Building 7 . . .

[camlok]

Re: High School Teacher BUTCHERS NIST WTC 7 Report

How did they prep CD without any one noticing?

Debunking the 9/11 Myths: Special Report - The Planes

As Col Nelson, USAF said,

"yet not one piece of hard aircraft evidence has been produced in an attempt to positively identify any of the four aircraft. On the contrary, it seems only that all potential evidence was deliberately kept hidden from public view. The hard evidence would have included hundreds of critical time-change aircraft items, plus security videotapes that were confiscated by the FBI immediately following each tragic episode."

 

[mike2810]

Re: High School Teacher BUTCHERS NIST WTC 7 Report

Your attempts to illustrate yourself as a knowledgeable, informed person are so lame, mike.

Perhaps when you learn how to spell, when you learn how to properly quote a source, when you can provide one speck of evidence for the nutty conspiracy theory you support, we can chat.

Your sole purpose is one of distraction. Show NIST's proof that the molten iron flowing out of WTC2 was aluminum.

Actual camlok. your response shows you have nothing of value to offer.

Thanks for not playing.

(ps. quit trolling or I will report it).

 

[beefheart]

Re: High School Teacher BUTCHERS NIST WTC 7 Report

As Col Nelson, USAF said,

"yet not one piece of hard aircraft evidence has been produced in an attempt to positively identify any of the four aircraft. On the contrary, it seems only that all potential evidence was deliberately kept hidden from public view. The hard evidence would have included hundreds of critical time-change aircraft items, plus security videotapes that were confiscated by the FBI immediately following each tragic episode."

You have provided no evidence.

16 years of nothing.

How did they prep the building with CD without anyone noticing?

You fail to answer that, don't you?

 

[zyzygy]

Re: High School Teacher BUTCHERS NIST WTC 7 Report

As Col Nelson, USAF said,

"yet not one piece of hard aircraft evidence has been produced in an attempt to positively identify any of the four aircraft. On the contrary, it seems only that all potential evidence was deliberately kept hidden from public view. The hard evidence would have included hundreds of critical time-change aircraft items, plus security videotapes that were confiscated by the FBI immediately following each tragic episode."

How were the buildings prepped for cd without anyone noticing and what were the four aircraft if they were not the aircraft from the official report? If they were not then what happened to the passengers?

 

[beefheart]

Re: High School Teacher BUTCHERS NIST WTC 7 Report

As Col Nelson, USAF said,

"yet not one piece of hard aircraft evidence has been produced in an attempt to positively identify any of the four aircraft. On the contrary, it seems only that all potential evidence was deliberately kept hidden from public view. The hard evidence would have included hundreds of critical time-change aircraft items, plus security videotapes that were confiscated by the FBI immediately following each tragic episode."

All kinds of pieces of the plane were found and photographed and verified.

Fact is that you refuse to accept any evidence that doesn't fit your pre-concieved conclusions.

BTW, what is your scientific background?


I'm done asking you questions, you won't answer. Oh well.

 

[zyzygy]

Re: High School Teacher BUTCHERS NIST WTC 7 Report

All kinds of pieces of the plane were found and photographed and verified.

Fact is that you refuse to accept any evidence that doesn't fit your pre-concieved conclusions.

BTW, what is your scientific background?


I'm done asking you questions, you won't answer. Oh well.

Obviously he has no answers, only his cult's meaningless party line. We tried.

 

[beefheart]

Re: High School Teacher BUTCHERS NIST WTC 7 Report

As Col Nelson, USAF said,

"yet not one piece of hard aircraft evidence has been produced in an attempt to positively identify any of the four aircraft. On the contrary, it seems only that all potential evidence was deliberately kept hidden from public view. The hard evidence would have included hundreds of critical time-change aircraft items, plus security videotapes that were confiscated by the FBI immediately following each tragic episode."

Colonel Nelson was the character on My Dream of Jeannie

 

[CaptainCourtesy]

Re: High School Teacher BUTCHERS NIST WTC 7 Report

Colonel Nelson was the character on My Dream of Jeannie

That's MAJOR Nelson.

 

[Thoreau72]

Re: High School Teacher BUTCHERS NIST WTC 7 Report

There is nothing obvious about your logic. You are off on some tangent that only you seem to understand.

