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Does fact checking discriminate against conservatives?

What direct evidence do you have? I'm sorry, but with almost everything being a lie, I have to see actual proof. Your word is not good.

edit add.

I have searched for what you refer to, and find nothing.

Link please.
This is one of the worst cases of revisionist history I've ever heard. Manafort admitted handing over voter data to a Russian agent. We all know every detail about the meeting in Trump tower. And the republican led senate report (Rubio chairman) confirmed at least 100 contacts between the campaign and Russia. There were convictions of Trumpers who lied to the FBI. The republican led FBI.

And you're claiming here there is no proof. 🤷‍♀️
 
Do you believe Trump cannot get Mr. Garcia back from El Salvador? A really simple example. Anyone fact checking this knows damn well it's a lie. He can force colleges to do what he wants, he can force legal firms to do what he wants, he can surely tell the president of a tiny little broke country to do what he wants, especially since he's paying the guy to do his dirty work.
You see... The answer is anything you want. He can force anybody to do anything. We're talking opinions here, not facts. That's why 'fact checking' is essentially useless.
 
What direct evidence do you have? I'm sorry, but with almost everything being a lie, I have to see actual proof. Your word is not good.

edit add.

I have searched for what you refer to, and find nothing.

Link please.
Sure. Let's start by defining "collusion." It just means to cooperate, sometimes (but not always) in a clandestine manner, to attain less-than-honorable ends. Collusion need not attain its ends to qualify as collusion. With that in mind, all three of the instances I cited are de facto collusion. Here you go:

Item 1. Trump asked Russia to find Hillary Clinton's missing emails. That same day, Russia began operations to hack Hillary Clinton's personal and campaign related emails. One of those was successful, and resulted in a raft load of private emails within the Clinton campaign being published online. The right-wing media spun a lot of those emails to make them appear to say things they didn't really say, damaging the Clinton campaign. Trump asked Russia to do something illegal, Russia accommodated his request--they cooperated, and for less-than-honorable ends. I was watching that news conference live when it was broadcast by C-Span. It's a textbook case of collusion between Trump himself and Russia.




Item 2. The Trump Tower meeting between Donald Trump Jr. and Natalia Veselnitskaya. Donald Trump Jr. released the email exchange leading to the meeting, from which it was clear that he took the meeting to receive "dirt" on Hillary Clinton. Veselnitskaya wanted promises in return that Trump Jr. was not willing to give, so the dirt was never delivered, but that doesn't really matter as to collusion--that is, that the end sought by Trump Jr. did not manifest is irrelevant to whether it's an instance of collusion. Veselnitskaya was, we now know, a Russian agent (and Trump Jr. knew she was working for the Kremlin at the time he took the meeting, though he likely thought she was just an attorney and not also a spy). Again, it meets the definition--a highly placed member of the Trump campaign cooperated with a foreign agent to achieve a less-than-honorable end.


Item 3. Paul Manafort admitted to sharing Trump campaign internal polling data with Konstantin Kilimnik, who is suspected of being a Russian intelligence officer (making him a step above Ms. Veselnitskaya in terms of the Russian intelligence services rank). He was later convicted on charges of tax evasion, for which the evidence of him sharing the data and receiving payment for it was brought up at his trial. The jury convicted him, so apparently, they believed it, but Manafort himself admitted to having shared the data in an interview. He claimed it was "old news" but it was, in fact, from only two weeks prior to his contact with Kilimnik. Again, a de facto case of collusion--we know the Russians were using targetted messaging on social media to help Trump, and this data would have helped them understand how to refine and strengthen their efforts.


As far as I can tell, the repeated claims that collusion was a "hoax" relies on the fact that Trump was never charged with a crime in connection to any of this. Bill Barr squashed the Mueller investigation and refused to prosecute Trump, though it seems clear the Trump fired Jeff Sessions and hired Barr for precisely that reason (i.e. to avoid being charged). However, collusion itself is not a crime--it merely ought to be. Try to imagine your reaction if Biden had been in any of these situations with, say, China. If, for example, it was revealed that a top Biden campaign official took a meeting with a Chinese spy to get dirt on Trump, even if that dirt were not delivered. Trump supporters would be (rightly) outraged...but that has a consequence as to the behavior that Trump and members of his campaign engaged in and how we ought to judge it.
 
