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Could someone explain this Phenomenon.......

sangha said:
I disagree. With more poor people, it should be easier to get an income tax passed as there are more people who know they would not be subject to it.
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First you have to have poor people that have the same larcenous mindset that liberals do and want to take what doesn't belong to them. Red states don't have so many of those kind of poor as the blue states do. Not yet, anyway.
 
Grim17 said:
Even the observations you just made are based on your own personal political philosophies. While you don't understand such fiscal decisions and see them as illogical and bad for the majority of their people, others see them as quite the opposite. Every argument when it comes to tax rates, public services and government entitlements, has a positive and a negative side and I have found that there are many people out there that either don't realize all of the negatives, or underestimate their long term repercussions.
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I would really love to hear someone (anyone) explain how regressive taxes are good. Political lean doesn't matter to me. Anyone up for it?
 
rabbitcaebannog said:
I would really love to hear someone (anyone) explain how regressive taxes are good.
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State taxes are never "good." Although "regressive" state taxes are "better" than "progressive" state taxes.
 
Papa bull said:
First you have to have poor people that have the same larcenous mindset that liberals do and want to take what doesn't belong to them. Red states don't have so many of those kind of poor as the blue states do. Not yet, anyway.
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MA has one if the lowest poverty rates in US and yet it votes to invest more in things like public education than say Mississippi. So, do people from Mississippi have less of a entitlement attitude when it comes to educating their kids? How's that working for them:doh
 
Does any state actually have a regressive tax policy?
I guess one has to have an income tax, for it to be ether regressive neutral or progressive.
I am not sure when it became acceptable in a capitalist society to penalize success with greater taxation?
All of the non government goods and services are based on the market value, not on the person's income.
One has to wonder why the per capita cost of government is more for people who make more.
 
sangha said:
The issue is the link between social spending and income.
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I think they are directly related. More taxes, more regulation, more state spending = less net income, higher cost of living, and higher prices on goods and services, which requires higher average wages for residents to be able to make a living.

California is a prime example of this, which I can say based on my own personal experience many years ago.
 
longview said:
Does any state actually have a regressive tax policy?
I guess one has to have an income tax, for it to be ether regressive neutral or progressive.
I am not sure when it became acceptable in a capitalist society to penalize success with greater taxation?
All of the non government goods and services are based on the market value, not on the person's income.
One has to wonder why the per capita cost of government is more for people who make more.
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Yes, in some states low income families pay 6 times as much in taxes than wealthier families.
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For all of the combined state and local income, property, sales and excise taxes state residents pay, the average overall effective tax rates by income group nationwide are 11.1% for the bottom 20%, 9.4% for the middle 20% and 5.6% for the top 1%, the study found.
The fourth edition of “Who Pays? A Distributional Analysis of the Tax Systems in All 50 States” reported that in the 10 states whose tax systems most favor high earners, middle-income families pay up to three times as high a share of their income as the wealthiest families; low-income families pay up to six times as much. Top 10 Most Regressive Tax States
 
rabbitcaebannog said:
I would really love to hear someone (anyone) explain how regressive taxes are good. Political lean doesn't matter to me. Anyone up for it?
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When you say "regressive taxes" is that the opposite of progressive taxes? In other words the more you make, the lower your tax bracket and vice versa?
 
rabbitcaebannog said:
Yes, in some states low income families pay 6 times as much in taxes than wealthier families.
Snip-
For all of the combined state and local income, property, sales and excise taxes state residents pay, the average overall effective tax rates by income group nationwide are 11.1% for the bottom 20%, 9.4% for the middle 20% and 5.6% for the top 1%, the study found.
The fourth edition of “Who Pays? A Distributional Analysis of the Tax Systems in All 50 States” reported that in the 10 states whose tax systems most favor high earners, middle-income families pay up to three times as high a share of their income as the wealthiest families; low-income families pay up to six times as much. Top 10 Most Regressive Tax States
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They don't actually pay more in taxes, just a higher percent of their income.
The poor also pay a higher percent of their income in rent, food, fuel, ect.
The thing no one wants to talk about is how expensive our Government has become.
(last I looked the the Federal government cost about $12,000 per person per year.)
If a person is not paying that amount, they are not paying their fair share.
The reality is that few could afford "their fair share" the Government just spends too much.
 
Grim17 said:
When you say "regressive taxes" is that the opposite of progressive taxes? In other words the more you make, the lower your tax bracket and vice versa?
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A regressive tax basically is a tax where the people who earn the least amount pay the highest rate of their income toward taxes while the wealthier pay less. Regressive taxes usually don't collect as much in revenue, so therefore cuts services for those who pay the most in income toward those services. So, basically the poor and middle class are paying a big hunk of their income toward nothing.
 
longview said:
They don't actually pay more in taxes, just a higher percent of their income.
The poor also pay a higher percent of their income in rent, food, fuel, ect.
The thing no one wants to talk about is how expensive our Government has become.
(last I looked the the Federal government cost about $12,000 per person per year.)
If a person is not paying that amount, they are not paying their fair share.
The reality is that few could afford "their fair share" the Government just spends too much.
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Maybe poor people and middle income people are spending way too much of their income toward taxes with sh*t to show for it. If you think about it, you're not going to collect very much from lower incomes.
 
rabbitcaebannog said:
So, you agree. It has more to do with ability to pay for those services and not because of political reasons. You know, the old adage we are told to believe....some people just hate any kind of government support regardless of money.
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Maybe you ought to spend less time worried about old adages and more about reality?
 
Grim17 said:
I think they are directly related. More taxes, more regulation, more state spending = less net income,
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The #'s contradict that. The states with the higher social spending have higher net income

higher cost of living, and higher prices on goods and services, which requires higher average wages for residents to be able to make a living.
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Higher prices means higher cost of living, so you're repeating yourself.

And while it may be that the higher cost of living wipes out the extra income, I haven't seen anything that shows this is true and some of the higher income states do not have such a high cost of living. However, there is some merit to that argument, though it doesn't really explain the correlation
 
rabbitcaebannog said:
Yeah, :doh. It's my thread. Just because I mentioned the adage that often gets used doesn't mean I personally use it. I think it's a foolish one.
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I agree it's a foolish one.
 
Truckstop said:
I would like to know what the middle class in these places looked like. I don't think it is about the rich or the poor. Both of these groups tend to not care about taxes as the rich can dodge/easily pay them and the poor don't owe any. It is the middle that gets screwed.
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Nobody cares about the middle class. You don't have enough money for influence, and you have too much to be needy.
 
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