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European leaders unite behind Ukraine following Trump-Zelenskyy confrontation

dobieg said:
Europe is led by a host of fascists who can hardly be described as Democratic. They stiffle the free speech of their citizens under threat of imprisonment and use gestapo tactics such as branding political opposition as hate groups and using that as a means to keep them under constant investigation.

They might not be anywhere close to Putin but they're moving in his direction.
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You call them fascists, and yet MAGA wants a foreign policy that will lead to them militarizing themselves and becoming a bigger influence on the world stage. I don't get it.
 
dmpi said:
This is how it should be. Euorpe, Ukraine, and Russia are the REAL stakeholders. Rare earth deal is just something Trump threw in to try to make something happen. To Me Z and Putin are one in the same. Giant egos and fight to the death using other people's money and lives. US got involved early on to prevent Ukraine from getting overrun, but after the stalemate Biden and his followers were played like a fiddle to keep this war going on indefinitely. The rest is history.
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Isolationism is a proven failed policy.

Trump’s intention to betray the long tradition of American world leadership is disloyal and pathetic.

Putin plays him like a violin.

All the more shameful because Trump debased himself before the world by behaving like a petulant little bully on a playground.

Even more so because they planned it in advance. They betrayed zukraine on live global tv.

And Trump kissed Putin’s ass in the process.

Un American. Betrayal of everything we tell the world we stand for.
 
trumptman said:
This is proper foreign policy. This is not "I"m a teenager throwing a tantrum" policy.

Just because Dad said so doesn't mean he loves Mom or sister more than you. Just go clean your room and stop being an ass.

Just because Trump has expectations of Ukraine doesn't man he loves Russia.

Emotional manipulation isn't done by grownups. Trump wanted a mineral deal. The lack of deal and Zelensky losing his his mind doesn't mean Russia gave him a mineral deal or that now he "loves Putin."

Math is real. The numbers have to add up.
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Originally, the talks were between trump and Putin.
Zelensky was to not be involved.

And this meeting was not about ending any war. It was about a minerals deal. Which seems to have fallen through.

So, I've seen nothing from trump about ending the war and keeping Ukraine free and democratic.

Unless your heard something where US will continue to help Ukraine and end the war with a free Ukraine. That does not seem to be a trump goal at this time.
Especially since the minerals deal is not moving forward.
 
Allan said:
Once the torch is passed its hard to get it back.

Your next POTUS might very well be Vance. The rest of the world has to be prepared for the fact that America might be a Russia ally for quite a long time.
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You mean a Russian stooge.
 
RaleBulgarian said:

European leaders unite behind Ukraine following Trump-Zelenskyy confrontation​

Because Traitor Trump (along with his shit for brains VP) made complete asses of themselves, again embarrassing decent Americans.

Traitor Trump isn’t working at all to aid in settling the ongoing war started by his idol, Putin.

Traitor Trump is attempting to do in politics what he has done throughout his crooked business life; take advantage of/exploit others weaknesses for his own personal gain.
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Maybe Zelensky should think outside the box by offering some of his precious minerals to China and Zi, they are the one other country aside from the US to bring Russian aggression to an end. China could certainly use the minerals, and without China purchasing Russian oil, Putin's war effort will be degraded more than it is. China could even provide the security guarantees that Ukraine needs. While I would hate to see China getting those materials, it would serve trump right for being a dick. Maybe the threat of losing those materials would bring trump to his senses.
 
TomFitz said:
Isolationism is a proven failed policy.

Trump’s intention to betray the long tradition of American world leadership is disloyal and pathetic.

Putin plays him like a violin.

All the more shameful because Trump debased himself before the world by behaving like a petulant little bully on a playground.

Even more so because they planned it in advance. They betrayed zukraine on live global tv.

And Trump kissed Putin’s ass in the process.

Un American. Betrayal of everything we tell the world we stand for.
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Four years of puppet Biden and Trump is the one that gets played?! We're only one month into Trumps term, seem like people got some mighty high expectations for Trump. At least he's working the problem. More than I can say about Biden and the Democrats. All they did was squandered our money, whine about rich people, and celebrate men who were women and women who were men.
 