This is one of the worst cases of revisionist history I've ever heard. Manafort admitted handing over voter data to a Russian agent. We all know every detail about the meeting in Trump tower. And the republican led senate report (Rubio chairman) confirmed at least 100 contacts between the campaign and Russia. There were convictions of Trumpers who lied to the FBI. The republican led FBI.

And you're claiming here there is no proof. 🤷‍♀️
So someone says. I have searched and found no links pertaining to what you claim.

Link please.

What I find with Manafort happened in 2014.

What the hell are you talking about?

I think you are believing more lies.
 
What do you think is the reason for this?
Racism, discrimination against the other.
I have a hard time believing it is the oft-quoted white supremacy issue,
Racism has as many levels of expression as there are differences between human thought. White supremacy is an extreme form, I don't know why you would cite such an extreme form other than to try to minimize the existence of racism. It is like saying if we don't have NAZI's marching in the street, liberals fear of extremist rightwingers is overblown.
since asians are paid more that white on average.
Asians have existed in the US for a long time, yet Asians were not being lynched in significant numbers, ergo something must be wrong with Blacks....
There must be some prevailing pattern other than skin color that accounts for this I would suspect
You are searching for a characteristic of the individual to account for their lack of achievement, and when you are predisposed to not consider racism....well....it must be again a problem with the class of individuals, not the environment they exist in.

"Fundamental attribution error"
... or the country could indeed be racist against only black people,

that's a definite possibility I suppose. Anyway, thoughts?

You know that is an absurd position, even individual Canadians enslaved First Nations people, racism in the US is not limited to Blacks, every ethnicity has experienced discrimination in the US. The US govt committed genocide against First Nation peoples, they still experience discrimination. I could get into all kinds of stories about the discrimination I witnessed against my GF's growing up in AZ, but thats anecdotal.

The level of acceptance of an individual by a group is so multifaceted, but the basic concept is how many characteristics of that individual align with the group. As a species we are so visually oriented, and skin color is such a obvious marker of difference. Even within Black culture, darker colored individuals are discriminated. I think the level, the extremism, is a learned behavior, hate is taught within a culture and within families.
 
And women get paid less than men.

Is it fair. No but it is our reality.
You are describing discrimination, it is made manifest in different levels depending on the level of animosity held by the dominate group.
 
You see... The answer is anything you want. He can force anybody to do anything. We're talking opinions here, not facts. That's why 'fact checking' is essentially useless.
This is bullshit.

Fact checking exists to make certain that the information being shared is correct. It stops GQP scum from telling lies to brainwash the hordes of racists who vote for them.
 
So someone says. I have searched and found no links pertaining to what you claim.

Link please.

What I find with Manafort happened in 2014.

What the hell are you talking about?

I think you are believing more lies.
Post #154 explains a good part of it. If you're denying any of that is true, then there is no point in continuing this. You're in the CULT. Drowning in the Trump Cool-Aid.

Just on the Manafort issue here is an entire page and then some of proof.

 
Post #154 explains a good part of it. If you're denying any of that is true, then there is no point in continuing this. You're in the CULT. Drowning in the Trump Cool-Aid.

Just on the Manafort issue here is an entire page and then some of proof.

-Media- articles are far from any truth.

What does this have to do with president Trumps part?
 
And for several years they told us there was no basis for thinking Covid came out of the Wuhan lab. Ooops, got that wrong didn't they. How about the Trump Russian Collusion hoax? They missed on that one too. Wait, the Hunter Biden laptop was Russian disinformation? Nope it was really Hunter's laptop. Oh, and the Joe Biden is fit as a fiddle and a cognitive dynamo behind closed doors. So with the record of these high profile claims why should we trust these "fact checkers"?
:ROFLMAO:
And this is EXACTLY why your side is held in such low regard. Literally EVERY argument you expressed above....is patently false.

