Child Support Payback

[vegas giants]

No need to run from the non-existent.

It is invisible...you wrote no question. :lamo

Yes post #163 has no question. Of course it doesn't. Well it does but it is invisible to you. LOL

 

[vegas giants]

Again, prove that he chose not to be involved at all.

What is best for children and men and women is to have children together, planned for, and to either raise their children together or have a plan that incorporates a way they both agree on to take care of the needs, both financial and psychological, growth, of the child. What you are advocating for is simply what you think is best for men who simply don't want to take responsibility for their choice to have sex with someone they were not ready to have a child with, despite the potential for that outcome.

If he opts out prior to viability by notifying the court that should be legal. You are advocating rewarding the irresponsible decision for a woman to have a child she can not afford. That is not best for the woman, child or the man

 

[roguenuke]

If he opts out prior to viability by notifying the court that should be legal. You are advocating rewarding the irresponsible decision for a woman to have a child she can not afford. That is not best for the woman, child or the man

I don't feel that you are being genuine here. What is best for the woman and the child could be to have the child and an expectation that the father have some involvement. This can come from simply the father feeling that being required to pay child support means they should have involvement.

 

[vegas giants]

I don't feel that you are being genuine here. What is best for the woman and the child could be to have the child and an expectation that the father have some involvement. This can come from simply the father feeling that being required to pay child support means they should have involvement.

What is best is when someone wants to be a father.... not when he is forced into it

 

[Lursa]

I don't feel that you are being genuine here. What is best for the woman and the child could be to have the child and an expectation that the father have some involvement. This can come from simply the father feeling that being required to pay child support means they should have involvement.

And not all women believe in abortion.

 

[Lursa]

What is best is when someone wants to be a father.... not when he is forced into it

Well then cash is 2nd best...and the state and the taxpayers are good with that.

Besides, you keep saying it's only about the $.

 

[roguenuke]

And not all women believe in abortion.

I personally view abortion as being a necessary evil, not something that is beneficial to women in most cases but necessary and only right considering my view on actual bodily autonomy. Bodily autonomy though has zero to do with being "forced" to pay for things that you may not feel you should have to pay for.

What would be the difference between forcing mothers to pay back fathers who pay child support because those fathers didn't want to have children but the mother had a choice and having mothers, by default, pay back taxpayers for providing public schooling to their children? Afterall, mothers could have chosen to simply have an abortion so that others wouldn't have to pay for her child's education.

 

[roguenuke]

What is best is when someone wants to be a father.... not when he is forced into it

No one forced him to have sex.

 

[Lursa]

I personally view abortion as being a necessary evil, not something that is beneficial to women in most cases but necessary and only right considering my view on actual bodily autonomy. Bodily autonomy though has zero to do with being "forced" to pay for things that you may not feel you should have to pay for.

What would be the difference between forcing mothers to pay back fathers who pay child support because those fathers didn't want to have children but the mother had a choice and having mothers, by default, pay back taxpayers for providing public schooling to their children? Afterall, mothers could have chosen to simply have an abortion so that others wouldn't have to pay for her child's education.

Once there is a child...the available parents should contribute all they can and remove any burden possible from the taxpayers. If there's restructuring of that, I dont think I see a problem.

 

[roguenuke]

Once there is a child...the available parents should contribute all they can and remove any burden possible from the taxpayers. If there's restructuring of that, I dont think I see a problem.

But the burden is assumed, from this thread topic at least, to be placed solely on the mother due to her choice of whether she had an abortion or not. Since the OP and those who support this proposal are not also even attempting to suggest that mothers (or even parents if joint decision to raise child) should also pay back society for her child's education (or any other accepted assistance from taxpayers) after her child is grown, then it is evident that their actual concern is just for fathers who don't want to take responsibility for their own actions or complaints against prochoice being available for mothers as a decision for her child, rather than actual concern of fairness to any particular party.

Now, I realize that you are not personally supporting the proposition of this thread. Personally, I don't think it is reasonable at all to expect anyone to pay back money (directly) that they used from government assistance programs or even for public education. Everyone benefits in many different ways from pooling of taxes to be used for programs that may only seem to be benefiting a specific group, such as public education. Fathers who choose to be absent in fact can benefit from providing support for their children, even if they do not recognize it directly. Just as taxpayers benefit from child support provided by the parents rather than government assistance programs.

 

[vegas giants]

Well then cash is 2nd best...and the state and the taxpayers are good with that.

Besides, you keep saying it's only about the $.

The state and the tax payers were quite good with other civil rights violations in the past. And then things changed

 

[vegas giants]

No one forced him to have sex.

Well some are. But if she was not forced to have sex she then needs to be responsible for her choices

 

[vegas giants]

And not all women believe in abortion.

Not all men believe in paying for 18 years for something they do not want and there was a legal remedy out of

 

[Lursa]

The state and the tax payers were quite good with other civil rights violations in the past. And then things changed

And yet..this isnt a civil rights issue. Just using the word 'equality' to mask a much less noble argument doesnt make it one.

 

[Bodi]

The same exact could and should be said for men. If they don't want to be paying child support, they should not be having sex with women they are not married to. (Of course, we all know that even this is no guarantee to be raising a child as a single mother or father or paying child support.)

Thank you for making my point. Consrnt to sex is not consent to parenthood.

 

[Lursa]

Not all men believe in paying for 18 years for something they do not want and there was a legal remedy out of

Do all men have to take that risk?

Is it mandatory? Imposed on them by women? The state? Anyone?

Or did they choose that risk, knowing the possible conseqeunces?

 

[Bodi]

And yet..this isnt a civil rights issue. Just using the word 'equality' to mask a much less noble argument doesnt make it one.

We are using facts... equal laws.

You are using rmotions... noble..

 

[vegas giants]

Do all men have to take that risk?

Is it mandatory? Imposed on them by women? The state? Anyone?

Or did they choose that risk, knowing the possible conseqeunces?

Are you asking a question? Are we allowed to do that here and expect answers? Because I certainly never got one

 

[Lursa]

Thank you for making my point. Consrnt to sex is not consent to parenthood.

Uh, the same has been stated in all these threads by many different people...what makes hers different?

 

[Bodi]

Are you asking a question? Are we allowed to do that here and expect answers? Because I certainly never got one

I think she is asking six of them...

 

[Lursa]

Are you asking a question? Are we allowed to do that here and expect answers? Because I certainly never got one

Oh no, they're rhetorical, that should be obvious.

 

[Bodi]

Uh, the same has been stated in all these threads by many different people...what makes hers different?

Maybe she will understand it while the others don't?

 

[vegas giants]

I think she is asking six of them...

I wonder if she thinks sex is consent to parenthood? I guess we will never know. LOL

 

[vegas giants]

Oh no, they're rhetorical, that should be obvious.

Oh good. Then I will be sure to ignore them. LOL

 

[Lursa]

We are using facts... equal laws.

You are using rmotions... noble..

"Using" a highly sophisticated and moral concept for lesser purposes is clearly a bottom of the barrel attempt at emotional manipulation.