Debate Me: I’m Starting To Think What FB and Twitter Is Doing Is Wrong :(

[SoCal]

No, really. Melt down or no, he is the sitting potus. Either he’s been 25th’d or he has not. Shold those platforms be keeping the sitting potus from speaking to the public, pro or con?

I hate him, but I don’t think this is right. Please, tell me I’m wrong? Someone smarter than me? Please?

If he wants to speak to the the public he can hold press conferences and take questions like every other president who reports to his constituency. Trump sometimes forgets that he's a public servant...

 

[Linuxcooldude]

Right wingers keep saying they want to remove Section 230 to “protect free speech.” They’re lying. They don’t actually want every single forum to become an entirely unmoderated cesspool. They don’t want websites to be required to let every troll, spammer, or psychopath spew garbage all day every day. They don’t want small startup companies sued into oblivion every time some random troll posts something defamatory.

They just want Twitter to not enforce the rules of Twitter against conservatives.

I don't think they wanted it removed entirely, but those who don't apply their rules and policies equally regardless of party affiliation. Facebook/twitter seemed fine with allowing its users to use their platform to coordinate all the riots all in 2020. But one riot at the Capitol was enough to ban one account of the President. Not equal application at all. Those are the ones who need legal protections removed.

 

[btthegreat]

Maybe this is the free market working in conjunction with democracy to make a judgement within the boundaries of law and public trust.

I don't much care. The President has government owned and operated 'megaphones'. He cannot hijack' a corporations new and improved megaphone for his own use, at his own pleasure, to do with as he pleases, because that megaphone works better in 2020.

 

[dncc]

Maddow not only is, she's excellent.

I used to listen to her back on Air America when XM was first starting. She was good. I can't do MSNBC though. After 5 minutes, it's off the rails

 

[Craig234]

I used to listen to her back on Air America when XM was first starting. She was good. I can't do MSNBC though. After 5 minutes, it's off the rails

Air America was a different role of commentator. While she certainly includes opinion, which is fine, she is now a reporter. Can't discuss your vague phrase.

 

[Craig234]

If he wants to speak to the the public he can hold press conferences and take questions like every other president who reports to his constituency. Trump sometimes forgets that he's a public servant...

Sometimes? When has he ever been one?

 

[dncc]

Air America was a different role of commentator. While she certainly includes opinion, which is fine, she is now a reporter. Can't discuss your vague phrase.

Vague phrase? MSNBC is as unhinged to reality as FOX is. She's a commentator now or at least she was whenever I tuned into her program which was once every blue moon.

 

[Craig234]

Vague phrase? MSNBC is as unhinged to reality as FOX is. She's a commentator now or at least she was whenever I tuned into her program which was once every blue moon.

You're wrong to the point of being deluded about MSNBC. If you're denying Maddow is a quality reporter, you're also the same on that, she is better than most reporters. If your point is that her reporting has editorial content and an editorial position, you're right. If you think the only reporting is, "today, the child of a politician was murder by the politician's enemies, but we have no position on who is right or wrong", then we disagree.

 

[Simon W. Moon]

her'es the iraq war resolution. This is why we invaded Iraq. Not what you want it to be.
where's the lie.

Text - H.J.Res.114 - 107th Congress (2001-2002): Authorization for Use of Military Force Against Iraq Resolution of 2002

Text for H.J.Res.114 - 107th Congress (2001-2002): Authorization for Use of Military Force Against Iraq Resolution of 2002

www.congress.gov

Seems like some extreme sport cherry-picking
to exclude literally every single thing members of the Bush Admin ever said about Iraq
by limiting the discussion to the text of this resolution

obviously, ymmv

Maybe to you, it seems legit? idk

 

[trixare4kids]

Social media whether Twitter, facebook, Instagram, Google, Youtube, etc. have been censoring Conservative thought for years. They went full-bore with censorship of Conservative thought after Trump was elected leading up to a massive purge yesterday. While everyone is focused on Trump, there were a lot of Conservative publications and organizations that were banned over their political speech. Even the Walk Away movement.

During these past four years new social media platforms were formed like Parler and Rumble to name a couple that have taken off because of the censorship of conservative thought. But big tech went even further like Google Play will no longer provide the Parler app until Parler will agree to what big tech thinks is proper speech. Then Apple came out and said they are considering pulling the Parler app unless Parler tightens up its policies.

Here is CEO of Parler John Matze response to Apple...


“Anyone who buys an Apple phone is apparently a user. Apparently [sic] they know what is best for you by telling you which apps you may and may not use.”