NO:
  • "they" didn't "get it wrong" about origin of the Covid-19 virus. The FACT is that almost ALL of the science still points toward an animal vector (likely racoon dogs, to be precise) as the most like source. In FACT, not ONE scientific body supports the Wuhan lab conspiracy theory. The ONLY source that does, is the CIA which issues a "low confidence" assessment to that effect 4 days AFTER Trump was inaugurated again this past January
  • "they" didn't "miss" on the "Russian Collusion hoax", either. The FACT is that the Mueller Report states EMPHATICALLY that "Russian Collusion" was a REALITY in the 2016 election. Of course, the MAGA crowd (like you) never actually READ the damn thing. Hence their persistent ignorance.
  • "Hunter Biden's Laptop"?....that, too, was a MAGA hoax. And you know it. You and I both know you cannot point to ONE thing in that ridiculous conspiracy theory that proved accurate (must less substantive)
  • Biden's competence?....Lol, Biden had a few shortcomings, but his being "incompetent" was a media narrative, not a medical reality.
The simple reality is that you people don't believe "fact checkers" because (EXACTLY AS THE OP SUGGESTS)....."fact-checking discriminates against conservatives".
 
This is now irrelevant.

Nobody ever said this.

This is irrelevant.


Trump lies more than anybody on this planet. The right does not like to be fact-checked because it proves they are spreading mindless bullshit. They know this.

Be well sir.
How convenient that you find every lie by the left irrelevant.

And you don’t see your own hypocrisy is hilarious.
 
How convenient that you find every lie by the left irrelevant.

And you don’t see your own hypocrisy is hilarious.

I have learned over my 70 years that people believe what they want to believe.

Some base their beliefs on science and facts. They research issues and dig for truth.

Some go by the gut

Some only believe what fits into their conception of reality.

Reality is most likely you aren't changing many minds.
 
And for several years they told us there was no basis for thinking Covid came out of the Wuhan lab. Ooops, got that wrong didn't they. How about the Trump Russian Collusion hoax? They missed on that one too. Wait, the Hunter Biden laptop was Russian disinformation? Nope it was really Hunter's laptop. Oh, and the Joe Biden is fit as a fiddle and a cognitive dynamo behind closed doors. So with the record of these high profile claims why should we trust these "fact checkers"?
“Fact-checkers” have been revealed time and again to be Leftist and/or Democrat liars and propagandists. That’s why the very term “fact-checker” has become almost Orwellian.

Mark
 
“Fact-checkers” have been revealed time and again to be Leftist and/or Democrat liars and propagandists. That’s why the very term “fact-checker” has become almost Orwellian.

Mark

Well Republicans want no fact checkers. They don't want the lies exposed.

Pretty obvious you don't want any information that contradicts your version of reality.
 
Well Republicans want no fact checkers. They don't want the lies exposed.
I think that applies to both parties. Afterall, the democrats lie much more and are far better at it.
Pretty obvious you don't want any information that contradicts your version of reality.
Nobody likes that. Only some of us are capable of listening to the opposing viewpoints without calling the other person a racist, or some other foul word.
 
Racism, discrimination against the other.

Racism has as many levels of expression as there are differences between human thought. White supremacy is an extreme form, I don't know why you would cite such an extreme form other than to try to minimize the existence of racism. It is like saying if we don't have NAZI's marching in the street, liberals fear of extremist rightwingers is overblown.

I can assure you I'm not trying to minimize anything, I'm genuinely curious and have a difficult time imagining that racism is still so widespread as to be the root of all difference of outcomes. Perhaps I lack imagination but that's where I'm at.

Asians have existed in the US for a long time, yet Asians were not being lynched in significant numbers, ergo something must be wrong with Blacks....

Asians where being held in internment camps for no other reason other than being asian. I didn't compare them against blacks, I brought it up to illustrate why I have a hard time attributing the whole of difference to racist, because there are many non-white groups that outperform, and that data doesn't support that theory.