Callen said:
Trump wants to end the war in Russia's favour. He wants Ukraine to cede their lands. Trump could have ended the war by siding with Ukraine but for some reason he favours Putin.
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The U.S. government, led by Trump, is actively working toward ending the war, prioritizing a negotiated settlement over our ongoing military support.

What's Canada doing? Banging the Russia, Russia, Russia drum? I know a few of their citizens are.
 
dairyair said:
Originally, the talks were between trump and Putin.
Zelensky was to not be involved.

And this meeting was not about ending any war. It was about a minerals deal. Which seems to have fallen through.

So, I've seen nothing from trump about ending the war and keeping Ukraine free and democratic.

Unless your heard something where US will continue to help Ukraine and end the war with a free Ukraine. That does not seem to be a trump goal at this time.
Especially since the minerals deal is not moving forward.
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If you haven't seen anything from Trump about ending the war, then you haven't listened to a single word he has said.

“It’s amazing what comes out through emotion, and I have determined that President Zelenskyy is not ready for Peace if America is involved, because he feels our involvement gives him a big advantage in negotiations,” Trump continued. “I don’t want advantage, I want PEACE. He disrespected the United States of America in its cherished Oval Office. He can come back when he is ready for Peace.”
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If you are reading that and thinking "warmonger" then you must be one of the four remaining MSNBC viewers.
 
gbg3 said:
They have yet to find ANY new tactics. The old tried (and failed) narratives are very ingrained.

One thing you don't see from any of them, is even a suggestion of what they DO think should be worked on in terms of Ukraine - their own plan different from Trump's. They have not one idea or suggestion as to how the war can end or how the war can potentially be won by Ukraine. That might be taken as they just want it to go on as it has been because they've made no other suggestions or offered no other ideas.
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IF they don't like Trump's plan, let's see theirs as we head toward a fourth year of an unwinnable war.
 
sanman said:
Sometimes you guys say "Russia collapsing! Collapsing tonight!"
Then at other times you say "Mighty Russian military will be rolling tanks into DC if not stopped!"

You just blow hot-n-cold according to whatever mood strikes you in the moment.
What a scam.


Russia could send hardware like missiles and warplanes to others America doesn't like -- why should America provoke it into doing so?


Trump is doing what's best for Ukraine -- Zelensky doesn't understand that.
Trump is trying to end the war ASAP which will save lives. That's the best thing, whether Zelensky recognizes it or not.
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Zelensky will likely come to his senses and agree to PEACE. If he's not done fighting, get the EU, Canada, Australia to fund his war.
sanman said:
Biden was a soft-headed warmonger.
Trump is a tough man of peace.
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Your last point cannot be emphasized enough!
 
exoplanet said:
Well, the pressure is on right now. Trump has been the biggest change since the end of the Cold War. Now Europe is fighting a very similar struggle.

The biggest issue is that it's not just Trump. America can't be trusted anymore. Even if a rational US President served next, who knows when the next Trump will be elected? Decades of reliability and trust have been flushed down the toilet.

America has no real allies anymore. Just mercenary contracts and rivals.
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I share this view, because all of our allies have to think about this from a long term perspective, and people like Trump are elected by people who hold his world view as well.
 
sanman said:
Zelensky did this stunt on purpose, he came there with an intent to pull a stunt like this on TV.
Just like when John Acosta would act up on Trump during his press conferences, it was always a pre-planned pre-meditated thing.
Zelensky planned this. But his plan was wrong.
His globalist advisors must have told him to ditch this treaty with Trump, just like Boris Johnson told him to reject that peace settlement with Russia -- entirely to the detriment of Ukraine.
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Samman:

You have no proof of this and are just spreading unfounded speculation as either misinformation or more likely disinformation. Unless you have access to President Zelensyy's mind and those of his staff and the minds of Mr. Trump and Mr. Vance there is no way you could know this. So post proof or as they say put up or shut up. Now you are on the globalist bugbear train too I see. Welcome to the cult which rejects proof and depends on spiraling gossip and hearsay to define what is truth.

Saying "must have told him" is not proof its speculation and profoundly irresponsible when human lives hang in the balance. Please grow up and stop telling tails out of school. It's bad form and expected from the first form.

Evilroddy.
 
trixare4kids said:
Zelensky will likely come to his senses and agree to PEACE. If he's not done fighting, get the EU, Canada, Australia to fund his war.