“Apparently they believe Parler is responsible for ALL user generated content on Parler. Therefor by the same logic, Apple must be responsible for ALL actions taken by their phones. Every car bomb, every illegal cell phone conversation, every illegal crime committed on an iPhone, Apple must also be responsible for … Standards not applied to Twitter, Facebook or even Apple themselves, apply to Parler.”


“We will not cave to pressure from anti-competitive actors! We will and always have enforced our rules against violence and illegal activity. But we WONT cave to politically motivated companies and those authoritarians who hate free speech!”

“The media tried to claim that ‘The Insurrection’ was organized on Parler. There are quite a few problems with this.”

“1) Parler has no way to organize anything, Facebook groups was used heavily to organize the protests. 2) Protests are constitutionally protected. 3) Bad actors turned the protests into a riots,” ” I know the media and everyone wants to point fingers and place blame. It is convenient for them to turn Parler into a scape goat.”

“The reality that everyone pointing fingers is to blame,” “We need to start thinking critically again and stop blaming one another. We MUST try to humanize one another again not dehumanize by leveraging witch hunt tactics which will accomplish the opposite of their intended purposes.”

You and I both know that the left has been trying to get conservative thought off the air since the days of talk radio; Rush Limbaugh. And then it was Fox News... Now it's the Internet platforms they are trying to police.

They're not going to win here... The country is center right, and they don't and will not suffer McCarthyism 2 lightly.

 

[SoCal]

...The country is center right, and they don't and will not suffer McCarthyism 2 lightly.

Americans have been satisfied with our our mass media (what you call fake media?) since Ben Franklin, currently and in the future. It's only been in the last few years when all of a sudden conservatives started whining about the mass media trying to turn America communist. So now rightists have their own mass media outlets where they can continue to pass along conspiracy theories, like they've passed along Trump's lies with a smiling face. Progressives have their own echo chambers.

What conservatives are really bitching about, the issue that gets under their skin and motives so many is not mass media per se, it's what they're reporting on. America is center right, although it used to be much further right. Slavery, lynchings, discrimination against the Irish, religious and other groups, genocide of native Americans, internment of Japanese Americans, etc. and since? Labor laws, union rights, women's rights, suffrage, health and safety regs, etc., we've come a long way, do conservatives see a pattern here?

Fact is America that's growing more liberal every day in the near future America will transition from center/right to center to center/left. Conservatives just can't wrap their heads around that. It's the reason why you heard so many seditionists screaming, "I want to take my country back!!"...

 

[trixare4kids]

Americans have been satisfied with our our mass media (what you call fake media?) since Ben Franklin, currently and in the future. It's only been in the last few years when all of a sudden conservatives started whining about the mass media trying to turn America communist. So now rightists have their own mass media outlets where they can continue to pass along conspiracy theories, like they've passed along Trump's lies with a smiling face. Progressives have their own echo chambers.

What conservatives are really bitching about, the issue that gets under their skin and motives so many is not mass media per se, it's what they're reporting on. America is center right, although it used to be much further right. Slavery, lynchings, discrimination against the Irish, religious and other groups, genocide of native Americans, internment of Japanese Americans, etc. and since? Labor laws, union rights, women's rights, suffrage, health and safety regs, etc., we've come a long way, do conservatives see a pattern here?

Fact is America that's growing more liberal every day in the near future America will transition from center/right to center to center/left. Conservatives just can't wrap their heads around that. It's the reason why you heard so many seditionists screaming, "I want to take my country back!!"...

Multiple Strawmen. Hope you have a big enough tractor to haul them away...

 

[KLATTU]

Seems like some extreme sport cherry-picking
to exclude literally every single thing members of the Bush Admin ever said about Iraq
by limiting the discussion to the text of this resolution

obviously, ymmv

Maybe to you, it seems legit? idk

well nothing else matters. That was the rationale for war. We didn't go to war based on initiative and referendum. It was based on what was in that resolution.
You're cherry picking out of context quotes re irrelevant ( and they weren't lies)

 

[Aunt Antifa]

Multiple Strawmen. Hope you have a big enough tractor to haul them away...

They’re right. Most of republican angst is due to multiculturalism. It’s not an accident that MAGA is a white nationalist movement. Entire GOP election strategy is always suppression of Black voters.

 

[joluoto]

I do think the social media giant could have waited a few days so it was private citizen Trump, not President Trump they banned. But I am happy they finally follow their own G'd damn rules that they usually just ignore if the person breaking them is popular enough and draws a huge crowd, i.e. makes alot of money for them. This ban is not because they suddenly think Trump = bad, but because Trump became detrimental to their profit.