I just read your most excellent post on the thread regarding Conscientious Objector status regarding your most excellent advice to your son. The logic you used in forming your advice to him was based on your experience and older age. He now, after the fact, understands and respects your logic.

This same general process can be applied to the analysis of the official story regarding 911, of which we post.

You might have missed it earlier, but with certain questions, I actually bought into the official story for a number of years. I bought into the official logic. On the internet, I did try to defend it, but the more I learned about what REALLY happened, or DID NOT really happen, the more difficult it became to try to defend the record.

So any man like you who provides such advice as you did to your son has my respect and admiration.

That said, you need to inform yourself about what really happened, what did not happen, the laws of physics, and why the attacks of 911 were staged. eace

You can lead a horse to water, but you cannot make him drink. You can lead a man to knowledge, but you cannot make him think.

 

[Thoreau72]

Re: High School Teacher BUTCHERS NIST WTC 7 Report

All kinds of pieces of the plane were found and photographed and verified.

Fact is that you refuse to accept any evidence that doesn't fit your pre-concieved conclusions.

BTW, what is your scientific background?


I'm done asking you questions, you won't answer. Oh well.

Show us dude, where all kinds of pieces of the airplane were found, verified and photographed. Your statement above is inaccurate, and all things considered, a bluff.

The various airplane parts were NEVER made available to the public for examination. Never. Not even 10 years later when the NY authorities found the other pieces of the flap tracks and parts at Burlington Coat Factory, where the other piece was found early on.

You're bluffing Beef, again.

 

[beefheart]

Re: High School Teacher BUTCHERS NIST WTC 7 Report

That's MAJOR Nelson.

Yeah, but he got promoted later when they made a TV movie about it.

 

[beefheart]

Re: High School Teacher BUTCHERS NIST WTC 7 Report

Show us dude, where all kinds of pieces of the airplane were found, verified and photographed. Your statement above is inaccurate, and all things considered, a bluff.

The various airplane parts were NEVER made available to the public for examination. Never. Not even 10 years later when the NY authorities found the other pieces of the flap tracks and parts at Burlington Coat Factory, where the other piece was found early on.

You're bluffing Beef, again.

All kinds of pictures of pieces of the airplanes. Popular Mechanics has it.

Do some research instead of asking others to do it for you.

 

[zyzygy]

Re: High School Teacher BUTCHERS NIST WTC 7 Report

All kinds of pictures of pieces of the airplanes. Popular Mechanics has it.

Do some research instead of asking others to do it for you.

They never address the point about the passengers. If they were not the planes of the official report then what happened to the passengers? They refuse to answer the important questions.

 

[zyzygy]

Re: High School Teacher BUTCHERS NIST WTC 7 Report

IMAGINE, for a moment that the awful terrorist attacks of September 11, 2001, were in fact a conspiracy. That they were an inside job.
Imagine that the Twin Towers were detonated rather than just fell. Imagine that the Twin Towers had been deliberately wired up for destruction and collapsed from the top down, even though buildings wired for demolition always collapse from the bottom.
Now imagine the legions of people who would’ve had to spend months, completely undetected, concealing tonnes of explosives in the two towers to generate enough explosive force to take down both buildings. Imagine those people performing this sinister covert work despite the security and sniffer dogs which had been permanently stationed on site ever since the Trade Center truck bombing in 1993.
Keep imagining. Imagine that the plane which struck the Pentagon was, as some claim, a missile. Overlook the fact that a hijacked civilian aircraft, which was clearly visible on the radar at the Pentagon, completely disappeared off the radar right at the moment the Pentagon was impacted by the ‘missile’.
9/11 conspiracy theories are all wrong | thermite, explosion theories

 

[zyzygy]

Re: High School Teacher BUTCHERS NIST WTC 7 Report

WHY DID BUILDING 7 COLLAPSE?

There’s a popular clip that shows building 7 falling down like a controlled demolition. It’s a very useful piece of propaganda for truthers. It’s unfortunate that more people haven’t seen the full, unedited video in which you can see the penthouse on top of the building collapsing first (also notice that you don’t hear an explosion). That is not what you would expect if it were a controlled demolition.

