Countries Favorability.

[shuamort]

Sorry going to go with the Duelfer report and the President's Commission report before I take the word of a fake new organization like NewMax.com.

I would think even conservatives would believe a conservative President before a conservative fake news agency.

Fantasea's got it right:

The preceding photographs are authentic, originally published by the U.S. Department of Defense on August 6, 2003 and credited to Master Sgt. T. Collins of the USAF. The accompanying text, though this version purports to be an "unclassified excerpt" from an unspecified document, was lifted verbatim from a NewsMax.com article of the same date.

After overseas news sources began reporting at the beginning of August 2003 that upwards of 30 Cold War-era Russian MiG-25 Foxbat fighter jets had been found buried in the desert at al-Taqqadum airfield near Baghdad, Secretary of Defense Donald Rumsfeld confirmed the discovery on August 5. He cited the exhumed aircraft, which had gone undetected for months by U.S. forces operating in the area, as an example of the difficulty of locating hidden weapons of mass destruction.

Iraq acquired the MiG-25s, along with about 200 other aircraft, from the U.S.S.R. in 1980. The fighters were still in use as recently as early 2003, but, for reasons still unknown, Saddam Hussein decided to conceal his air force instead of deploying it against U.S.-led coalition forces when they invaded Iraq in March 2003. Reportedly, some of the buried aircraft were damaged beyond repair.

 

[RightinNYC]

I voted "America" though I of course mean United States of America. I do get rathyer annoyed at the misuse of the term "America" having Chilean, Brazillian and Mexican friends who of course are too "Americans" but not of the USA.

In French we have the term "Etats-Uniesien" which replaces the rather incorrect "Americain" - perhaps it's time that in English we coined the nationality "United Statesian"

My problem with this poll is that it rather encourages hatred or the bashing of certain countries or peoples, which I am wholeheartedly against. I would say I hate the US government, the US political machine, disagree firmly with US foreign policy since the end of the 2nd world war, am disgusted by the unappointed 'policeman of the world' rôle that the US has taken on, dislike the "west is best" arrogance the US perpertrates, and am horrified by the injustices which exist in a nation which claims to be the beholder of human rights. On a cultural level, I find the majority of US culture rather low brow and distateful, and I detest it's mass scale exportation around the world. I prefer a wholesome ham baguette from a French boulangerie than a McDonalds, and would rather watch an intelligent German film than some bland Hollywood blockboster (with it's beautiful people, kids with straight teeth, predicatable plots and 'we are the greatest' rhetoric).

As for United States of Americans as individuals, I take each person for what they are. It is wrong to stereotype, but foolish to deny that certain characteristics do pervade in any nationality. I am rather shocked by an inability of many from the US to be truly open to the outside world, by the huge amounts of food they eat, and waste - then spend millions on liposuction and Jenny Craig, and by their obsession with looks (the cosmetic surgery industry, the perfect body images which are pushed, rather contradicting the Mclove affair with fries. I suppose superficial is the word I am searching for). That said an individual is an individual, and there are 'United Statesians' I love dearly. Why, I've even just had lunch with one.

Regarding your distaste for US Culture: Then why watch it?

You do realize that most Americans (sorry, it's an inborn habit, and it sounds foolish to say United Statesians, for brevity's sake) hate the same things about our culture that you do.

Most Hollywood movies are pointless, most celebrities are rich assholes, and most trendy people who get obnoxious amounts of plastic surgery are annoying as well. One thing that you don't seem to realize is that those three blocs of America are overwhelmingly liberal, thus creating the "perfect storm" of distaste for a person like myself.

The reason why our culture gets exported around the world is because of the immense demand. If nobody in europe liked MTV, there would be no reason for MTV Italia. When I was in Firenze, I got a good laugh out of seeing American pop music played in the clubs while Italians danced wildly. It's the same reason McDonalds's are everywhere: the demand is huge. In Europe, the lines at McDonalds's are much longer than in the US. That's not McDonald's fault.