You are searching for a characteristic of the individual to account for their lack of achievement, and when you are predisposed to not consider racism....well....it must be again a problem with the class of individuals, not the environment they exist in.

I would agree I'm not predisposed to consider racism as a primary differentiator.

"Fundamental attribution error"

You know that is an absurd position, even individual Canadians enslaved First Nations people, racism in the US is not limited to Blacks, every ethnicity has experienced discrimination in the US. The US govt committed genocide against First Nation peoples, they still experience discrimination. I could get into all kinds of stories about the discrimination I witnessed against my GF's growing up in AZ, but thats anecdotal.

The level of acceptance of an individual by a group is so multifaceted, but the basic concept is how many characteristics of that individual align with the group. As a species we are so visually oriented, and skin color is such a obvious marker of difference. Even within Black culture, darker colored individuals are discriminated. I think the level, the extremism, is a learned behavior, hate is taught within a culture and within families.

Yes, I'd agree that the native population has also experienced severe discrimination, very similar to that of the black population. It wasn't my intent to exclude them in my response, I'm just trying to square the circle on how some minorities underperform and some minorities overperform if we take the reference as average white person. This is where I get hung up. Also, I've seen data, for example, that shows that recent black immigrants outperform native born black and white americans - so how can this be if it's just racism? This is where I get hung up. I really don't mean to be rude or anything, I am open minded, but just please explain what I'm missing here.
 
I think that applies to both parties. Afterall, the democrats lie much more and are far better at it.
Not so much anymore. Fewer people are willing to believe their lies.
Nobody likes that. Only some of us are capable of listening to the opposing viewpoints without calling the other person a racist, or some other foul word.
I often go to Progressive media outlets (i.e. The Nation, The Young Turks, Jacobin Magazine, HuffPost, etc.), even though I don’t agree with them. I’ll bet most Leftists never go to Rightwing outlets.

Mark
 
I can assure you I'm not trying to minimize anything, I'm genuinely curious and have a difficult time imagining that racism is still so widespread
Thats an incredible comment, an absurd premise. You are not trying to minimize while you deny its extent.


You been here for 7 years....oh, wait....now I remember you, you said:

"BLM has become a vessel to collect any grievance and justification to lash out against society as a whole"

You minimize racism all the time, it is your stock and trade. I'm not going to waste my time on a gaslighting white-washer.
 
Thats an incredible comment, an absurd premise. You are not trying to minimize while you deny its extent.


You been here for 7 years....oh, wait....now I remember you, you said:

"BLM has become a vessel to collect any grievance and justification to lash out against society as a whole"

You minimize racism all the time, it is your stock and trade. I'm not going to waste my time on a gaslighting white-washer.

I see no satisfying explanations to my questions. You apparently cannot support your position, for some reason this angers you and you lash out with a personal attack against me. You know nothing of me, know nothing of my intent or motives, yet you confidently spew slander like this. You are intellectually unimpressive and not worth my time as you have nothing worthwhile to offer.
 
Thats an incredible comment, an absurd premise. You are not trying to minimize while you deny its extent.


You been here for 7 years....oh, wait....now I remember you, you said:

"BLM has become a vessel to collect any grievance and justification to lash out against society as a whole"

You minimize racism all the time, it is your stock and trade. I'm not going to waste my time on a gaslighting white-washer.
What you perceive as racism is mostly in your imagination. If a person is judged by their character, so many more blacks are disliked than whites, for their character., The way they present themselves to others.

It isn't because they are black. It's because so many act like hoodlums. It's the way so many talk, in inappropriate manners in public. respectable people avoid whits that do that too, but there are as many whites that act al "ghetto."

It's a cultural dislike. Not a color thing.

Understand Martin Luther Kink's words. He asked that blacks not be judged by the color or their shin, but by character. That is exactly what we have. His dream has come true. The black community is absolutely judged by it's character as a whole. It isn't racism, but dislike because of the way most black people carry themselves.

Want to be treated with respect? Then act respectable.
 
Most fact checkers are made by lefties, so the fact checkers themself start with a bias.

A fact has no bias. It is what it is without human interpretation.
 
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