 

[Simon W. Moon]

well nothing else matters. That was the rationale for war. We didn't go to war based on initiative and referendum. It was based on what was in that resolution.
You're cherry picking out of context quotes re irrelevant ( and they weren't lies)

ftr, I did not provide ANY quotes from the Bush Admin.
So, I am unsure of why you'd bother to accuse me of providing their quotes out of context.

Between this false accusation and the thing where you try to exclude everything the GWB Admin said about Iraq from a discussion of whether or not the Bush Admin lied about Iraq,
I am beginning to suspect you may not be an honest debater.
ymmv.

The assertion was that the Bush Admin lied about the the necessity of invading Iraq to protect the US.
You decided you would rather debate a separate notion about whether anything in that resolution was false.

gl
have fun

 

[KLATTU]

The assertion was that the Bush Admin lied about the the necessity of invading Iraq to protect the US.
You decided you would rather debate a separate notion about whether anything in that resolution was false.

fun

the neccessity to invade Iraq was spelled out in the Iraq War resolution. Nothing else mattered. It's not a 'separate notion". There was no lie in there.

Claiming a US President lied to get us into war. do you know how serious a charge that is? It's on par with what Trump just did.

 

[SoCal]

Multiple Strawmen. Hope you have a big enough tractor to haul them away...

Read your quote I was answering, you said the country is center right, I agreed and claimed it was drifting further to the center. If you don't want to talk about it fine, but I thought we were here to debate.

One more thought on the subject of the thread. For the first time, Twitter has allowed Americans to be subjected to our government's propaganda 24 hours a day 7 days a week. Everyone knows how it's done, repeat the same simple phrases over and over again. First the seed is planted, then it spreads, then it's believed.

Joseph Goebbels would have loved Twitter...

 

[Simon W. Moon]

the neccessity to invade Iraq was spelled out in the Iraq War resolution. Nothing else mattered. It's not a 'separate notion". There was no lie in there.

Claiming a US President lied to get us into war. do you know how serious a charge that is? It's on par with what Trump just did.

My assertion was that the GWB Admin lied about the necessity to invade Iraq to protect America.
You responded by saying,

"Nuh-uh. Look at this document written by people who are not the Bush Admin.​

There are no lies in this document the Bush Admin did not write.
Therefore, the Bush Admin did not lie."​

Then, you accuse me of misquoting the Bush Admin when I did not quote them at all.

Now, you're back to telling me that a document written by Congress is evidence that no one in the Bush Admin ever told a lie about the necessity to invade Iraq.

That don't make no sense

have the last word

 

[KLATTU]

My assertion was that the GWB Admin lied about the necessity to invade Iraq to protect America.

And why else would he do it? To protect Iceland?

And it goes beyond protecting America. He was a threat to the region.

 

[NotreDame]

I don't think they wanted it removed entirely, but those who don't apply their rules and policies equally regardless of party affiliation. Facebook/twitter seemed fine with allowing its users to use their platform to coordinate all the riots all in 2020. But one riot at the Capitol was enough to ban one account of the President. Not equal application at all. Those are the ones who need legal protections removed.

Context matters. The U.S. changed post 1/6, and your reasoning above doesn’t take this into account. The Facebook and Twitter and Parler are operating in a different context post 1/6 than they were before 1/6.

Their response was prudent when taking 1/6 into account.

 

[Simon W. Moon]

And why else would he do it? To protect Iceland?

Well, duh.
Going to war to protect some other country or countries is stupid, right?
No President would do that.
Especially not GWB, right?

And it goes beyond protecting America. He was a threat to the region.

Well, duh.
Of course GWB went to war to protect some other country or countries. That's smart, right?
Any President would do that.
Especially GWB, right?


ok. now fr, you can have the last word.

 

[KLATTU]

Well, duh.
Going to war to protect some other country or countries is stupid, right?
No President would do that.
Especially not GWB, right?

Were you born in 1990 and not take take history in school.
Wilson did it . FDR did it, Ike did it it, Kennedy did it.

Or were Germany, Japan , NK and Vietnam going to invade America?

 

[KLATTU]

...To be honest , I'm not sure what point you are trying to make, You're trying to be snarky and cute, but it's not working.
I'll ask you the same thing I've asked a hundred times and never gotten a reasonable answer.

Let's assume all the reasons Bush gave for invading Iraq were all lies.
That would have course mean he had other reasons.

It's all over now, so those 'real' reasons should be obvious. What were they?