And regarding your anger that the US sees itself as the world policeman. I just debated walvaro in another thread where he yelled at me because the US didn't intervene in Spain's civil war prior to WWII. Europeans love to decry the US's "imperialism," yet criticize us for not being the world policeman in matters such as the Sudan, Rwanda, Cambodia, and forget that they relied on our "imperialism" to survive both European World Wars.

 

[RightinNYC]

Also:

Anyone else amused that of the twenty six "votes" for the US, only 3 are from registered users?

Or that the country with the most votes from registered users is France?

 

[Pacridge]

The reason why our culture gets exported around the world is because of the immense demand. If nobody in europe liked MTV, there would be no reason for MTV Italia. When I was in Firenze, I got a good laugh out of seeing American pop music played in the clubs while Italians danced wildly. It's the same reason McDonalds's are everywhere: the demand is huge. In Europe, the lines at McDonalds's are much longer than in the US. That's not McDonald's fault.

Yes, it seems they both loathe and can't get enough of us all at the same time.

Though to be fair to UF. I can’t stand Jerry Springer or the show “Cops” yet they’re wildly popular over here. Popularity and good taste don’t allows go hand in hand.

 

[RightinNYC]

Yes, it seems they both loathe and can't get enough of us all at the same time.

Though to be fair to UF. I can’t stand Jerry Springer or the show “Cops” yet they’re wildly popular over here. Popularity and good taste don’t allows go hand in hand.

Jerry Springer has single handedly lowered our nation's IQ by a point or two.

Although I will admit that Cops: Jersey is amazing and hilarious. Seeing someone try to smoke a crack blunt on the steps of a police department, and then ask the cop for a lighter? Quite entertaining.

Oh Jersey, what a disgusting hole you are...

 

[Pacridge]

Also:

Anyone else amused that of the twenty six "votes" for the US, only 3 are from registered users?

Or that the country with the most votes from registered users is France?

Yes, I caught that as well and meant to make note of it in post the other evening. Excellent post!

I think we’re making a mistake by allowing non-members to vote.
I find the votes for both the US and France to be rather odd. I understand the distaste people might have on either side of the fence for the other. But to put either other such countries as Iran, Syria, Sudan or North Korea. Seems very strange to me.

 

[RightinNYC]

Yes, I caught that as well and meant to make note of it in post the other evening. Excellent post!

I think we’re making a mistake by allowing non-members to vote.
I find the votes for both the US and France to be rather odd. I understand the distaste people might have on either side of the fence for the other. But to put either other such countries as Iran, Syria, Sudan or North Korea. Seems very strange to me.

I was curious to see if it could be manipulated, so I logged out and tried to vote again (For France, just because it seemed so strange to me. I mean, yes, they opposed the war, but so did the Pope, and the Vatican's not on there), and it counted the vote.

Makes you wonder where those 23 other votes came from...

 

[Arch Enemy]

I like how this whole debate/poll ended up. American Liberals Versus American Republicans.

To those Europeans who don't like America, you do owe us gratitude for being the key factor in World War II. We could have easily bribed Hitler to not rival us and it would have been bye-bye free Europe.

 

[Pacridge]

Jerry Springer has single handedly lowered our nation's IQ by a point or two.

Although I will admit that Cops: Jersey is amazing and hilarious. Seeing someone try to smoke a crack blunt on the steps of a police department, and then ask the cop for a lighter? Quite entertaining.

Oh Jersey, what a disgusting hole you are...

Maybe I should watch "Cops" sounds hilarious. Still not watching Springer.

 

[Pacridge]

No one can prevent you from burying your head in the sand a la the photos of those Russian jets in the Iraqi desert being dug out by US soldiers.

Just as no one can prevent you from burying your head in the sand and ignoring that we spent lives and billions of tax dollars invading a country that had no WMD's and was no current threat to the US.

 

[Pacridge]

Fantasea's got it right:

And what does some buried jets, most of which were un-repairable according to the source you provided, have to do with WMD’s?

Did any of the UN resolutions mandate Saddam dismantle his aircraft? I knew there was a no-fly zone but I’ve never heard of him being ordered to get rid of any aircraft. Could be, I just didn’t hear about it.