According to dozens of firefighters and witnesses, the building looked completely different on the other side. Debris from the two towers crushed parts of WTC 7 all the way up to the 40th floor, and half the building was ablaze. Even then it didn’t collapse. Firefighters might have saved this building, but water lines broke so the fire burned uncontrolled for 7 hours. Because of concern that the building might collapse, firefighters pulled out. An hour and a half later, it fell. The NIST Report explains in detail how this happened.
I Was a 9/11 Truther | Southern Skeptic

 

[stundie]

Re: High School Teacher BUTCHERS NIST WTC 7 Report

columns inward. Eventually they snapped and the upper floors came crashing down.

Which columns? Do you mean 79??

All of this is explained in this video.



WHY DID BUILDING 7 COLLAPSE?

There’s a popular clip that shows building 7 falling down like a controlled demolition. It’s a very useful piece of propaganda for truthers. It’s unfortunate that more people haven’t seen the full, unedited video in which you can see the penthouse on top of the building collapsing first (also notice that you don’t hear an explosion). That is not what you would expect if it were a controlled demolition.

According to dozens of firefighters and witnesses, the building looked completely different on the other side. Debris from the two towers crushed parts of WTC 7 all the way up to the 40th floor, and half the building was ablaze. Even then it didn’t collapse. Firefighters might have saved this building, but water lines broke so the fire burned uncontrolled for 7 hours. Because of concern that the building might collapse, firefighters pulled out. An hour and a half later, it fell. The NIST Report explains in detail how this happened.
I Was a 9/11 Truther | Southern Skeptic

So you're evidence is an opinion from someone who was once a truther?

Why don't you or the southern skeptic show these dozen of fires firefighters and witnesses??

WTC 5 & 6 had larger fires in relation to their size, they burned for much longer than 7 hours and they also suffered significantly more damage than the WTC 7 due to them being much closer to WTC 1 & 2, yet they didn't collapse.

So the argument that the WTC 7 was damaged and had unfought fires for 7 hours is just a statement of facts, it is not evidence or proof that these were what brought the towers down.

 

[zyzygy]

Re: High School Teacher BUTCHERS NIST WTC 7 Report

Perhaps stundie can tell us how the buildings were prepped for cd without anyone noticing.

 

[zyzygy]

Re: High School Teacher BUTCHERS NIST WTC 7 Report

An interview with an explosives expert.




Undicisettembre: In your opinion, would it be possible to prepare such big buildings for a controlled demolition without anyone noticing?

Brent Blanchard: To prepare those buildings for being demolished would take a lot of preparation. You would need a lot of people involved or you would need a few people for a very long time: weeks minimum, months probably. And they need direct access to the columns. They would not only need access to the buildings undetected but they would need access to the H-beams. They would need to do something to pre-weaken those flanges. There's work that needs to be done or the explosives just wouldn't work.

So you would need people to go inside the building for a long time, and people in the offices would obviously notice that there's something going on. You would also need all these people working on the columns – and witnesses - to stay completely silent about this for many years afterward and not tell anyone, not even their parents or their wife. Not even on their death bed.

Undicisettembre: If you actually had to demolish buildings like the Twin Towers, what kind of explosives would you use?

Brent Blanchard: You’d have to use something that causes the steel to fail: linear shaped charges, RDX materials, C4, very powerful high-velocity stuff.

I have heard thermite mentioned. That's not practical at all. Again you need a very, very high velocity, very strong military-grade explosive material.


Undicisettembre: Since you already mentioned thermite, let's proceed with this topic. What do you think of thermite? Is it even vaguely possible to demolish the Twin Towers and 7 World Trade Center with thermite?

Brent Blanchard: No. In explosive demolitions thermite is never used.

In order for thermite to work you have to have a release of the chemical and the chemical has to actually cause the steel to deteriorate. I don't how they think it can be done to an H-beam, or to any very thick steel beam. Thermite doesn't work horizontally, it works vertically. You can't cause thermite to cut horizontally through steel. You can't attach thermite to a bunch of columns, dozens and dozens of columns, and expect it to start cutting clean through all those columns at a predetermined time or especially finish at the same time. I don't understand how it can even theoretically occur. And it's never been articulately explained by the theorists.

Thermite folks just tend to assert that a bunch of guys went in there, put thermite on columns that happened to already be exposed, them somehow triggered it all, and the thermite somehow cut horizontally through a bunch of columns at the same time and caused the building to fail. That makes no sense whatsoever.

