether them doing so is cultural appropriation.[101] In 2016 a viral video was published of a young black student arguing with a young white student and accusing him of cultural appropriation.[102] In 2018, white actor Zac Efron was accused of cultural appropriation, when he posted a picture of himself in dreadlocks.

Cultural appropriation - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

In Germany a non-Carribean singer has lost a job because she was wearing dreadlocks.
Now I wonder whether this imitation of a US-American prohibition might not be a "cultural appropriation" in itself?

 

[Rumpel]

Now there is also some kind of a backlash:

There is debate regarding whether or not non-European or non-European-descended people wearing blonde wigs or straightening their hair is cultural appropriation, specifically within the African-American community.

Cultural appropriation - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[HK.227]

But there is this distinction
Cultural appropriation[1][2] is the inappropriate or unacknowledged adoption of an element or elements of one culture or identity by members of another culture or identity.[3][4][5] This can be especially controversial when members of a dominant culture appropriate from minority cultures.[1][6][7] According to critics of the practice, cultural appropriation differs from acculturation, assimilation, or equal cultural exchange in that this appropriation is a form of colonialism. When cultural elements are copied from a minority culture by members of a dominant culture, and these elements are used outside of their original cultural context – sometimes even against the expressly stated wishes of members of the originating culture – the practice is often received negatively.[8][9][10][11][12]

Cultural appropriation is considered harmful by various groups and individuals,[13] including Indigenous people working for cultural preservation,[14][15] those who advocate for collective intellectual property rights of the originating, minority cultures,[16][17][18][19] and those who have lived or are living under colonial rule.[1][20][21][19] Cultural appropriation can include exploitation of another culture's religious and cultural traditions, dance steps, fashion, symbols, language, and music

Not much of a distinction, I'm sorry to say.

The quoted piece basically describes a legitimate grievance of disrepect and hints at making it a legal issue, but then offers zero thoughts or ideas on how to distinguish between disrespectful and sincere imitation. Therefore this line of thought might shortly find itself on a path of petty indignation that ends with the attempt to ban any new trend in culture, fashion, or ideas that has foreign roots. Closeminded, bigoted, and worst of all, boring.

While I can appreciate minorities not laughing at their customs being made a mockery of, people who want to fight for this cause really need to get a fix on the above issue if their plans for justice include not being seen as just another bunch of holier-than-thou jerkwads.

 

[Rumpel]

Tyrolean hat​

The Tyrolean hat (German: Tirolerhut, Italian: cappello alpino), also Bavarian hat or Alpine hat, is a type of headwear that originally came from the Tyrol in the Alps, in what is now part of Austria, Germany, Italy and Switzerland. It is an essential and distinctive element of the local folk costume, or tracht.

Tyrolean hat - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

I wonder how long it will take until wearing a "Tirolerhut" outside the Alps counts as racist.

 

[Rickeroo]

Now there is also some kind of a backlash:

Cultural appropriation - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

The concept of appropriation is dependent on the superior/inferior dynamic. 'Reverse appropriation' (where Blacks wear blond wigs) is theoretically possible but extremely unlikely. When a white wears dreads, the outrage stems first from white identity - colonialist, successful, majority, opressor, etc. The white takes on the appearance of an oppressed, unsuccesful minority. Appropriation deems that the white is making fun of the minority and rubbing the minority's nose in it.

Take a king that dresses like a peasant - he's not going to be well liked. In theory, one could claim that a peassant dressing like a king would be 'appropriating', but it would have very little traction. The opressed-opressor dynamic must exist and is only a one way street in order to understand what is popularly meant by 'appropriation'.

 

[maquiscat]

Here are some examples:



More:

Cultural appropriation - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

What do you think about cultural appropriation?

More often than not, the cry of cultural appropriation comes not from the culture "appropriated" from. It comes from busybodies who then try to tell the other culture that they don't know what best for them. I remember a certain high school girl who wore a Chinese dress, a cheongsam IIRC, and a whole lot of outrage by white people, but Chinese people were chiming in saying how much they loved it. I also remember some black girl trying to forcefully cut off a white kids dreadlocks, crying "cultural appropriation". Thing is, the kid was of Scandinavian descent, and deadlocks were a part of their culture, especially among the Vikings. In fact, there is not a culture out there, IIRC, that hasn't had dreadlocks as part of their history.

The worst part of it is too many of the people who cry "appropriation" don't understand the difference between that and cultural assimilation. If they truly believed that cultural appropriation, as they define it, was wrong, then they would have to get rid of at least half if not more of their Christmas traditions.

 

[Rumpel]

Appropriation deems that the white is making fun of the minority and rubbing the minority's nose in it.

That may be the case with that black-facing in those minstrel shows.

But that example should not lead to a general prohibition of all kinds of a mutual exchange of cultures.
Until in the end non-Scottish persons are forbidden to drink any whisky made in Scotland.
And Scottish persons are forbidden to drink any non-Scottish beer.

 

[maquiscat]

One example:

Student union bans 'racist' sombreros​

Student union bans 'racist' sombreros

University of East Anglia student union officials accused of hypocrisy after taking Mexican hats away from new students

www.theguardian.com

"racist ....."

Who would have thought that this could be called "racist"?

If the stall owners were Mexican, wouldn't they be the ones who would have the say as to whether it was racists or appropriation?

 

[Rickeroo]

That may be the case with that black-facing in those minstrel shows.

But that example should not lead to a general prohibition of all kinds of a mutual exchange of cultures.
Until in the end non-Scottish persons are forbidden to drink any whisky made in Scotland.
And Scottish persons are forbidden to drink any non-Scottish beer.

I agree - there are various levels of appropriation - Blackface being of the highest order. But all of it comes from a place of guilt. Appropriation is in the same class as changing street names to MLK Blvd - a performative stretch to atone for racial disparity.