Developments in the Ukraine War

[Sword 1944]

Invading Ukraine is definitely aggression.

And NATO is a defensive organization.

When did they fight a defensive war?

 

[Fledermaus]

When did they fight a defensive war?

When did they have to?

Deterrence.

Look it up.

 

[Sword 1944]

To guarantee control of the Black Sea and to be in a position to threaten Moldova

What they wouldn't want is your Country and NATO controlling the black sea, and why would they attack Moldova there are many Russian supporters there, stop making shit up.

 

[Sword 1944]

When did they have to?

Deterrence.

Look it up.

Well that's my point they have only used military aggression like i said first against Yugoslavia, the Serbs never attacked a NATO Country, your argument is totally bankrupt.

 

[Fledermaus]

Well that's my point they have only used military aggression like i said first against Yugoslavia, the Serbs never attacked a NATO Country, your argument is totally bankrupt.

In other words the DETERRENCE worked perfectly.

As to bleating about the Yugoslavia that no longer existed.... Is there something about stopping ethnic cleansing/genocide that triggers you?

 

[Roadvirus]

In other words the DETERRENCE worked perfectly.

As to bleating about the Yugoslavia that no longer existed.... Is there something about stopping ethnic cleansing/genocide that triggers you?

Apparently there must be, since he's so adamant about defending Putzin's murder spree in Ukraine.

 

[Fledermaus]

What they wouldn't want is your Country and NATO controlling the black sea, and why would they attack Moldova there are many Russian supporters there, stop making shit up.

You really don't understand much about geopolitics... Do you?

NATO could bottle up the Black Sea any time they wanted to WITHOUT Sevastopol.

 

[Juin]

Ukraine will never be in NATO the Russians won't tolerate it, it's one of the reasons for the war now.

I understand that Russia does not want that. What I was pointing out was that when the Eu leaders keep talking about Ukraine joining Eu it is based on the expectation that Ukraine will be stabilised. They clearly are not talking about a Ukraine that is in the throes of war like Syria joining the Eu. A Russia collapse is one way Ukraine can be stabilised by the EU; that possibility appears to have gone out the window. If Russia cannot be collapsed then Ukraine is guaranteed endless conflict. If Eu inherits a Ukraine closer to Syria then it has to send in an Army of occupation

 

[Juin]

High circles in Russia tell Putin what he wants to hear
Ther is a reason Russia is pulling out older and older equipment and it isnt because they are getting stronger

High circles in the west have observed that Russia is much more powerful now than at the beginning of the SMO. You are behind times. And as to what the equipment Russia is rolling out is doing to the Ukrainian Army all you have to do is listen to Zelensky and Gen Syrski.

 

[Fledermaus]

High circles in the west have observed that Russia is much more powerful now than at the beginning of the SMO. You are behind times. And as to what the equipment Russia is rolling out is doing to the Ukrainian Army all you have to do is listen to Zelensky and Gen Syrski.

Errr

Wut?

 

[Juin]

And now NATO touches as much of Russias border as it would have if Ukraine, which wasnt joining NATO had joined.

Putin's red line was Ukraine. And that is where the war is on. Maybe Nato can attack Russia from Finland and Sweden, if that is your point.

Plus Ukraine will now almost certainly join NATO after the war

Why cant they join now? Zelensky wanted in like yesterday

What does Putins land grab in Ukraine have to do with Georgia or Belarus?

Those were also countries targeted for Nato admission

So your claim is that if a country doesnt cave into the absurd demands of Putin he has the right to invade?

Right. And it is straight from US' playbook. Cuban missile crisis and Monroe Doctrine

 

[Juin]

Jesus, it's been awhile since I've seen a casualty report this wholly terrible for RUS; spoiled for length:

You should forward your report to Zelensky and Gen Syrskyi; from their moans and groans I get the impression they are not as informed on the casualty report as yourself

 

[Quag]

I never said Putin had lost the war you did, and there is no raw expansionist agression, it's like you are in some alternative universe where the events in 2014 never happened,as fo Nato it's a criminal enterprise that serves American inyerests, tell me when it ever fought a defensive war ? it has just been one agressive war after another starting with the brutal illegal war against the former Yugoslavia bombing the Country for 78days, and as i said Finland had no problem with Russia for 80 years after WW2, so either they took leave of their senses making an enemy out of Russia or a lot of money has changed hands.

Your posts make it clear that Putin has lost the war based on your excuse on why the war started. A false BS made up lousy excuse mind you
You are not good at fascist propaganda at all
Stay away from windows fascists like Putin dont like people saying things like that

 

[Juin]

Because the Israeli lobby is unfortunately exceedingly and excessively powerful much to America's detriment.

Blame it on that Jewish lobby. It is easier to blame the lobby than deal with the obvious. An escalation against Iran can be managed, an escalation against Russia not so much

 

[Jredbaron96]

Russia didn't have a problem with independent Ukraine,

Yes they did. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2003_Tuzla_Island_conflict

 

[Quag]

Putin's red line was Ukraine. And that is where the war is on. Maybe Nato can attack Russia from Finland and Sweden, if that is your point.