Thermite also burns very hot but very slow and it's uncontrolled. When you see tests for thermite you often see it burning on a steel plate, it creates a lot of fire and reaction, but none of these reactions were seen in the Twin Towers. And again, it doesn't burn horizontally through columns that are load bearers. I don't know how it can happen.

https://undicisettembre.blogspot.be/2014/10/an-interview-with-explosive-expert.html

 

[stundie]

Re: High School Teacher BUTCHERS NIST WTC 7 Report

Perhaps stundie can tell us how the buildings were prepped for cd without anyone noticing.

I can tell you lots of different ways to prep a building without anyone noticing.....

However, I can't prove any of it.

Besides, you clearly think that no explosives were needed to bring down WTC7, so by your own logic, only 1 explosive device could have been used and the building would still collapsed the way you think it did.

Unless you think by adding 1 explosive device would somehow prevent the building from collapsing the way it did?? lol

 

[zyzygy]

Re: High School Teacher BUTCHERS NIST WTC 7 Report

I can tell you lots of different ways to prep a building without anyone noticing.....

However, I can't prove any of it.

Besides, you clearly think that no explosives were needed to bring down WTC7, so by your own logic, only 1 explosive device could have been used and the building would still collapsed the way you think it did.

Unless you think by adding 1 explosive device would somehow prevent the building from collapsing the way it did?? lol

Your logic is not logical. One explosive device? I know why the buildings collapsed. It had something to do with huge planes with aviation fuel crashing into them. Tell me some of the ways it could have been done with nobody noticing. You don't have to prove it, just share with us. BTW, did you read the link I posted about the explosives expert? What are your qualifications in that field?

 

[stundie]

Re: High School Teacher BUTCHERS NIST WTC 7 Report

An interview with an explosives expert.




Undicisettembre: In your opinion, would it be possible to prepare such big buildings for a controlled demolition without anyone noticing?

Brent Blanchard: To prepare those buildings for being demolished would take a lot of preparation. You would need a lot of people involved or you would need a few people for a very long time: weeks minimum, months probably. And they need direct access to the columns. They would not only need access to the buildings undetected but they would need access to the H-beams. They would need to do something to pre-weaken those flanges. There's work that needs to be done or the explosives just wouldn't work.

So you would need people to go inside the building for a long time, and people in the offices would obviously notice that there's something going on. You would also need all these people working on the columns – and witnesses - to stay completely silent about this for many years afterward and not tell anyone, not even their parents or their wife. Not even on their death bed.

Undicisettembre: If you actually had to demolish buildings like the Twin Towers, what kind of explosives would you use?

Brent Blanchard: You’d have to use something that causes the steel to fail: linear shaped charges, RDX materials, C4, very powerful high-velocity stuff.

I have heard thermite mentioned. That's not practical at all. Again you need a very, very high velocity, very strong military-grade explosive material.


Undicisettembre: Since you already mentioned thermite, let's proceed with this topic. What do you think of thermite? Is it even vaguely possible to demolish the Twin Towers and 7 World Trade Center with thermite?

Brent Blanchard: No. In explosive demolitions thermite is never used.

In order for thermite to work you have to have a release of the chemical and the chemical has to actually cause the steel to deteriorate. I don't how they think it can be done to an H-beam, or to any very thick steel beam. Thermite doesn't work horizontally, it works vertically. You can't cause thermite to cut horizontally through steel. You can't attach thermite to a bunch of columns, dozens and dozens of columns, and expect it to start cutting clean through all those columns at a predetermined time or especially finish at the same time. I don't understand how it can even theoretically occur. And it's never been articulately explained by the theorists.

Thermite folks just tend to assert that a bunch of guys went in there, put thermite on columns that happened to already be exposed, them somehow triggered it all, and the thermite somehow cut horizontally through a bunch of columns at the same time and caused the building to fail. That makes no sense whatsoever.

Thermite also burns very hot but very slow and it's uncontrolled. When you see tests for thermite you often see it burning on a steel plate, it creates a lot of fire and reaction, but none of these reactions were seen in the Twin Towers. And again, it doesn't burn horizontally through columns that are load bearers. I don't know how it can happen.

https://undicisettembre.blogspot.be/2014/10/an-interview-with-explosive-expert.html

Brent Blanchard isn't an explosive expert as he has never demolished a building in his life. He documents demolitions with his company Protec and runs implosion World.