 

[shuamort]

And what does some buried jets, most of which were un-repairable according to the source you provided, have to do with WMD’s?

Did any of the UN resolutions mandate Saddam dismantle his aircraft? I knew there was a no-fly zone but I’ve never heard of him being ordered to get rid of any aircraft. Could be, I just didn’t hear about it.

The idea was, as proffered by Rumsfeld, that if they were willing to bury these Foxbats, is it possible that there are other things buried? (Other things read as WMDs.) The Foxbats don't lend credence to the actuality of WMDs, but they do open up room for pause to wonder if the WMDs are still undiscovered and buried. Dubious? Yup. But it's the sliver of doubt that gives credibility to the invasion rationalization.

 

[alienken]

The idea was, as proffered by Rumsfeld, that if they were willing to bury these Foxbats, is it possible that there are other things buried? (Other things read as WMDs.) The Foxbats don't lend credence to the actuality of WMDs, but they do open up room for pause to wonder if the WMDs are still undiscovered and buried. Dubious? Yup. But it's the sliver of doubt that gives credibility to the invasion rationalization.

The way I remember it, a fuselage section of an airplane in a training area situated like training hijackers. ...I still say the stockpiles of WMD's in form of chemical and biological can fit on an 18 wheeler and easily moved.

 

[Arch Enemy]

who buries their aircraft near an air field.

 

[Fantasea]

who buries their aircraft near an air field.

http://www.chinadaily.com.cn/en/doc/2003-08/01/content_251122.htm

http://xpda.com/junkmail/junk155/buriedJets.htm

http://www.snopes.com/photos/military/sandplanes.asp

 

[Hoot]

The idea was, as proffered by Rumsfeld, that if they were willing to bury these Foxbats, is it possible that there are other things buried? (Other things read as WMDs.) The Foxbats don't lend credence to the actuality of WMDs, but they do open up room for pause to wonder if the WMDs are still undiscovered and buried. Dubious? Yup. But it's the sliver of doubt that gives credibility to the invasion rationalization.

Excuse me, but the "sliver of doubt" that gives credibility to the invasion?

So...this is how the U.S. justifies attacking and invading another country that never attacked us? The "sliver of doubt?"

God help us if this is all the rationale we need to justify taking our nation to war.

20-30 jets from the cold war era...big deal.

Rumsfeld basically said.....'since we found these jets, it's possible WMD's are buried also.' ( I'm paraphrasing, but that's what he implies)

Yeah...it's also possible the aliens from Area 51 came down and took all the WMD's away before we attacked.

Is either case likely?

No

 

[Pacridge]

Excuse me, but the "sliver of doubt" that gives credibility to the invasion?

So...this is how the U.S. justifies attacking and invading another country that never attacked us? The "sliver of doubt?"

God help us if this is all the rationale we need to justify taking our nation to war.

20-30 jets from the cold war era...big deal.

Rumsfeld basically said.....'since we found these jets, it's possible WMD's are buried also.' ( I'm paraphrasing, but that's what he implies)

Yeah...it's also possible the aliens from Area 51 came down and took all the WMD's away before we attacked.

Is either case likely?

No

Rummy’s also the guy that said prior to the invasion “We know he has these WMD’s- we know where they are.” So far wrong on both accounts.

 

[ShamMol]

Rummy’s also the guy that said prior to the invasion “We know he has these WMD’s- we know where they are.” So far wrong on both accounts.

Yeah, its been wrong on both accounts, but we have to realize that we are looking back after the fact. when rummy was saying this before and powell was, the majority of the american public (not i for one) was believing it.

 

[Gandhi>Bush]

I don't get that.

Didn't George H. W. Bush keep the receipts when he sold those WMD's?

I don't get that at all.

 

[Pacridge]

I don't get that.

Didn't George H. W. Bush keep the receipts when he sold those WMD's?

I don't get that at all.

I thought Reagan started that?

 

[Gandhi>Bush]

I think Reagan's the kind of guy that would have handed his reciepts off to his vice president.

Papa Bush was at least close to the top when the crap started to hit the fan in the name of making money by selling weapons to the middle east.

I was just trying hit low in the groin of the infidel.