Your last point cannot be emphasized enough!
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Britain and others in Europe (and elsewhere), have already declared their full support for Ukraine; including measures such as scrapping 'foreign aid' projects in order to release funding for strengthening our military. In the meantime that half-witted simpleton you call a 'president', has thrown in his lot with America's and Europe's long-standing enemy, Russia. America has lost any remaining trust it had, has openly declared friendship with the worst authoritarian dictators, and is well on the way to becoming a pariah state, distrusted by all, while the champagne corks are popping in the Kremlin and Trump's 'word' remains as worthless as Putin's.
 
dmpi said:
Four years of puppet Biden and Trump is the one that gets played?! We're only one month into Trumps term, seem like people got some mighty high expectations for Trump. At least he's working the problem. More than I can say about Biden and the Democrats. All they did was squandered our money, whine about rich people, and celebrate men who were women and women who were men.
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Did Trump end the war in "24 hours, with just a phone call"? See, you make outrageous claims and promises and people will have those high expectations-like his promise to eradicate your national debt which resulted in him increasing it by several trillions, his idiotic tariff fixation which you, the consumer, will end up paying for and be all the poorer , and his promise that Mexico would pay for his vanity project border wall. With a long string of utter failures trailing behind him, who but a blithering idiot would place any faith in him?
That's what you voted for.
 
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trumptman said:
If you haven't seen anything from Trump about ending the war, then you haven't listened to a single word he has said.



If you are reading that and thinking "warmonger" then you must be one of the four remaining MSNBC viewers.
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I never listen to what he says. He never says much.

So, if you listen to him, spill it. What is the deal on the table to end the war and Ukraine to remain free and democratic.

I would thought you would have shared that, instead of stating I havent' listened to trump.

I bet you won't post any war ending talks.
For you had to deflect to MSNBC. I never watch any 24/7 reality tv shows masquerading as news channels. They don't give news, they spin it. Just like fox lies does.
 
gbg3 said:
Ukraine has the right and the option to keep fighting. And all countries who want to support the continuation of the war (their end goal or realistic expectation, I'm not hearing) have the option of continuing, upping, or beginning their support.

Trump sees ending the war as the better (and only realistic and reasonable) path. Zelensky is under no obligation to agree with Trump. Trump is not interested in being an enabler to an endless and unwinnable war.

Your second sentence is just an example of your personal strong anti-Trump feelings and your willingness to join in on the newest narrative - which has been instantly and already very overused to the ridiculous point. Just like the exact same late campaign attempt. It's completely anti-productive to either any end to the war or a continuation of the war. It's just another obsessive get Trump endeavor which has the potential of looking entirely stupid in the not too far future. It could end up in yet another backwards step to a currently VERY weak Dem party. Dems can't even think straight due to swimming in their anti-Trump fury and loss of control they had grown so accustomed to.
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If other countries want to give Zelensky what he wants, security guarantees, by all means they can put their troops on the ground. The United States is out. C'mon Europe and Canada, put up or shut up.
 
trumptman said:
So theey're going to stand behind it for WWIII, troops and money or are they going to stand behind it by giving tweets full of platitudes?
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What is this WW3 crap you lot spew constantly? Who do you think the combatants would be? Who are Russia's allies? Besides North Korea.
Maybe America would fight beside Russia against NATO, is that what you mean?
'WW3' is just a meaningless term that low-functioning rightists love to say. Kind of like 'open borders'.
 
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gbg3 said:
You can "want to end the war" but you can't strike a deal with Putin and Zelensky without Putin involved. We're well into this war now with 3 years and over a million lost lives. The usefulness of calling Putin "a dictator who started the war" in the midst of an effort to bring the war to a negotiated end - escapes me.
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Of course, but you know why this is, don't you?
Because at the end of the day, they still cannot get over the fact that their team is not in power.
Nothing, and I mean NOTHING Trump does will suit the butthurted anti-Trumps. Let them play their meaningless Putin card.
 
gbg3 said:
That's fine for those who already have or choose to take that view of Trump. (I'm referring to your second paragraph.)

If Zelensky doesn't want anything to do with Trump's plan to end the war, Trump will step out of this mix and your first sentence in the quote above will play out to whatever end it can.
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Yeah, if they don't like the peace deal, let's see theirs. ;)
 
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