A critique of Blancahrd claims can be found here.

Reply to Brent Blanchard's 'A CRITICAL ANALYSIS OF THE COLLAPSE OF WTC TOWERS 1, 2 & 7'

Besides, Danny Jowenko was under no illusion that the WTC 7 was demolished and so is Torin Wolf. They both have actual hands on demolition experience.

And more importantly, Jon Cole blows the whole thermite burns slowly argument as demonstrated in this backyard experiment.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qamecech9m4

Thermite is cutting the columns very quickly here.

 

[zyzygy]

Re: High School Teacher BUTCHERS NIST WTC 7 Report

Brent Blanchard isn't an explosive expert as he has never demolished a building in his life. He documents demolitions with his company Protec and runs implosion World.

A critique of Blancahrd claims can be found here.

Reply to Brent Blanchard's 'A CRITICAL ANALYSIS OF THE COLLAPSE OF WTC TOWERS 1, 2 & 7'

Besides, Danny Jowenko was under no illusion that the WTC 7 was demolished and so is Torin Wolf. They both have actual hands on demolition experience.

And more importantly, Jon Cole blows the whole thermite burns slowly argument as demonstrated in this backyard experiment.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qamecech9m4

Thermite is cutting the columns very quickly here.

How were the buildings prepped for cd without anyone noticing? The critique from the biased ct site does not mention it. You said you know of some ways. Elucidate please.

 

[zyzygy]

Re: High School Teacher BUTCHERS NIST WTC 7 Report

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qamecech9m4

And there isn't a single piece of steel seen in the debris or recovered steel which shows any sign of having been cut by either of these materials. There was cutting with lances in the clean up. And there are photos of steel being cut as well as afterwards... such as the Steven Jones...(fake) diagonal cut column which started the entire nonsense. Rather than retract his error... he never did.... he disappeared and came up with a new (and completely unfounded) theory of nano thermite... which turns out to be nothing but paint on the steel. No one has repeated the Harrit-Jones study and Millette has determined the red gray chips to be primer paint.

But none of the rational reasons why NT is bunk will deter those who believe it. Jon Cole proves nothing that wasn't already known... thermite burns hot enough to melt steel.

https://www.metabunk.org/nanothermite-vs-thermite-thermate-for-cutting-thick-steel.t2873/page-7

 

[Deuce]

Re: High School Teacher BUTCHERS NIST WTC 7 Report

Who was charged with "fully investigating" all these things? Show us NIST's studies.

The burden rests on you to prove your assertions. You claim you have spectrographic analysis proving it's steel, show it to me.

 

[stundie]

Re: High School Teacher BUTCHERS NIST WTC 7 Report

Your logic is not logical.

It is very logical....

One explosive device?

No, I think there was more than one but seeing as you think none were needed, then I could argue that only one was needed.

I know why the buildings collapsed.

No you don't, you think you know. You have no idea how they actually collapsed and have no more evidence than the conspiracy theorists you attempt to mock.

It had something to do with huge planes with aviation fuel crashing into them.

WTC 7 didn't have any huge planes with aviation fuel crashing into them.

Tell me some of the ways it could have been done with nobody noticing.

Let see.....

It could have been bought in by 1 person, over a period of months, with the devices disguised as security cameras or network routers or any other device that wouldn't look too out of place in the building.

It could have been brought in by a team of people over a period of days who were disguised as maintenance and placed in areas which are covered by suspended ceilings or where the buildings wiring channels run, you know areas which aren't visible to most of the people who work there.

You don't have to prove it, just share with us.

I know I don't have to prove it because I'm not claiming that this is how it was done.

You seem to think it would be impossible to place them into the building without anyone knowing and what I am saying is that argument is bull**** because there are lots of ways it could have been done without anyone knowing.

BTW, did you read the link I posted about the explosives expert?

I did and Blanchard talks nonsense.

What are your qualifications in that field?

None whatsoever. But if we are talking his expertise over lets say mine, I'll take Danny Jowenko and Torin Wolfs expertise over his seeing as they have real life experience in demolitions. not just documenting them.

However, I leave those who have to "appeal to authority" to it really, it's not an argument I would make, seeing as those desperate enough to have to use them to bolster there argument or point, don't really have one.