NATO was never going to attack Russia unless attacked. Ukraine was not going to join NATO before Russia attacked. Ukraine will certainly join NATO after the war now.
All moot as it is a pathetic and invalid reason to invade and try to destroy another country

Why cant they join now? Zelensky wanted in like yesterday

Zelensky wanted in But Ukraine didnt meet NATO requirements so could not even apply and no country can join while at war as it immediately invokes article 5
If you cant figure that out yourself then maybe this forum is way to advance for you and you should go elsewhere to spread your BS

Those were also countries targeted for Nato admission

NATO doesn't target countries and no Belarus is a puppet of Putin it is not going to be considered

Right. And it is straight from US' playbook. Cuban missile crisis and Monroe Doctrine

The past isnt the future the Monroe doctrine is gone
How could Washington have fought against the British he was a British officer
Why do you support fascism?

 

[Quag]

High circles in the west have observed that Russia is much more powerful now than at the beginning of the SMO. You are behind times. And as to what the equipment Russia is rolling out is doing to the Ukrainian Army all you have to do is listen to Zelensky and Gen Syrski.

Zero hedge and storm front are not reliable sources

Why do you support fascism?

 

[Juin]

Both countries joined because they saw the raw naked expansionst agression of Russia and wanted the of protection of NATO
Your post (as usual) is not based in reality.

oh puleeeze. What reality you talking about? Military powers or alliances are by definition threats; especially to those outside the alliance. Cuba in the 60s saw the "raw naked aggression" of its neighbour to the north and sought protection from the Soviet Union. That was Cuba's right. But it does not change the fact that that particular exercise by Cuba of its sovereign rights also placed an unacceptable risk near the US. The US threatened war, as was also its right.

But then you already admitted Puytin lost the war so now you are desperate tyo find a safe space far from any windows
Good luck

Maybe you should let Zelensky declare victory if Putin has lost. Zelensky and his military commanders are daily warning that they will lose if more is not done. Maybe you should listen to them

 

[Sword 1944]

oh puleeeze. What reality you talking about? Military powers or alliances are by definition threats; especially to those outside the alliance. Cuba in the 60s saw the "raw naked aggression" of its neighbour to the north and sought protection from the Soviet Union. That was Cuba's right. But it does not change the fact that that particular exercise by Cuba of its sovereign rights also placed an unacceptable risk near the US. The US threatened war, as was also its right.





Maybe you should let Zelensky declare victory if Putin has lost. Zelensky and his military commanders are daily warning that they will lose if more is not done. Maybe you should listen to them

These people who support NATO and Ukraine never ask why the West and NATO want to move onto Russia's borders it's clear the only reason is to provoke a response, NATO should have disbanded after the Soviet Union was no more and the Warsaw pact ended, so what the hell is it for?

 

[Jredbaron96]

These people who support NATO and Ukraine never ask why the West and NATO want to move onto Russia's borders it's clear the only reason is to provoke a response, NATO should have disbanded after the Soviet Union was no more and the Warsaw pact ended, so what the hell is it for?

Do you throw away your umbrellas after it stops raining?

 

[Fledermaus]

These people who support NATO and Ukraine never ask why the West and NATO want to move onto Russia's borders it's clear the only reason is to provoke a response, NATO should have disbanded after the Soviet Union was no more and the Warsaw pact ended, so what the hell is it for?

To protect nations from aggressor states....

 

[Quag]

oh puleeeze. What reality you talking about? Military powers or alliances are by definition threats; especially to those outside the alliance. Cuba in the 60s saw the "raw naked aggression" of its neighbour to the north and sought protection from the Soviet Union. That was Cuba's right. But it does not change the fact that that particular exercise by Cuba of its sovereign rights also placed an unacceptable risk near the US. The US threatened war, as was also its right.

Nothing above is true

Maybe you should let Zelensky declare victory if Putin has lost. Zelensky and his military commanders are daily warning that they will lose if more is not done. Maybe you should listen to them

Putin has lost based on what the fascists propagandists are saying not my fault they made up a silly excuse for the war
Why do you love fascist so much?

 

[Surrealistik]

Blame it on that Jewish lobby. It is easier to blame the lobby than deal with the obvious. An escalation against Iran can be managed, an escalation against Russia not so much

I will because it is demonstrably that powerful; just look at what they're coercing Biden to do despite engaging in what is essentially a full blown, real time genocide, nevermind nearly a century of consistent and excess influence.

 

[Sword 1944]

To protect nations from aggressor states....

That's just total nonsense no one asked them to police the World, it's just a foreign legion for the US and a money making scam for weapons sales, what gets me is there are people like you who actually agree with the scam.

 

[Fledermaus]

That's just total nonsense no one asked them to police the World, it's just a foreign legion for the US and a money making scam for weapons sales, what gets me is there are people like you who actually agree with the scam.

Wow. What a silly rant.

How many times have NATO nations been invaded?

(Clue: There is one case)