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Condi Rice stuns the view audience with story about 2nd Amendment

Maccabee said:
You'd be surprised how tolerant gun owners tend to be. They may disagree with you ideology, but they'll leave you alone.
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I agree with you by and large. But the problem is 98% of gun owners can be wonderful, tolerant people, but then there are the other 2% with guns. And I get the argument that 2% shouldn't ruin everything for the 98%, but when the 2% can mass murder others or stage dramatic anarchistic last stands that endanger law enforcement and others, well....something has to be done. IMO. I'm open to ideas on what.
 
Cameron said:
I agree with you by and large. But the problem is 98% of gun owners can be wonderful, tolerant people, but then there are the other 2% with guns. And I get the argument that 2% shouldn't ruin everything for the 98%, but when the 2% can mass murder others or stage dramatic anarchistic last stands that endanger law enforcement and others, well....something has to be done. IMO. I'm open to ideas on what.
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I challenge you to find an NRA member that committed a mass shooting.
 
Casper said:
So you are fine with the vast majority of gun owners having their guns.
FYI, living in an area where guns are restricted, only means fewer law abiding citizens own them, criminals do not comply with those restrictions, so in reality you really are not any safer, that is an illusion, hopefully you will not learn that truth the hard way.
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I believe I am empirically safer in NYC with only criminals and police owning guns than if all "law abiding citizens" (which I've always thought was a silly distinction -- many mass murderers were law abiding citizens until they went on their shooting sprees) had guns. I'd rather be mugged at gunpoint and live than shot preemptively in the back if somebody wants my wallet. We also have a wonderful police force here and remarkably low crime rate. Very happy with the safety of my area. Started a poll on this in the gun control forum, if you'd like to check that out.

For what it's worth, I would be far more pro-gun if we still had no real police presence in rural areas and indians and bandits running around murdering and raping villagers.
 
Maccabee said:
I challenge you to find an NRA member that committed a mass shooting.
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Certainly an interesting point, but I don't think even if no NRA member had ever even shot a gun, it would change my point. Unfortunately, bad people (whether they be NRA members or not) ruin things for good people, in many areas of life. And the NRA certainly supports policies that make mass shootings easier to commit.
 
Maccabee said:
The People is you and I. Normal citizens. Thus making it an individual right like the people's right to have freedom of speech.
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lol. No, it doesn't. Words are Terms. Those Terms are plural and collective, not singular or individual, if we have to quibble the point.
 
danielpalos said:
There are plenty of illegals around for the right wing to whine about?
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Your sentence doesnt even make any sense and it certianly doesn't answer my question. How is this evidence that the right whines more than the left? Please list the times the right whined and then list the times the left whined.
 
danielpalos said:
lol. No, it doesn't. Words are Terms. Those Terms are plural and collective, not singular or individual, if we have to quibble the point.
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The people have the right to own a car. Does that mean that every individual has the right to own a car?
 
Maccabee said:
Your sentence doesnt even make any sense and it certianly doesn't answer my question. How is this evidence that the right whines more than the left? Please list the times the right whined and then list the times the left whined.
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It doesn't make sense to You. You don't seem to have much of a political argument, anyway.
 
danielpalos said:
irrelevant. The words in our Constitution are express, not implied.
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It is implied and expressed. If the people have the right to bear arms then every individual has that right.
 
danielpalos said:
Why do we have alleged wars on crime, drugs, and terror?
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We have wars on CONCEPTS like "terror", "crime", "drugs" and "poverty' because these are all concepts, are all eternal, and a war on them can never be won.
It will keep going on and on and on open ended.
These concepts will always be with us and will never go away.
This is why a war on them will also never go away and will be eternal.

As Gore Vidal said..."It is used to sell us toothpaste and politicians".
 
danielpalos said:
cool. thanks for confirming that our alleged wars on crime and drugs, are "buzzword" wars and not real wars, or, we should require, wartime tax rates.
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I see them as real wars for sure, but I also see then as never ending wars by design.
If i get to be president, i will declare war on dandruff, sunburn, foggy nights, too hot summers, and too cold winters.
same logic.
 
GDViking said:
So if you believe that the powers that be at that time would have quickly confiscated legally owned firearms if they were aware of the wrong color people owning them, why would you support registration of all firearms?

Maybe next time you will be the wrong color...

The government will never know what or how many guns I own.
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Private sales....gotta love em'.
 
PleasantValley said:
We have wars on CONCEPTS like "terror", "crime", "drugs" and "poverty' because these are all concepts, are all eternal, and a war on them can never be won.
It will keep going on and on and on open ended.
These concepts will always be with us and will never go away.
This is why a war on them will also never go away and will be eternal.

As Gore Vidal said..."It is used to sell us toothpaste and politicians".
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We have a Second Amendment. We should have, no security problems in our free States.
 
PleasantValley said:
I see them as real wars for sure, but I also see then as never ending wars by design.
If i get to be president, i will declare war on dandruff, sunburn, foggy nights, too hot summers, and too cold winters.
same logic.
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How can they be "real" wars when the right wing refuses to pay for them with real, wartime tax rates?
 
danielpalos said:
no, you don't know what you are talking about. there, is that better.
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I'm talking about your inability to link to the part of the Constitution that supports your fantasy based assertion.

You are free to proceed which will require an excursion into the real world. Good luck trodding this unfamiliar territory.
 
code1211 said:
I'm talking about your inability to link to the part of the Constitution that supports your fantasy based assertion.

You are free to proceed which will require an excursion into the real world. Good luck trodding this unfamiliar territory.
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are you new here? i quoted our Second Amendment. We should have no security problems in our free States.
 
danielpalos said:
are you new here? i quoted our Second Amendment. We should have no security problems in our free States.
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The post to which I responded included a reference to the 2nd Amendment, but not a quote of it.

Perhaps you posted this earlier in the thread...
 
code1211 said:
The post to which I responded included a reference to the 2nd Amendment, but not a quote of it.

Perhaps you posted this earlier in the thread...
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It is well regulated militia of the whole and entire People, that are declared Necessary; not the unorganized militia of the while and entire People.
 
danielpalos said:
No, it isn't. The People are the Militia.
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Are you saying that every individual is part of the militia or are you saying that the people in the second amendment refers to the militia?
 
danielpalos said:
We have a Second Amendment. We should have, no security problems in our free States.
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That is like saying if you have universal healthcare then nobody should get sick.
 
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